Canadian Pairs - Short

[Ladskater]

I thought Davison & Dube did an excellent job for their first time at the Olympics. It's great to see such a talented new Canadian pair developing.

Marcoux and Buntin need better music. That music was okay for Canadians, but they really need a better program for the Olympics. It was a little hokey. I don't think they pulled it off as well as they did at Canadians. I hope their free skate is better.

 

[JOHIO2]

Thought both pairs did well, considering the limited international experience. Who'da thunk they'd be 10 and 11 after the short program???

Good job all around....

OOPs- edited to show the correct placements. Can we change Hinzman and Parchem's 13 to twelve???? (don't they wish)

 

[Shmuzzy]

Thought both pairs did well, considering the limited international experience. Who'da thunk they'd be 10 and 12 after the short program???

Good job all around....

Actually Jessica and Bryce are 11th.
Anytime you skate a personal best at the Olympics you gotta love it!

 

[boggartlaura]

I thought D/D were m,uch better than M/B, who are overrated IMO.

 

[Saundy]

Thought both pairs did well, considering the limited international experience. Who'da thunk they'd be 10 and 12 after the short program???

Good job all around....

Well M&B DO have alot of international experiance. They got 2 bronze medals on the Grand Prix circuit this year and have been around for quite some time.

However, I thought that they could have done ALOT better than they did.
I was pleasantly surprised by D&B. I was expecting them to be lower than that. Should be interesting to see how they end up after the long.

 

[geoskate]

I agree with Saundy that Marcoux/Buntin could have skated much better than they did. They seem to still have trouble with nerves when the pressure is on (him especially). They were just slightly off overall. Their throws, when they are on, are wonderful, but today the throw wasn't so wonderful. The jumps were not too much of a surprise, since they often have problems with them. Their lifts are usually great, but even that wasn't quite as good as usual.

For Dube/Davison, however, I think that was the best overall skate I have seen from them. Their short program at Canadians was cleaner, but I think they had more speed and expression in this short program. That is quite an achievement to skate like that at the Olympics, since they are just up out of the junior ranks and don't yet have much senior experience.

 

[Ryan O]

M&B's short progam music is actually quite a good choice. It's very fun and jazzy and they normally get into it, although tonight they were off. Their LP is also pretty good and is quite lyrical and beautiful in places. They beat the World Champions with it in Paris on the GP earlier this year! They do need to improve in several areas though it is true.

 

[Ladskater]

M&B's short progam music is actually quite a good choice. It's very fun and jazzy and they normally get into it, although tonight they were off. Their LP is also pretty good and is quite lyrical and beautiful in places. They beat the World Champions with it in Paris on the GP earlier this year! They do need to improve in several areas though it is true.

I don't agree about their musical choice for their short. It might be good for a show, but not competition. They need to broaden their horizons a little bit musically. "Hey Big Spender" just does not do it for me. It sounds - at least this rendition - like a jr. level choice. Does not fit in with the "big guns." Come on Val and Craig - let's take it up a notch!!!!

 

[Jaana]

I don´t think that I have seen the skating of Dube/Davison earlier, but really enjoyed it and their wonderful enthusiasm very much. They sure looked like they love to perform on the ice together.

 

[iluvtodd]

I'm very disappointed that NBC didn't show the Canadian pairs at all! I particularly wanted to see Dube & Davison who were SO impressive at Skate America (saw them in practice there & live during the free skate).

 

[JOHIO2]

The biggest bummer is the IOC rules that prevent sharing vids on the internet. Since this was already broadcast, there are plenty of fans who have captured the programs and would have posted them online, but can't. (at least not now.)

 

[rain]

I commented on the Canadians in the pairs thread a little, but I'll expand here.

First, I totally agree with you Ladskater on M/B's music. From the first time I heard it I kind of cringed. Just too cheesy to really be taken seriously. At Canadians they had a much better performance and SOLD it, which they didn't here so it worked a little better, but still a poor music choice IMO. I thought they could have finished behind D/D here as they had several small visible mistakes. In the AMAZINGLY clean short competition here it put them in 10th, and rightfully so, I think. Had they had the performance they showed at nationals, they could have been around 5-6 place. I watched CBC's coverage first, then NBC's and the only pair I didn't see was O/S.

As for D/D - love them. I think they are the future of Canadian pairs. They totally and impressively looked like they belonged out there in the seniors field, in spite of the fact this is really their first big time senior international. They rose to the Olympic pressure rather than buckling under it — a feat, I think, in spite of the fact that they really had no expectations on them coming in. What I think is really their only "weak" element, is the double twist - they need to get more height etc, but they are on the right track. I'd love to see them move into the top 10, which I think is possible. I expect less clean performances in the long than we saw in the short. Upon reflection, one of the things that really impresses me about D/D is their "pairness." Even at this young age they have a moves-as-one quality and awareness of each other on the ice that is akin to what makes the Russians stand out currently.

 

[dorispulaski]

No They couldn't

First off, M&B came in 3rd to T&M and Pang&Tong in the SP and also in the LP at TEB. So they never beat the 2005 champions. They scored 58.44 points. They got a level 3 for their steps there (only level 2 from the Olympics caller), but only a level 3 for their lift (vs level 4 from the Olympic caller). Everything else was called the same. So if you give them an extra .5 for the more generous lift call, and leave the steps at level 3, they still would only have 58.94, still behind O&S.

To finish 6th they would have to pass I&B, S&S, O&S and Zagorska&Siudek.

So, No they couldn't have finished better than 9th. You need to see O&S's program, which was 8th. It was exactly the same, or nearly so, to the way that they skated at Euros. It wasn't that O&S were bad, it was that S&S were still better artistically, and that I&B were hugely better technically. In fact I&B's TES was 35.53, second only to Totmianina and Marinin's TES of 35.93.

I understand that CBC did not broadcast I&B's program. When it becomes available, you should get a tape copy from someone. It's only weakness is that the choreo is way too bare to make room for the throw triple axel. They made major changes to their program since 4C's, and changed it again this week.

For M&B to have moved up, they would have had to have done different tricks or had a more interesting, less dated program. Their program was very Kat Witt from the '80's.

 

[Ryan O]

First off, M&B came in 3rd to T&M and Pang&Tong in the SP and also in the LP at TEB. So they never beat the 2005 champions.

M&B beat T&M in one of the marks in the long progam in Paris - I believe it was the technical mark. I didn't mean they beat them overall. I should have been more specific, sorry. There was some commentary about them getting the highest score at the time and it has also been mentioned in newspaper articles.

 

[jayta]

It's all about opinions and perspective. Some say this program is way better and some say that one. I personally am not a big fan of M&B but I can see how they managed to get the marks that they did. They were solid in all of their elements and strong in them. They may have had one or two mistakes, but nothing hugely major - other than the touch down which they got deducted for.

I don't know why it seems that there is a huge hate on for them. Or at least a big dislike. I'm no fan by far, but I can give credit where credit is due and they were the top Canadians in the pairs event at Nationals and they just narrowly surpassed D&D.

I think we should be a lot more supportive than trying to tear our athletes down. They have worked HARD to get here and saying this kind of stuff for any of the athletes is a disservice to them.

As for the judging, we all have to admit there is STILL a margin for human error or opinion. You will NEVER get rid of that. And you can't call it corruption. I mean, I just think sometimes you have to accept that judging competitions by human judges will always have a margin for artistic and technical opinion. I mean look at us posters. We don't agree all the time at how a performance ran. Some say it was excellent, another says it was average.

All of our opinions end up being biased - slanted by one thing or another. Nothing is completely objective. We're human, not machines.

 

[dorispulaski]

Well, it's not us that need to reevaluate M&B's programs. It's M&B and their coaches and choreographers.

A case to compare to is I&B. After skating what was their personal best SP at 4C's (and winning that segment), they said they realized that there was no way, even skating their programs perfectly, that they could place better than 7th, at the very best at Worlds or Olympics. They said that it was part of a reassessment of why their showings were always mediocre when they felt they had it in them to do better.

So they went back to the drawing board and completely redid their SP. And it resulted in them finishing ahead of M&B, O&S and Zagorska & Siudek and Savchenko and Szolkowy at Olympics, all of whom almost always beat I&B. They still have more work to do. They need to add more transitions. But the result was they upped their personal best in the SP by about 4 points.

If M&B are planning to stay in the sport, and to stay ahead of D&D, they need to do a similar reassessment.

And I don't hate their LP: I dislike their SP. Last year I hated I&B's SP, that 80ish techno Firebird. Teams can grow. And accepting criticism and scores is part of that growth.