Igor Shpilband fired

[demarinis5]

^Thanks for the info.
Congrats to Maia on her HS Graduation!!!

 

[Olympia]

Very nice to hear about Maia!

 

[Violet Bliss]

None of the skaters has said ANYTHING. Statements were issued which were so obviously prepared as press releases that it's unlikely the skaters had any part in writing them. V&M are on vacation and have said nothing. But by all means, blame the skaters for this.

I made the lists of confirmed and unconfirmed claims in post #102. To the confirmed list I can now add the skaters' staying with Zoueva and in Canton. But the management's claim of skaters' ultimatum remains in the unverified list, with Charlie's mom vehemently disagreeing and no corroboration from the skaters.

What could the management give as a reason to get rid of Shpilband that wouldn't make them wade into area they had no authority in and looking mean and completely profit oriented? They used the skaters' interest as the pretext and calling them kids was meant to make themselves sound paternal and caring. But, it's clear as day that it was all about business.

Skaters come and skaters go, so I find it hard to believe that the head coach of a major training centre was fired because the skaters didn't like him. That makes no sense at all. Why dismantle 20 years of work to accommodate 6 people who will likely be gone in two years?

But these are not just any 6 people. They are the two best Ice Skating teams in the world with Gold and Silver medals galore including the Olympic ones, and the bright young American team with already a Worlds medal in their names and the obvious successor to the number one American team. They have stayed for many years and together they make the to be fabled and legendary reputation of their club. Together they can also break that reputation. They branded the club and draw current and future skaters. The management couldn't afford to have them leave, especially en masse, for a coach who would likely leave soon anyways, whether to devote himself to his own school or as a result of escalating conflict with the co-coach as well as the management, and possibly with the skaters. Why risk having him take some the clubs' skaters with him by giving him time and facility to develop his own program?

 

[Olympia]

None of the skaters has said ANYTHING. Statements were issued which were so obviously prepared as press releases that it's unlikely the skaters had any part in writing them. V&M are on vacation and have said nothing. But by all means, blame the skaters for this.

Skaters come and skaters go, so I find it hard to believe that the head coach of a major training centre was fired because the skaters didn't like him. That makes no sense at all. Why dismantle 20 years of work to accommodate 6 people who will likely be gone in two years?

Agreed. We have to keep reminding ourselves that we know nothing about this. We can guess, suspect, deduce, speculate, or react as much as we want, but we don't know anything and are basing everything on inference. It certainly seems as if Igor Shpilband was treated badly, but we don't know why or by whom.

 

[colleen o'neill]

Hmmm... I've been mulling this over ..and over .. and over..

Of course egos abound , that goes without saying..and conflicts are bound to arise ( what , in figure skating ?)...But here's one thing that doesn't add up for me regarding the "Eville Marina" arguments : Why wouldn't she have had another technical specialist lined up ? If this was all down to her manipulating , you'd think she'd have that little detail worked out before making her move.

I have some more thoughts but I'll have to come back ( why do I start these things at the wrong time of day?)

 

[ManyCairns]

.. Obviously she had approached him about the issue but he frustratingly didn't take it seriously. She might have been surprised at how far the management went though they officially claimed to not mind Shpilband taking on these students. ... Shpiland seemed to be the perpetrator and initiator of the event. ... His cluelessness was indicative of his insensitivity and naivety to others' understandable negative perceptions and reactions to his plan and actions. ..

I know you said you were playing devil's advocate, but honestly these all seem like assumptions to me. I didn't see any evidence Marina or anyone spoke to Igor about concerns, whether related to the additional students or anyone/anything else. However, I also suspect that the stated reason of the additional students may just be a straw man anyway, and the real situation is something else or at least something in addition to just Igor taking on other students.

Of course though we are never going to know the real situation.

 

[skateluvr]

Craig O'Neill, general manger of the Arctic Edge:



Scott Moir:

Exactly, lots of smoke, mirrors and BS.

I will be rooting for podium contenders, Weaver and Poje. Would Shae Lynn Bourne be a good coreo-coach for the new Igor school? I'm hoping he can regroup for this season with some talented teams who might shake up the top two as it really is good for ice dance which tends to pre-judge events, though not as much as the past.

I think D/W's FD was better and looked harder than V/M this past season. While I'd be happy to see them clobber everyone this year, I like the Shibs very much. I think at this point the rink manager/owner is trying to lie his way out of this. I'll bet Marina Zueva loses some popularity here. I wonder how the judges will react to Igor's teams? I suspect the sympathy will be there.

I almost think his best move, for himself alone is back to Russia. All seems forgiven and he will get immediate money and Russia has a plethora of ice dance talent. I want to see him show up and show off!

eta, the quoted post of MM did not copy. ?

Craig O'Neill, general manger of the Arctic Edge:

What it came down to was the kids didn't want to skate there (in Canton) anymore with Igor. Either they were leaving or Igor was leaving.
Scott Moir:

We were obviously disappointed to receive the news that our coaching team of Marina and Igor will no longer be working together.

This was the content of the post that did not copy. I am not much with a computer, sorry!

 

[blue dog]

Another article, with a short response from Igor about the split.


http://vancouver.24hrs.ca/Sports/othersports/2012/06/07/19851641.html

 

[Violet Bliss]

I know you said you were playing devil's advocate, but honestly these all seem like assumptions to me. I didn't see any evidence Marina or anyone spoke to Igor about concerns, whether related to the additional students or anyone/anything else. However, I also suspect that the stated reason of the additional students may just be a straw man anyway, and the real situation is something else or at least something in addition to just Igor taking on other students.

Of course though we are never going to the real situation.

The conflict between the coaches and the cause for it were acknowledged by both coahes and the management. It is one of the few things we know for sure. Though the management denied it as the reason for expelling Shpilband from their property, the fact that they got involved and took the severe action they did indicate strongly they took it very negatively and very seriously. We don't know if the skaters actually wanted him out as claimed by the management, but it's not difficult to think they didn't appreciate his new activities and possible reduction of involvement with them, as suggested also by their decision to stay with Zoueva and say nothing to support Shpilband.

Everybody looks after self interest which is best served when everybody else's interests are also served. What they had was a 4-way win situation. With Shpilband's admitted ambition and activities, his self interest conflicted with the interest of his partner, their students, and the rink business. He became the odd man out. Given the long successful history, his professional status, and the conflict being acknowledged by himself, it is really hard to believe and accept that nobody had tried to talk to him to work it out before things got so bad leading to the management decisive and brutal action.

I prefer to think Shpilband was just insensitive and clueless for whatever reason and the management made a business decision. It would be harder to be a devil's advocate in an alternative scenario of the truth as told by the management - that 6 Worlds medalists including OGM and OSM, were united in a mutiny against Shpilband.

In any case, the situation had been started a while back and reported to USFSA over a month ago. Yes, there are a lot we don't know and may never know, but the fact that USFSA had monitored the situation involving its Olympic Team and let it fall out the way it did says much about Shpilband's presence as being very undesirable despite his great contribution to the achievement of success by the American Ice Dance over the recent years.

 

[Olympia]

One piece of fallout that saddens me is that several people already have said or implied that they'd now rather root for other skaters besides V/M and D/W. It's as if this unpleasantness has soured people on the Canton group. No one is benefiting from this breakup in the short run. Maybe only rival skaters and training facilities will get anything out of it in the long run.

 

[Violet Bliss]

One piece of fallout that saddens me is that several people already have said or implied that they'd now rather root for other skaters besides V/M and D/W. It's as if this unpleasantness has soured people on the Canton group. No one is benefiting from this breakup in the short run. Maybe only rival skaters and training facilities will get anything out of it in the long run.

To me it speaks much worse about Shpilband if the 6 top skaters did want him gone despite the success they had had with him.

People love to judge and take and make sides. But it's the skaters' talents and hard work with the right coaching team that determine their competitive success, not the rooting of a few fans who don't foot the bills for them.

The biggest beneficiary of this fallout is the Russian federation. Any conspiracy theory and convoluted scheme should start with them, not the alleged bad personality of any single skater.

 

[deedee1]

Quotes from Virtue/Moir and a few details are in Skate Canada press release today:

According to Moir, “their coaching partnership provided an enjoyable and productive training environment and together we experienced great success on the ice. We were obviously disappointed to receive the news that our coaching team of Marina and Igor will no longer be working together.”

Virtue appreciated the positive relationship they have shared with Shpilband during that eight-year period. “It was an honour to work with him every day, and we respect his dance knowledge and technical expertise. We are very grateful to him for everything he has helped us achieve.”

Thanks a lot, golden!
I am so glad to hear from Sakte Canada with nice, clean and classy quotes from Scott and Tessa finally. :yes: (As someone already said, I agree it might be a whitewasher, though...)

(...and it's so refreshing to hear these words from Scott for a change )

 

[deedee1]

Quote from IN:
Davis and White, the reigning four-time U.S. champions and 2011 world champions, had trained under Zoueva and Shpilband since 2006.

"After a long and rewarding partnership with Igor Shpilband, we hold the firm conviction that Igor's expertise and investment in our career have been integral to our success," Davis said. "We will have nothing but fond memories and sincere appreciation for our time with Igor."

The Shibutanis, the reigning two-time U.S. silver medalists, had trained under the former coaching pair since 2007.

"Our experience with Igor has been very rewarding," Alex Shibutani said. "He is a great coach, and we appreciate everything he has done for us."

And this one, too! :yes::yes: Good girls d good boys!

 

[Serious Business]

The point you ended with is the thing that worries me the most. When the Beatles broke up, neither Lennon nor McCartney ever again wrote such astonishing and immortal music, with a few exceptions. The same was true of Burt Bacharach and Hal David and many other collaborations one could name, where the whole was greater than the sum of the parts. In the case of the Canton group, I hope that everyone concerned can continue to excel in skating at the present level. If not, then some person or combination of persons at Canton has managed to kill the goose that laid the golden egg, and it will be an object lesson to future generations of skaters. At least they and we have the glorious legacy of the 2010 Olympics. But it would be nice to look forward to more.

The thing is, though, that whatever tension in a partnership that caused it to ultimately break apart, may also be tied, inextricably, to whatever inspirational synergy that made the partnership so successful. In other words, the personalities that caused McCartney and Lennon to fracture are the same ones that let them come together to make magic. Creativity is often sparked by adversity. By the same token, the sum total of personality and experience that made Igor and Marina the amazing partnership they were is also the same total that made them breakup. Maybe their success was as inevitable as their dissolution.

And lots of times, the dissolution of a partnership can be a good thing. When legendary hip-hop group Fugees broke up, Lauryn Hill (who was always the best singer and MC of the group) went off to create the musical masterpiece The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill. The adventurous Wyclef Jean, left to his own devices, went off to write and produce amazing songs in all sorts of cross-genres for himself and other artists, like "Gone Till November", Whitney Houston's "My Love is Your Love" and Santana's "Maria Maria". They were actually far more successful separately than they were as a group. Except for Pras. But he was the Ringo of the outfit. And of course, there are countless other musical breakups where one person emerged to be far more successful without the shackles: George Michael minus what's-his-face from Wham!; Beyoncé minus those-backup-dancers-who-sometimes-sang-solos-but-shouldn't in Destiny's Child; Michael Jackson minus the Jackson 5; Justin Timberlake minus *NSYNC, and so on and so forth.

The thing is, Igor and Marina aren't necessarily worse off apart in the long run. One or both of them could emerge more successful than ever. Maybe the best is yet to come for the Arctic club, or for Igor's future students.

 

[Olympia]

Thanks, Serious. Thinking about it that way is a great consolation.

I just hate to think that such talented skaters would be stopped in their tracks by a mess like this.

 

[phaeljones]

Didn't you get the memo from the ISU? In order to save money, all worlds and olympics for ice dance will be held in Michigan, since at this point, holding a club competition in Detroit is proving more competitive, than, say Europeans

lol. shrinking planet for skaters.

one of the small bright spots from these messes with the coaches is that, wow, it is pointing to a de-democratification (okay, not sure if that is a word or the best one here, but i hope the drift comes through) of the sport that seems to be occuring. if one rink has it all . . . coaches, skaters, top three teams . . . query whether it affects the feeder system and the general overall popularity of the sport in the long run. the concentration may be in part due to advances in coaching and training, but if the sport reaches the stage where only one (or one and a half) countries produce the best skaters (not there yet), this is going to become a one and a half country sport (or even less, maybe just a sport of a single state). i am exagerating, of course, and it really has nothing to do directly with the firing of Igor. Nevertheless: what the firing of Igor has done in part has put a focus on the Canton rink. It has produced great skaters and advanced the sport tremendously. For the sport, wouldn't it be nice, however, if the other rinks could now catch up. (Maybe Igor can help them. I hope he can.)

(i expect to be pounded for the above sacrareligious statements from the realists, but as George W. Bush said, "Bring it on.")

now, shifting gears:

one aspect of this sport that has always made me uncomfortable is the brutal competitiveness and the cold hard decisions that result. but i can accept that they are necessary for survival and that the sport probably gets the best skaters skating their best as a result. at this level, we all want to see skating at its very best and we all have to accept that the sorting process is not a charity. i got that.

BUT: whatever the position of the skaters or canton rink management was here (and they are entitled to their position and to have whatever relationship or non-relationship with Igor), this is a FACT:

Igor was fired in the most hurtful way possible that would maximize the damage to him personally.

No speculation here. That did not have to be done even in the context of whatever reason he was let go. And a happy statement from Scott Moir (or whoever wrote it for him) just doesn't cut it. This is a mess not so much that Igor was let go (that happens with winning coaches a lot in this sport), but the way that he was let go.

The brutality of the dismissal surpasses the norm even in this sport.

 

[Violet Bliss]

The brutality of the dismissal surpasses the norm even in this sport.

That's because this is a not normal case of skaters and coaches parting ways. This is a business decision and action by a club and rink management. This part is clear even though the skaters' and coaches' intentions and preferred way of settling the matter are not.

However brutal it was, the Canton management acted to protect their own interests, aiming to prevent their students, especially the prized top skaters, from leaving because of Shpilband one way or another, and to delay as much as possible his establishing his new school, but I don't think they acted with an objective to destroy his reputation or future. (They couldn't, unless there was a serious offense by Shpilband, in which case they actually protected him by not revealing it.) In fact, Shpilband gets a lot of sympathy from this incident and there is backlash against others involved. Of course, we know the Russian federation will step in to assist Shpilband quickly and he will be motivated to accept their help.

 

[bsfan]

It doesn't contradict it, it whitewashes whatever happened and the teams' involvement in this issue. So did the articles on IN with quotes from D/W and S/S as they were also on vacation.
Quote from IN:
Davis and White, the reigning four-time U.S. champions and 2011 world champions, had trained under Zoueva and Shpilband since 2006.

"After a long and rewarding partnership with Igor Shpilband, we hold the firm conviction that Igor's expertise and investment in our career have been integral to our success," Davis said. "We will have nothing but fond memories and sincere appreciation for our time with Igor."

The Shibutanis, the reigning two-time U.S. silver medalists, had trained under the former coaching pair since 2007.

"Our experience with Igor has been very rewarding," Alex Shibutani said. "He is a great coach, and we appreciate everything he has done for us."

It sounds that all 3 teams have been ready for the firing and prepared PC comments.

 

[Dragonlady]

Of course, we know the Russian federation will step in to assist Shpilband quickly and he will be motivated to accept their help.

They Russian federation has already offerred but Shpilbank has already said that he will be looking for space in Detroit and there are a lot of rinks he can choose from there. He's been in the US for a lot of years. His children were born there and he is not likely to be returning to Russia. His concern was that Canton was close to the University of Michigan and he wanted to find somewhere close so as not to disrupt their education.

 

[Violet Bliss]

They Russian federation has already offerred but Shpilbank has already said that he will be looking for space in Detroit and there are a lot of rinks he can choose from there. He's been in the US for a lot of years. His children were born there and he is not likely to be returning to Russia. His concern was that Canton was close to the University of Michigan and he wanted to find somewhere close so as not to disrupt their education.

If the mountain won't go to Mohammed, Mohammed will come to the mountain.