How tired are you of footwork sequences that take 30+ seconds to complete?

[Buttercup]

Footwork sequences can look long and laborious, but they're an important feature for distinguishing skaters' skills outside of big elements. You can tell a lot about a skater's edge control, performance abilities, and ability to handle difficulty from their footwork sequence. As much as they can damper a performance, it forces skaters to show the fundamentals of figure skating. Kinda like the compulsory sequence in the short dance... a bit annoyingly repetitive to see, but integral to the sport on some level.

I don't think that's what's happening. It used to be that L4s were rare and even L3 weren't something automatic, but skaters, coaches and choreographers have learned how to tick off the points and high levels are common. I'd rather switch all step sequences to a choreo step/no level format, and differentiate even more based on GOEs (including having judges use the negative part of the range, which they never do). If ice dancers are only given a specific time frame to show what they can do with a lift, well, I expect the top skaters to be able to show their abilities even within a limited amount of time. That might be a better test of creativity and ability that what we're currently seeing. I also want to see edges held longer. Blade skills are not just about changing directions and edges non-stop.

Or have really preset steps, like the compulsory patterns in the SD.

 

[Blades of Passion]

I don't think that's what's happening. It used to be that L4s were rare and even L3 weren't something automatic, but skaters, coaches and choreographers have learned how to tick off the points and high levels are common.

Exactly. Since the rules no longer require the skater to create a clear shape on the ice, and since they have unlimited time to perform the sequence, it's not really a great test of blade control. Of course it's still difficult to get a Level 4, but it would be even more difficult to get Level 4 with my proposed rules and the programs would look FAR better and allow for better musicality.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I hate the footwork now too. I really loved watching Kurt or Yuka fly down the ice doing intricate steps in both directions. To me, that's what footwork should be about.

 

[David21]

To answer the question of the OP: Extremely tired.
I especially dislike the retrogressions in a step sequence and when there is an unrecognizable pattern. It doesn't look good.

While we're on the subject of annoying requirements, PLEASE revise the rules such that a Biellmann position is not necessary for getting the highest levels for laybacks.

A biellmann position isn't required for a Level 4 layback. It's just that the skaters are chosing that position to get the level up.

 

[seniorita]

^ Watching Carolina skating live is a privilege.

My most intense example of endless footwork must have been Leonova's Carribean Pirate one. It looked like two minutes, also the seasons the upper body movements had the required sweeping the floor with ones hand were my worst. I dont like pairs sequences at all these days.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

A biellmann position isn't required for a Level 4 layback. It's just that the skaters are chosing that position to get the level up.

Oh ok. So, what other ways are there to increase layback levels that the ladies aren't utilizing as much? I am sick and tired of EVERY lady doing a Biellmann in EVERY program. Sigh.

 

[pangtongfan]

I agree. I am tired with the super long footwork sequences and some of the overly long spins that need 4 specific positions or edges to get the levels. They need to change this.

 

[sweetskates1]

I love long sequences when performed by my most loved skaters but not when they involve cold, inexpressive competitors.

 

[David21]

Oh ok. So, what other ways are there to increase layback levels that the ladies aren't utilizing as much? I am sick and tired of EVERY lady doing a Biellmann in EVERY program. Sigh.

The ways are the same as for any other spin...e.g. ladies could do start from backwards or do a change of edge during the layback spin, but since doing an ugly biellmann is easier, they are doing the biellmann.

 

[Tinymavy15]

Mao's long step sequences this year are highlights of great skating to me. If step sequences are done well and hit the music, then fine, skate them out.

 

[sequinsgalore]

I'm tired of them too... Some rule changes I suggest:

Step sequences: max 30 secs
Spiral sequences: back in SP for ladies, 6 seconds spiral in total
Choreo sequence: can be before steps in FS
Pairs sbs spins: no levels. I'm tired of samey flying changefoot combination spins

Modification:
Spins: harder juding on GOE, more -GOE shoud be awarded to slow, labourous spins, so level advantage evens out

 

[Blades of Passion]

The ways are the same as for any other spin...e.g. ladies could do start from backwards or do a change of edge during the layback spin, but since doing an ugly biellmann is easier, they are doing the biellmann.

Backwards Layback is the most difficult spin in figure skating. Pretty much impossible to do it with great speed, centering, positioning, and difficult change of positions. A change of foot Layback with a backwards entrance would actually be easier (although it's worth more points), because then you can at least switch momentum to forward position. That too is very difficult, although I actually wish Jason Brown would train it. He could probably learn to do a Level 4 change of foot Layback with good GOE (backwards entrance into catch-foot position, change foot to sideways position, then a clear increase of speed in the regular layback position), which would give him highest base value ever for spins in a SP.

Change of edge in a Layback is also very difficult to do in a controlled and good-looking manner.

Like I said in my other post, "free leg and free foot parallel to the ice and back well arched" and "both arms held behind and back well arched" should count as difficult variations for the Layback.

 

[guanchi]

I love Brian Orser's straight steps for his '88 Olympic sp- it was fast, brilliant, superbly executed, went perfectly with the music, and didn't take up any chunk of the program at all:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSCr-A8T5qQ#t=135
Wish to see more like that.

 

[mateusp1]

Best step sequence/footwork ever! Trust me! It is great!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMwXYdkSK4g#t=222

I love her!

 

[elee63]

I feel like watching the spiral sequence for EVERY skater was worse that any laborious step sequence. Honestly, it takes OUT the wow factor, having to watch it over and over and over and over... and over again.

 

[Blades of Passion]

^ That's because the CoP spiral sequence rules weren't good enough. Skaters were forced to hold positions for too long and do the same moves. Plus, weak positions were getting rewarded as level features, such as grabbing the blade but not not actually having it above head level and with a good arch in the back. If the rules were changed so that skaters actually had freedom to do all kinds of different spiral sequences, then I feel they would definitely be a welcome return to Ladies skating.

Best step sequence/footwork ever! Trust me! It is great!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMwXYdkSK4g#t=222

I love her!

Stephanie Rosenthal is everything. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-2J_d9XksU

Yeah, her technical content is poor (aside from the footwork), but in terms of Transitions/Performance/Choreography/Interpretation she is so far ahead. We need to see more skating like this.

 

[BlackPack]

^ That's because the CoP spiral sequence rules weren't good enough. Skaters were forced to hold positions for too long and do the same moves. Plus, weak positions were getting rewarded as level features, such as grabbing the blade but not not actually having it above head level and with a good arch in the back. If the rules were changed so that skaters actually had freedom to do all kinds of different spiral sequences, then I feel they would definitely be a welcome return to Ladies skating.



Stephanie Rosenthal is everything. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-2J_d9XksU

Yeah, her technical content is poor (aside from the footwork), but in terms of Transitions/Performance/Choreography/Interpretation she is so far ahead. We need to see more skating like this.

Uh... while Rosenthal was electric and had lovely movements, using her as a standard for the greatest footwork in recent times is ridiculous.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Yeah, her technical content is poor (aside from the footwork), but in terms of Transitions/Performance/Choreography/Interpretation she is so far ahead. We need to see more skating like this.

I have to respectfully disagree. Her stroking looks labored and lots of skating on two feet with little transitions.

 

[CarneAsada]

Mao's long step sequences this year are highlights of great skating to me. If step sequences are done well and hit the music, then fine, skate them out.

Mao's step sequences have always been fantastic even in her worst programs. Her Masquerade LP was completely made by her steps. Her 2010-2011 Agony SP was awful in a way befitting its name; if I were to hazard a guess about its creation I would say Tarasova said "Zhanna, I'm heading out to lunch, choreograph the SP and I'll be back at 1 to do the step sequence!" to which Shanetta Folle replied "Yes, Gospozha" and slapped it together in 15 minutes. And even that program's steps were great. Maybe the one exception is the one from her bizarre Scheherazade SP, but I think there was no step sequence that could save that dreadful arrangement.

However, I still agree with BoP about them often going on for too long. In her Rach 2 LP, the steps are (IMO) absolutely perfect until Mao has to loop the music of the recap an extra time in order to cram in more features for the coveted Level 4. I especially dislike that illusion - the last time it didn't look out of place in her steps was probably in her 2011 SP. I don't like the illusion when Mao does it, I don't like it when Yuna does it, I don't like it when anyone else does it either.

^ That's because the CoP spiral sequence rules weren't good enough. Skaters were forced to hold positions for too long and do the same moves. Plus, weak positions were getting rewarded as level features, such as grabbing the blade but not not actually having it above head level and with a good arch in the back. If the rules were changed so that skaters actually had freedom to do all kinds of different spiral sequences, then I feel they would definitely be a welcome return to Ladies skating.

What happened between 2007 and 2010 that stopped all the skaters from doing bad fan spirals and made them start doing just the ugly catchfoots? And what is your definition of "good" for a catchfoot? Ando? Kostner? Rochette? Kim? Nagasu? Asada? None of the above?

 

[Alex D]

I disagree with this topic.

For me FS is also about other elements than just jumps. Step sequences are one of those elements, just like Spins.

In my opinion is the focus on jumps way too high right now and they can disturb the choreo quite easily especially if skaters are forced Into high difficulty elements to stay competetive even if they Fall.

Steps on the other Hand, enhance a Programm. Just look at adelinas moulin rouge, that was so awesome.