Evgenia Medvedeva to train under Brian Orser

[andromache]

I've also seen such comments from the other side so to speak. Sort of "suck it Russia! Zhenya's moving to Canada and she'll finally be free". Just like some people were a bit too happy to embrace that rumour about Zhenya switching to another citizenship, because Russia does not deserve her or something.

Ugh, how dumb.

(I can kind of understand being a little excited if Evgenia really was changing countries, not because Russia would have to "suck it" but because Russia just has so much depth - it would be exciting to see any of their talented ladies get more international opportunities by switching countries.)

 

[DaNiCG]

Read his interview..What Zhenya told him about Eteri's methods..

the interview in icenetwork? I dont see anything wrong there, its normal for young skaters to have their coach telling them what to do, or is it the "Im not going to say anything bad about my coach"? you are reaching

either way, its better than what Eteri said anyway, she did that to put her on spot, and that wasnt a confidence, it was something we all knew

 

[DaNiCG]

What did Orser repair or have to repair in her current/recent students' jumps actually? Or what technique did he build?

Yuzuru's lip* or was it flutz? dont remember, Yuzuru's technique (he was always falling, he teach him how to control himself), Javier's technique to spins, step sequence, jumps, he helped Junhwan too, and Gogolev


I honestly dont know a lot about former skaters (Yuna) Im kinda new

 

[curious]

Yeah, Med and Borser are going to kill figure skating... maybe a tad overdramatic, don't you think?

They are going to kill figure skating with so much greatness. Some people are running very scare. So crazylol

 

[cohen-esque]

What did Orser repair or have to repair in her current/recent students' jumps actually? Or what technique did he build?

I want to say that back in 2014-15, Yuzuru had missed his lutz something like 7 or 8 times; I’m not sure he landed any cleanly. Anyway, Brian stayed up all night at Japan Nats watching video of Yuzuru’s 3Lz from the SP, trying to figure it out, and managed to fix it for the free skate. Yuzu also landed it clean at Worlds that season and has been reasonably consistent with it since.

 

[yume]

Yuzuru's lip, Yuzuru's technique (he was always falling, he teach him how to control himself), Javier's technique to spins, step sequence, jumps, he helped Junhwan too, and Gogolev


I honestly dont know a lot about former skaters (Yuna) Im kinda new

Hmmmmm i don't think so. There is not enough credit given to Nanami Abe, seriously. Yuzuru had a flip (!) not a lip, he had already his magnificient 3A and a pretty solid 4T, was landing 4S in practice. Yuzuru still fall a lot with Brian Orser. I don't see what he repaired on Javier's jumps. Talking about Junhwan, his 3A still really bad. Maybe Orser teach him his 4S.
And i was talking about jumps especially.

 

[narcissa]

I agree that American/Canadian coaches are more guilty of bashing/disrespectfully criticizing Russian coaches than vice versa, but I also disagree with your defense of Eteri. In my opinion she IS a devil reincarnate. Other than that I agree that Averbukh doesn't deserve the hate he is getting on this forum, namely from American/Canadian posters.
As to Frank Carol, I put him in the Eteri category. He once even called Lipnitskaya a "robot". lol. And completely disqualifying himself by this statement.

And Frank regularly insults Japanese skaters too, so his opinion is just invalid.

 

[cohen-esque]

Hmmmmm no. I don't see what he repaired on Javier's jumps. Talking about Junhwan, his 3A still really bad. Maybe Orser teach him his 4S.
And i was talking about jumps especially.

He stabilized Javi’s jumps immensely, and cleaned up his flip if particular: the vast majority of Javi’s +GOE flips came after he moved to Orser. (http://skatedb.net/modules/skateDB/index.php?page=player&playerid=379). Ditto the 4T, which has become a much better jump for Javi in recent years.

He (well, Tracy Wilson) also worked miracles for Javi’s SS and TR, but that’s a different subject.

 

[Shayuki]

What did Orser repair or have to repair in her current/recent students' jumps actually? Or what technique did he build?

Probably Tursynbaeva since she came to him from Eteri, right?

Tursynbaeva in early 2013
Tursynbaeva in late 2017

You know, I personally greatly prefer Tursynbaeva in early 2013. I can actually watch that without getting bored, unlike any of her programs in the past... two years or so. But I assume there'll be technical issues that have been fixed since.

 

[yume]

And Frank regularly insults Japanese skaters too, so his opinion is just invalid.

I thought that he was already retired from coaching, since he seems even older than coach Nagakubo....

 

[Ophelia]

What did Orser repair or have to repair in her current/recent students' jumps actually? Or what technique did he build?

He stabilized Fernandez's jumps very quickly, and this was one of the reasons Hanyu cited for why he elected to go to Orser. He wanted the same technical treatment for his quads, specifically the 4S.

 

[DaNiCG]

Hmmmmm no. There is not enough credit given to Nanami Abe, seriously. Yuzuru had a flip (!) not a lip, he had already his magnificient 3A and a pretty solid 4T, was landing 4S in practice. Yuzuru still fall a lot with Brian Orser. I don't see what he repaired on Javier's jumps. Talking about Junhwan, his 3A still really bad. Maybe Orser teach him his 4S.
And i was talking about jumps especially.

what? people give credit to her, she did wonderful to Yuzuru, but as Yuzu said, he learn everything he could from her, it was time to move on, Brian help him too, he was mostly falling on his jumps cause he couldnt control the landing on some of them, so they re-do that, seriously watch the interview, the olympic one? you want magnificent results, you want them to slap at your face, thats not how it happen, Junhwan is growing up, hasnt stop since 2016, of course he has troubles landing those, not mentioning his injuries, Javier was good for a Spaniard, but a mess in some elements

you said "technique", technique involve more than just jumping, FS its all about technique, that include spins, stsq...

Evgenia needs help on spins too, never forget the four-feet she travel in that competition, she is always travelling. BOrser and Raf are of the best technicians, and given that BOrser knows how to deal with injures, and that he knows how to teach quads...

 

[yume]

Probably Tursynbaeva since she came to him from Eteri, right?

Tursynbaeva in early 2013
Tursynbaeva in late 2017

You know, I personally greatly prefer Tursynbaeva in early 2013. I can actually watch that without getting bored, unlike any of her programs in the past... two years or so. But I assume there'll be technical issues that have been fixed since.

With her downgraded content and URs i don't really think so. But Orser said that his methods need time so i assume that it will be better soon.

 

[yume]

what? people give credit to her, she did wonderful to Yuzuru, but as Yuzu said, he learn everything he could from her, it was time to move on, Brian help him too, he was mostly falling on his jumps cause he couldnt control the landing on some of them, so they re-do that, seriously watch the interview, the olympic one? you want magnificent results, you want them to slap at your face, thats not how it happen, Junhwan is growing up, hasnt stop since 2016, of course he has troubles landing those, not mentioning his injuries, Javier was good for a Spaniard, but a mess in some elements

you said "technique", technique involve more than just jumping, FS its all about technique, that include spins, stsq...

Evgenia needs help on spins too, never forget the four-feet she travel in that competition, she is always travelling. BOrser and Raf are of the best technicians, and given that BOrser knows how to deal with injures, and that he knows how to teach quads...

I don't try to say that Orser didn't make a good job, all the contrary. He did an amazing job with most of his students. But i don't think that he's a magical curer like some seems to think.
I think he's really great at polishing, to clean elements when there is already great fundation. But i don't think that he's as good at fixing serious issues on jumps like flutz, pre-rotation or even URs.

 

[50 Words for Snow]

No more miming! Especially not hopscotch on ice.

That is my favorite part of my favorite program, the coolest thing I've ever seen in a skating program!

 

[DaNiCG]

I don't try to say that Orser didn't make a good job, all the contrary. He did an amazing job with most of his students. But i don't think that he's a magical curer like some seems to think.
I think he's really great at polishing, to clean elements when there is already great fundation. But i don't think that he's as good at fixing serious issues on jumps like flutz, pre-rotation or even URs.

oh, I dont think that either, thats ridiculous to think, but he do fix Junhwan's UR in the axel, then he had it in toes combo, and I think he fix that too, who knows just time will tell, if she is willing, anything can happen.

What I dont like is that, if does mistake does not disappear they could blame him Eteri is not happy with him, we are going to see more drama

 

[thedude]

Last but not least, many people are pissed that all this will be likely funded by rusfed. While western athletes train abroad with their own or their sponsors cash, this may not be the case for some of the Russian athletes, and actually this is a fair reason to be unhappy about it. If rusfed pays for Med (and it is a lot of money), this money will be spent abroad, not in Russia (so not supporting local people and so on), and also it is a rather large amount, which could be invested in raising top skaters locally.
TBH, I myself would be the first one to say "NOPE" if rusfed will actually pay for it. If Evgenia wants to train abroad, she should pay for it herself.

This seems shortsighted in my opinion. By the same logic, the NHL shouldn't hire any Russians and Japanese shouldn't invite
Russians to their ice shows.

I'm pretty sure Russian athletes in sports like swimming and track and field train in the USA. Some even get scholarships from American universities. Actually a bunch foreign athletes train in USA because our facilities tend to be state of the art. These facilities are often funded with public tax payer money. There is no public outcry that foreigners are using our facilities to beat us.

There is no reason, Russians can't make money teaching foreign ice skaters. Plus any money Zhenya makes abroad I'm assuming she has to pay taxes or give the Russfed a cut.

 

[Sugar Coated]

I’m finding this Russian victimization complex pretty funny. Rooting for Zhenya to get away from eteri is not hatred of Russia. It’s hatred of Eteri who has a history of difficulty with older skaters. And encouraging or rooting for Zhenya to switch to Armenia is not hatred of Russia, its love of Zhenya. These fans want her to have a better chance at getting gold since Russia has so much talent and she’s unlikely to be in the top three. If anything it’s a compliment to Russia since it acknowledges the immense talent.

I hate Eteri and believe her to be an evil narcissist but I adore Daniil. He appears to have such a positive and caring relationship with the juniors and I enjoy his choreography. Verdict is still out about Sergei. I can’t really figure out what he does for that team but appears to be Eteri’s yes man. I don’t know enough about Avurbukh to have an opinion. I REALLY like TAT. She seems knowledgeable, caring, opinionated, somewhat eccentric, and speaks her mind freely. I respect all those things. Honestly, I’m American and am rooting for a Russian sweep of the next Olympics in female FS because they have so much talent! And I wish there were more English translations of all Russian FS videos.

 

[andromache]

I'm not sure how great of a technical coach Orser is when it comes to re-working technique, and it's probably unnecessary to completely re-work Evgenia's technique anyway. I do think Evgenia's jumps were a little cringey during the Olympics in terms of how labored they looked, so I'm sure there will be tweaks made. But if they're rotated and landed cleanly most of the time, it's not a big deal.

I'm not as concerned about the flutz as many other posters are, either. Most skaters, especially ladies, have a lip or flutz. The points gained/lost from it aren't insurmountable, and the calls are inconsistent anyway. I don't think it's practical to dedicate a ton of time to it.

Elevating Evgenia with stellar programs and really working on those skating skills will get her the biggest advantage. She's already viewed as the "artist" in comparison to Alina - work that angle, make her into the next Carolina Kostner. Get those crazy-high PCS. Orser's work (or Tracy's) with Yuzu and Javi on their skating skills was really incredible. I imagine drilling skating skills is also less hard on the body than jumps and spins.

That said, I think the biggest benefit of the move to Orser is his experience with older skaters who have lots of injuries. Yuna came to him with lots of overuse injuries (I think), Javi was pretty much always healthy enough to skate and compete, and Yuzu is very fragile and frequently has issues but still delivers when it counts. Obviously Orser knows what he's doing when it comes to getting skaters through injuries, and it sounds like Evgenia's body is in pretty rough shape right now, probably at least partially from overtraining and crazy numbers of run-throughs. Eteri is great at working with younger skaters who haven't yet accumulated chronic aches and pains and injuries, not so much with older skaters who have lots of wear and tear on them (and given how hard her skaters work, they have A LOT of wear and tear on them).

 

[WhiteProphet]

At least it's the end of open mouth choregraphy.

Honestly, I just think that Medvedeva is the Emma Watson of figure skating: same overacting expressions in every program/movie and people still think it's great interpretation.
I really hope that will change, that's the main reason I'm so excited about her change of coach, it can be very cringe worthy sometimes.