Ice Dance Senior Debutantes (I/K, P/I & the Shibs): Most Potential/Improved/Liked?

[Serious Business]

I don't fully enjoy any of these teams. But here's how I break 'em down:

Ilinykh/Katastrophov: That chick is glorious. If I had a fave among these three teams, it'd be Elena. So strong and balletic. Unfortunately, ice dancing takes two and Nikita is a slob. He has sloppy edges, lines and timing. And it gets worse as that free dance went along, showing a lack of stamina. He was seriously mis-timing moves. It's a wonder they didn't make any serious mistakes or incur any serious injuries during that Euros FD. Elena deserves a lot better.

Paul/Mitchell aka the Shampoo team: I didn't make it halfway through that FD. That was some boring, slow and immature skating. The lady has nice lines, I guess, if I had to say something nice about them. I give them a MEH on every GOE and PCS.

Shibutanis: Doesn't seem fair to compare them to the other two teams. The Shibutanis actually seem like a senior team, at least in their FD. The polish, the control and the power are all there. But their choreography and choice of music is so boring. Elegance is nice and all, but this is a performance sport. The Shibutanis remind me of those DVDs of slowly panning shots of picturesque countrysides that lets people show off high def TV systems. That's nice and all but it's not entertainment. I want to see highs and lows and drama and explosions. Ice dancing offers the most freedom in music choice, the Shibutanis don't take advantage of that at all.

How they can improve:

Nikita can either start taking skating seriously, or Elena can get a new partner.

Paul/Mitchell can keep on practicing and skating. Maybe in a few years they'll suck less.

The Shibutanis should skate to black metal next season.

 

[skfan]

Right. Even allowing for that inflation ( however much it might be), there's no question that the quality of the Shibs skating was very close to D/W's at their nationals..which I would not have predicted last summer...and a thing I'm not sure we could say for either I/K or P/I this year , if we're being completely objective. It's possible that a lot of it has to do with this particular set of programs and it might be different next year, depending on the material, but I'm just comparing in the here and now.


skfan , I agree with a lot of what you say. I'm sure P/I will want to establish their own distinctive look.But I expect it to remain fairly lyrical.

I think a lot of the "V/M lite" comments are pretty undeserved. I wouldn't want Alexandra to try to downplay her dance training ( She's ,if anything, a bit more willowy than Tessa, and there's a hint ..just a hint.. of something different ..haughtiness..self awareness..I'm not sure what to call it.) Besides this, they haven't had time to build up enough of a repertoire of their own for those charges to really stick..I think it's really her FD costume that exaggerates any similarity and I would have preferred if they'd done more to distance themselves. Then ,too ,she "gets" the Tango as Tessa does ( I can't see this as a bad thing ) ...So I think comparisons were inevitable , but I really don't think they're trying to be clones. Next year will tell a lot.

thank you for putting into better words the qualities i was trying to describe. the future is certainly interesting.

 

[seniorita]

That chick???

 

[colleen o'neill]

Elena is so talented, so expressive, and such a lovely looking girl...but just 16..I fear too much drama , too soon..or a Navka-ization ( especially considering her coach ).Avert ! Avert!

 

[CARA]

The Shibutanis should skate to black metal next season.

 

[silverlake22]

I/K have been skating together for awhile now, so idk how likely it is that they split up. I agree she is better than he is, but perhaps Nikita can improve. I know he is sloppy at times but he is quite expressive already.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

I/K have been skating together for awhile now, so idk how likely it is that they split up. I agree she is better than he is, but perhaps Nikita can improve. I know he is sloppy at times but he is quite expressive already.

They've split up before (in 2005). I actually think he's remarkably inexpressive.

 

[herios]

I know I'm kind of side stepping the conversation here, but I really wanted to gush about P/I. I'm just so impressed with them. In addition to all of the wonderful things that you can see on television, they have a really captivating presence live, at least IMO. I saw them skate both programs in the summer, and I was actually really surprised by how much they drew me in. I know they're coming at the worst possible time if you consider their chances for scoring international assignments (coming out of Canada, where dance is just exploding) but I honestly believe they'll pass both W/P and C/P within the next two seasons. Their technical scores are, on average, within about three points of the other two. Three points is not that much, especially when you consider how much potential for improvement they still have. Reallistically, how much can C/P and W/P really improve? They're both excellent teams, but they have been together for a while, so there is no way that they have the same potential to really up their scores that P/I have. If P/I are already this close to them, I think that makes them really dangerous for the next couple of seasons. With more exposure, more experience together and more work with great choreogreaphers, their PCS can only improve as well.

OK, after all your gushing, I will try to chill you down a little bit. You are betting against the development of two teams C/P and W/P. I will try to remind you they are only 20/19 and 21/23 respectively. they are far away to have reached yet their artistical maturity. Look at Pechalat / Bourzat who close to 30 just took their skating to another artistical level. So the question will be not which of the young canadian teams wil develop rather how far.
IMO, Paul Poirier will become in a few years if not the best, one of the best male dancers in the world (well, he already is one of the best in fact).
Alexandra and Mitchell have a great chemistry and look very well together. But they will have to work on their speed and power imo. They are not bad, but they have room to grow there and that is where they fall short in the first place compared with the other two teams ahead of them.
As far as the assignments they will get, they will get no less than the other two teams in the GP circuit, it will be up to them to have the same results or better than C/P or W/P and try to qualify as well to the GPF. If the results wil be very good internationally, so will be nationally.

 

[colleen o'neill]

No, it wouldn't do to forget that both W/P and C/P are still young, good , and have potential to improve. The question is ,will they ( to the degree P/I have shown they're capable of in a very short time )? That's something that we'll get a better idea of next season.

Having P/I coming up so suddenly from behind may be just the thing they need to spur them on to new heights. This season , they were probably taken a bit unawares, each thinking the other was the only direct competition to be taken into consideration. W/P obviously worked on their technique, but fell back on a very formulaic concept for their FD.( Myself , I'd like to see them tackle some just pure dance for a season ,as a change-up from yet another story from a movie or musical )

C/P made a real effort with their FD, but it doesn't do much to address their physical problems ( body stiffness ,etc.), so it wouldn't do to just carry on with more of the same.They finally got costume help, and at Canadian's there was an effort to relate better to each other in the SD. That was obviously choreographed in, including their taking of the ice, but that's a beginning. It will require unlearning the way they've been using their bodies for years, so I think that should be their main off-season project.Their technique ( from the waist or hips down ) is in good shape.

P/I just need to keep on doing what they've been doing and see how far they can progress in a year. For them, they have to know their results put them within range of the other two couples..I'd think that would be very motivating.

But this is supposed to be about all our debutantes..In spite of the buzz around them , I/K can't count on being/staying the favoured ones . B/S are young and very good, too ,and then there's R/T ,M/K and others...

For the Shibs, D/W won't be going anywhere soon, C/Z are not too far behind, and S/B will (hopefully) be back , healthy..and before his injury , they were the ones I would have predicted would be pushing D/W.
Nationally and internationally, they're all surrounded by talent. To reiterate a point doris made, what's the old maxim ? Success is 10% talent and 90% hard work ...?

 

[dorispulaski]

The Shibs beating C&P and W&P at 4CC's has to be an eye opener for all the up and comers.

Furthermore, if W&P hadn't made silly mistakes in a lift, and completely blew a spin, they would have finished ahead of C&P overall, instead of just in the SD. The judges gave it to them in PCS, both dances So it looks like dance in Canada, outside of V&M, is really wide open.

 

[pangtongfan]

W&P would have beaten the Shibs too for sure without their mistakes. Even if not for sure in the FD, for sure overall.

I&K IMO are even more talented than the Shibs so seeing the Shibs rise I expect we will see a big rise from I&K before too long.

I could see C&P being passed by W&P or P&I, or even possibly both, in Canada in the next few years. IMO they are a bit overhyped and dont have what it takes to be in the top 2 or 3 teams in the World even in the future.

 

[blue dog]

What an embarrassment of riches North America has in dance!

 

[evangeline]

I don't fully enjoy any of these teams. But here's how I break 'em down:

Ilinykh/Katastrophov: That chick is glorious. If I had a fave among these three teams, it'd be Elena. So strong and balletic. Unfortunately, ice dancing takes two and Nikita is a slob. He has sloppy edges, lines and timing. And it gets worse as that free dance went along, showing a lack of stamina. He was seriously mis-timing moves. It's a wonder they didn't make any serious mistakes or incur any serious injuries during that Euros FD. Elena deserves a lot better.

Although I cannot dispute your basic point that Elena >>> Nikita, in Nikita's defence, didn't he sustain some back injury or something that prevented him from training fully in the summer/early part of the season? Or am I thinking of someone else?

 

[dorispulaski]

No, that was Nikita.

 

[KKonas]

W&P would have beaten the Shibs too for sure without their mistakes. Even if not for sure in the FD, for sure overall.

I&K IMO are even more talented than the Shibs so seeing the Shibs rise I expect we will see a big rise from I&K before too long.

I could see C&P being passed by W&P or P&I, or even possibly both, in Canada in the next few years. IMO they are a bit overhyped and dont have what it takes to be in the top 2 or 3 teams in the World even in the future.

Shibs already beat W&P at Skate America as well, so we will have to see how they do at Worlds. Elena Ilinyk is a star - not so sure about her partner.

 

[KKonas]

IMO, Paul Poirier will become in a few years if not the best, one of the best male dancers in the world (well, he already is one of the best in fact).

This team is talented but need to spend more time power stroking.