Davis and Smolkin making move to IAM

[lariko]

The point is that Diana has THE MOTHER who is all-time ultimate villian of figure skating and who made women singles a joke. Who opelnly endroses russian government and is funded by them. And we all know that if it wasn't for the mother, Diana wouldn't be in the place she is now and even I can see that Gleb should skate with a partner whos skills would be comparable to his.
It's sad but it's always been all about politics and connections as it causes overscoring and unfair judging.
There is no fuss like this about Katia Kurakova who is polish citizen since 2019 because there are no negative connotations about her and she speaks polish on a native level and openly calls Poland her homeland. Don't know if DD/GS can speak or understand georgian.

The article calls out Lopareva by name, and twenty other Russian-born skaters who competed at Eu and Worlds with the journalists demanding the ISU's president to explain how this overrepresntation is allowed--despite all of them not skating for Russia, and that, BTW, includes Kurakova.

The article goes even further to call out Selevko, Sadovskii and Mikutina for not taking a stance against skaters born in Russia for competing for other countries. The journalists want Mikutina to be a hypocrite, apparently.

Criticizing ISU for not taking more decisive stance against athlete abuse in figure skating--great. But calling for ethnic cleansing of figure skating such as that no person born in Russia can be a part of ISU competitions is unacceptable. Hounding skaters because of their ethnicity is also unacceptable. Trying to determine how much and what exactly serves for a person to be 'forgiven' for being born in Russia is unacceptable.

I'm all for clearing the corruption in judging in ice dance from which imho Davis and Smolkin benefit--so that it is fair for all.

But I will also insist that nobody is punished when they are not doing what's acceptable for everyone else. If other skaters are allowed to skate for another country based on their partner's citizenship, so should be Gleb. If other skaters are allowed to skate for a country without submitting to a test for specific language proficiency, so should Diana and Gleb.

As a general principle, nobody should be condemned for who their parents are, or where they were born, or their ethnicity, or their language proficiency. Only their own wrongdoings count against them.

If Tutberidze's machinations one day catch up with her, I'll make popcorn.

 

[Karoltyna]

The article calls out Lopareva by name, and twenty other Russian-born skaters who competed at Eu and Worlds with the journalists demanding the ISU's president to explain how this overrepresntation is allowed--despite all of them not skating for Russia, and that, BTW, includes Kurakova.

The article goes even further to call out Selevko, Sadovskii and Mikutina for not taking a stance against skaters born in Russia for competing for other countries. The journalists want Mikutina to be a hypocrite, apparently.

Criticizing ISU for not taking more decisive stance against athlete abuse in figure skating--great. But calling for ethnic cleansing of figure skating such as that no person born in Russia can be a part of ISU competitions is unacceptable. Hounding skaters because of their ethnicity is also unacceptable. Trying to determine how much and what exactly serves for a person to be 'forgiven' for being born in Russia is unacceptable.

I'm all for clearing the corruption in judging in ice dance from which imho Davis and Smolkin benefit--so that it is fair for all.

But I will also insist that nobody is punished when they are not doing what's acceptable for everyone else. If other skaters are allowed to skate for another country based on their partner's citizenship, so should be Gleb. If other skaters are allowed to skate for a country without submitting to a test for specific language proficiency, so should Diana and Gleb.

As a general principle, nobody should be condemned for who their parents are, or where they were born, or their ethnicity, or their language proficiency. Only their own wrongdoings count against them.

If Tutberidze's machinations one day catch up with her, I'll make popcorn.

Yes, I agree with you, who are your parents and where are you from shouldn't matter. Yes, athlets are and should be allowed to switch country.
If I have a problem with russian skaters in other countries, it isn't political but because of how the national feds distribute money. It should be used to promote sport and fund training of inland athlets. I'm from Poland where in summer you can train figure skating on literally 3 or 4 icerinks (yes, for the whole country, about 38 milion citizens) and during the season you have to fight for ice hours with hockey players.
Our second entry to women singles at Euros finished penultimated and didn't get any GOE above 0,40. Not that didn't get used to it during last 20 years that were disastrous in polish figure skating but it gravely impacted the popularity of this sport in Poland.
Yes, we can pay for training of 10th best russian athlet who will probably land in first 10 at Euros and in first 15 at Worlds. But it shouldn't work like this. I simply don't believe that there aren't any girls and boys in Poland who if provided with proper training couldn't reach a decent level. But there is no complex training available for them. There are maybe 5 schools that have figure skating profile and can get about 8 hours of ice a week, rest are small clubs that get 3-4 hours of ice at municipal icerinks a week and provide a few hours off ice training and parents pay for it.
And I wrote it all being Kurakova's fan - because she came before the war as this 10th russian girl with no prospects in Russia but became truly polish and does the work to promote figure skating in Poland, including having masterclasses in these small clubs.

Other problem is Ukrainians trying to make everything what is going around about them, Russia and war, it worked well in 2022 but nit anymora, but here I won't elaborate as my boy has ukrainan children at school and after another hard schoolyear I can be biased and bitter.

You'll make popcorn, I'll bring polish wódka (russian is crap) and we'll celebrate.

 

[Diana Delafield]

The point is that Diana has THE MOTHER who is all-time ultimate villian of figure skating and who made women singles a joke. Who opelnly endroses russian government and is funded by them. And we all know that if it wasn't for the mother, Diana wouldn't be in the place she is now and even I can see that Gleb should skate with a partner whos skills would be comparable to his.
It's sad but it's always been all about politics and connections as it causes overscoring and unfair judging.
There is no fuss like this about Katia Kurakova who is polish citizen since 2019 because there are no negative connotations about her and she speaks polish on a native level and openly calls Poland her homeland. Don't know if DD/GS can speak or understand georgian.

Not disagreeing with you, just playing "devil's advocate" here. Having studied onomastics (the study of names) as a field of linguistics at grad school, I knew that Tutberidze is a Georgian surname. Wikipedia says that ET, although born in Moscow, is half Georgian, one-quarter Russian, and one-quarter Armenian. So it's possible the daughter does have some knowledge of the language.

 

[lariko]

Yes, I agree with you, who are your parents and where are you from shouldn't matter. Yes, athlets are and should be allowed to switch country.
If I have a problem with russian skaters in other countries, it isn't political but because of how the national feds distribute money. It should be used to promote sport and fund training of inland athlets. I'm from Poland where in summer you can train figure skating on literally 3 or 4 icerinks (yes, for the whole country, about 38 milion citizens) and during the season you have to fight for ice hours with hockey players.
Our second entry to women singles at Euros finished penultimated and didn't get any GOE above 0,40. Not that didn't get used to it during last 20 years that were disastrous in polish figure skating but it gravely impacted the popularity of this sport in Poland.
Yes, we can pay for training of 10th best russian athlet who will probably land in first 10 at Euros and in first 15 at Worlds. But it shouldn't work like this. I simply don't believe that there aren't any girls and boys in Poland who if provided with proper training couldn't reach a decent level. But there is no complex training available for them. There are maybe 5 schools that have figure skating profile and can get about 8 hours of ice a week, rest are small clubs that get 3-4 hours of ice at municipal icerinks a week and provide a few hours off ice training and parents pay for it.
And I wrote it all being Kurakova's fan - because she came before the war as this 10th russian girl with no prospects in Russia but became truly polish and does the work to promote figure skating in Poland, including having masterclasses in these small clubs.

Other problem is Ukrainians trying to make everything what is going around about them, Russia and war, it worked well in 2022 but nit anymora, but here I won't elaborate as my boy has ukrainan children at school and after another hard schoolyear I can be biased and bitter.

You'll make popcorn, I'll bring polish wódka (russian is crap) and we'll celebrate.

However, Davis is specifically half-Georgian, half-American girl, who trains in Canada. This is open competition, and any Federation would happily support home-grown talent if and when available. This, as the ISU Prsident said, is on the individual Feds, and it's a business decision. Barbora Vrankova went out of her way to represent her home country. I can't really see how Kurakova pushes out Streuli, or how Samodelkina is the reason why the Kazakhstan women couldn't secure TES for Worlds or burned the spots that Tursynbaeva had won. Gubanova opened spots at Euro for any other Georgian woman to join her. Zny time one shows up. The Feds are more than anyone else aware of who they have at home, and if there is a need to look elsewhere. RusFed now releases skaters who have citizenship other than Russian or who are requested by a partner, like Markelov or Volodin.

With Russian-born skaters, as singles or as a part of a partnership, some Feds might see their national flags raised at the competitions where they now only see Japanese and American ones. This would be a joint, concious choice by both the athlete and the Fed, and it is fully legal. Thus, to be respected. And when the flag flies, boys and girls at home tend to take interest in the sport too.

As an imigrant of 25 years, I would be quite overwrought if someone showed up in the office and demanded my employer to immediately terminate me because I wasn’t born in Canada, or because I have an accent. And, like, in Canada that would never-ever fly.

 

[Mathman]

On the issue of whether a national federation should commit scarce resources to imported foreign skaters, the situation may be different for ice dance and pairs than for singles skaters. A country might, for instance, have a really good girl but no loclally trained boy of the same caliber to form a contending team.

 

[4everchan]

There was quite a big controversy about Hungary bringing in a lot of Russians and neglecting the local talent.

 

[Weathergal]

Many good points being made here. It's certainly a slippery slope. Even if there weren't a ban, skaters would, of course, be switching countries, and some of the same issues would exist. It seems like a delicate balance for feds to grow skating in their country -- assuming that's their goal and not just accumulating medals at any cost - and use 'imported talent" as a springboard for "homegrown talent" to be inspired from and learned from so that eventually the fed won't have to rely on skaters who aren't from that country.

On a personal level, I do appreciate it - and find it easier to get behind - when skaters have at least some tie to the country (ex. Georgy Reviya has Georgian roots) and/or make an effort to learn the language and culture of the country, spend time there, etc. (ex. Ekaterina Kurakova).

 

[Skater Boy]

Yes, I agree with you, who are your parents and where are you from shouldn't matter. Yes, athlets are and should be allowed to switch country.
If I have a problem with russian skaters in other countries, it isn't political but because of how the national feds distribute money. It should be used to promote sport and fund training of inland athlets. I'm from Poland where in summer you can train figure skating on literally 3 or 4 icerinks (yes, for the whole country, about 38 milion citizens) and during the season you have to fight for ice hours with hockey players.
Our second entry to women singles at Euros finished penultimated and didn't get any GOE above 0,40. Not that didn't get used to it during last 20 years that were disastrous in polish figure skating but it gravely impacted the popularity of this sport in Poland.
Yes, we can pay for training of 10th best russian athlet who will probably land in first 10 at Euros and in first 15 at Worlds. But it shouldn't work like this. I simply don't believe that there aren't any girls and boys in Poland who if provided with proper training couldn't reach a decent level. But there is no complex training available for them. There are maybe 5 schools that have figure skating profile and can get about 8 hours of ice a week, rest are small clubs that get 3-4 hours of ice at municipal icerinks a week and provide a few hours off ice training and parents pay for it.
And I wrote it all being Kurakova's fan - because she came before the war as this 10th russian girl with no prospects in Russia but became truly polish and does the work to promote figure skating in Poland, including having masterclasses in these small clubs.

Other problem is Ukrainians trying to make everything what is going around about them, Russia and war, it worked well in 2022 but nit anymora, but here I won't elaborate as my boy has ukrainan children at school and after another hard schoolyear I can be biased and bitter.

You'll make popcorn, I'll bring polish wódka (russian is crap) and we'll celebrate.

I am not sure what this has to do with D/S and moreover some of the comments are more political or not creating a peaceful environment I am not sure i like skaters changing nations like dying their hair. The Reeds could make some immigration lawyers very happy. But in respect to D/S I will be very interested to see what MFD and Patrice do with them. How will they be packaged and how can they impre those skating skills.

 

[Karoltyna]

There was quite a big controversy about Hungary bringing in a lot of Russians and neglecting the local talent.

And one od theris fed's officials was forced to resign. I read his interviews at fs-gossip, it was disgusting.

 

[Karoltyna]

However, Davis is specifically half-Georgian, half-American girl, who trains in Canada. This is open competition, and any Federation would happily support home-grown talent if and when available. This, as the ISU Prsident said, is on the individual Feds, and it's a business decision. Barbora Vrankova went out of her way to represent her home country. I can't really see how Kurakova pushes out Streuli, or how Samodelkina is the reason why the Kazakhstan women couldn't secure TES for Worlds or burned the spots that Tursynbaeva had won. Gubanova opened spots at Euro for any other Georgian woman to join her. Zny time one shows up. The Feds are more than anyone else aware of who they have at home, and if there is a need to look elsewhere. RusFed now releases skaters who have citizenship other than Russian or who are requested by a partner, like Markelov or Volodin.

With Russian-born skaters, as singles or as a part of a partnership, some Feds might see their national flags raised at the competitions where they now only see Japanese and American ones. This would be a joint, concious choice by both the athlete and the Fed, and it is fully legal. Thus, to be respected. And when the flag flies, boys and girls at home tend to take interest in the sport too.

As an imigrant of 25 years, I would be quite overwrought if someone showed up in the office and demanded my employer to immediately terminate me because I wasn’t born in Canada, or because I have an accent. And, like, in Canada that would never-ever fly.

The thing is that Kurakova can't push out any girl in Poland because there is no girl to push. She secured the second spot at Euros, we sent our second best girl Laura Szczęsna and Magda Tascher's reactions during her free skate summs up the state of polish figure skating perfectly. I don't think Streuli will be significant in european skating, not after what I saw at JWC. Maybe Zariana Zapolska in 3-4 years, but more probably someone like Emma Kulig, U-9 nat champion. She just went to Slovakia in search for available ice nad her mother is trying fundraising. In men's singles it's that bad that a coach told me that if my 9yo who trains martial arts and could be a decent musician if he had patience to train, started training seriously this season, he could probably podium at our senior nationals in a few years. I was at this year's Walley Spring Cup in Cracow and I agree, he could be top figure skater in Poland, there is no real competition, but I won't let my boy go there.

But my point was that DD/GS wouldn't cause such controversy if it wasn't for Diana's mother. Previously there were really nasty rumors about the reasons Diana married Gleb and then that Georgians let her start because her mother trains Egadze. It's sure she will suffer beceause of the mother for the rest of her carrier and many people will never see her as her own person, only as Eteri's daughter. I feel truly sorry for her.

 

[Jeanie19]

I don't feel sorry for Diana because she has benefited from her mothers influence.

And I don't care if skaters change citizenship. But its unfair to just talk about the Russians. Mark Gronkowski , Canadian skating for Israel, Deanna US to Canada, Piper US to Canada, Corey switching to Italy, the list goes on and on.

 

[GGFan]

I have been no fan of the Russian government's actions but that has zero to do with Russian individuals. From my perspective the only reason that the extreme step of banning Russian athletes was taken was because of the very close link between the government and sport in Russia (funding, propaganda, etc.). To the extent that someone is not receiving funding from the government or representing them I have no issue. I'm still rooting for the Russian players on the NY Rangers and Russian tennis players. I don't get this need to somehow wipe out all traces of Russia from the sport.

I have no problem with athletes switching countries since I feel bad when talented people can't compete at the Olympics. I do feel bad for folks who are not as lucky in terms of being able to move somewhere else or learn another language if that becomes necessary.

My problem with the I AM D/S marriage is the politics and the fear that this is cementing the return of 90s ice dance. I have loved I AM's work but their rising political clout along with some questionable judging calls at the last two Worlds have left me feeling queasy. Put that together with Eteri's political shenanigans in singles and you have the set up for something crazy like D/S being on the podium at the Olympics in 2026 without visible improvements. I'm hoping for the best but preparing myself for the worst . . .

 

[el henry]

I have no problem with skaters changing countries, good for them. I have no problems with Russian skaters changing countries if they are like Katia Kurokava, who has by all accounts adopted Poland as her home. Or Alex Krasnozhon, who arrived in the US not speaking a word of English but represented the US of A with gusto and at least at the time he had retired, had made his home here, and was seeking citizenship even though he retired.

I have no problems if Gleb married Diana earlier than they may have planned in hopes of a US green card. They are truly a couple, from what I understand. It evidently worked, it happens all the time. No shame in that.

I have a problem if the athlete does not represent their new country loud and proud. I have a problem with fans who act as though the skater switching countries is still some shining example of motherland superiority (oh please) rather than a representative of their new country.

I may be a dreamer but I think the Eteri bonus is a thing of the past. I certainly saw no evidence of it this year elevating her rather mid level skaters to podium finishes. They finished pretty much where they deserved (a little higher but nothing like the unwarranted bonus of years past).

IAM does indeed have political clout. They have better teams with which to wield that clout, and they are not stupid, I think they will. I believe I heard that certain commentator thought that Eteri and IAM will somehow work in cahoots, but that same commentator thought Diana and Gleb would skate for the US. Not so much

 

[icewhite]

This is a much bigger problem in my eyes, the general way that country representation and switching works.
I dislike when countries buy runners from Kenya or Eritrea to gain medals, and honestly, a lot of what happens in figure skating is not much different. If Tim Dieck says they are skating for Spain because Germany would only pay for half their costs, but Spain pays it all, what else is that but buying sportive, well, success? (of course this seems to backfire, but I don't think they are doing it out of pure generosity.) Nothing against Dieck or Spain or the German fed or anyone - it's just a system that's wrong in my eyes. People are super dependent on which fed they skate for, at the same time heavily restricted, and switches are mostly dependent on random factors and influence.
Of course people around the world do not in the least have the same opportunities to be successful in sports, but in figure skating it's just really bad.

 

[saine]

IAM does indeed have political clout. They have better teams with which to wield that clout, and they are not stupid, I think they will. I believe I heard that certain commentator thought that Eteri and IAM will somehow work in cahoots, but that same commentator thought Diana and Gleb would skate for the US. Not so much

I stopped paying attention to that certain commentator for the most part. They claimed where the money for Davis/Smolkin came from. I'd ask for the actual receipts, but they'd probably get them to prove a point. When they accuse people of taking money from unsavoury sources, but overlook other's behaviour for the ~drama~ those figures add, I'm done.

I'm not personally a fan of all the teams going to IAM, even if it makes sense for them to do it. I'd like more diversity in coaches/choreographers. More options for skaters other than going to the one school since it's the only way to succeed.

 

[Azikin]

I may be a dreamer but I think the Eteri bonus is a thing of the past. I certainly saw no evidence of it this year elevating her rather mid level skaters to podium finishes. They finished pretty much where they deserved (a little higher but nothing like the unwarranted bonus of years past).

Well I certainly hope that her "mid level skaters" will have a shot at winning 3rd Olympic games in a row...

 

[lariko]

For Mozalev's sake, I hope Eteri's bonus is still a thing. The guy needs something tangible in his corner and it will only give him scores he deserves and other non-jumpers already recieve