IOC issues recommendations on RUS/BLR athletes

[beachmouse]

Oksana Baiul asks Thomas Bach to ban Russian and Belarusian athletes from Paris-

Ukraine’s first Olympic champion appeals to Bach to ban Russia from Paris 2024

Ukraine’s first Olympic champion Oksana Baiul has pleaded with International Olympic Committee President Thomas Bach to "help us" by banning Russian a...

www.insidethegames.biz

 

[lariko]

Nothing from ISU. Back next Tuesday

 

[yesterday]

new timeline

Return to Competition of Russian Skaters Draws Closer​

Though Russian skaters remain banned from international competition due to the ongoing war in Ukraine, it sounds as if the ice may be thawing. In recent comments, Alexander Kogan, the general director of the Russian Figure Skating Federation, revealed that the International Skating Union has given the body quotas regarding possible entries for the Junior Grand Prix, which begins in August.

"As for the ISU, of course, there are still connections, and work is ongoing," Kogan was quoted as saying by Rsport. "One of the pieces of evidence is that we have received quotes from the ISU for participation in the junior stages of the Grand Prix. But they can be used on the condition that Russians are allowed to participate in international competitions."

Added Kogan, "The ISU will consider this issue at the upcoming council meeting in June. But we have been informed that it may be considered both in June and in September."

This last statement is a bit confusing, as by September the JGP will be well underway. It sounds like the ISU is going to have to make a definitive call on the participation of Russian skaters in the JGP next month.

With Russians participating in tennis tournaments around the world and playing in the NHL, it seems increasingly likely that Russian skaters will be returning to the ice sooner rather than later.

The next world championships slated for March 2024 in Montreal, Canada, could prove interesting, however. Based on their non-entry in this year's event, Russia would be allotted only a single skater in the men's and women's competitions, and one pairs and one ice dance team, based on the current qualification system.

(https://featured.japan-forward.com/...bout-developing-ice-dance-and-pairs-in-japan/)

I will never understand why certain sports where they did not try hard enough to ban them, are an argument to get them back into completely different sports...

 

[icewhite]

new timeline


(https://featured.japan-forward.com/...bout-developing-ice-dance-and-pairs-in-japan/)

I will never understand why certain sports where they did not try hard enough to ban them, are an argument to get them back into completely different sports...

I don't think that "not trying hard enough" is the right term. Those sports work differently, the athletes are living from their prize money or regular income, often not living in Russia, and much more individuals than in figure skating where they are more a part of the Russian fed. They are doing their job. You cannot deny every Russian the possibility to compete in sports just because they have a Russian passport (I do think some sports should have banned individual athletes for being hateful and supportive of a genocide, though).

About the timeline I think this doesn't tell us too much. There are plans in case, but that doesn't really mean a decision pro return is coming. The ISU just leaves all possibilities open and wants to decide as late as possible.

 

[NaVi]

new timeline


(https://featured.japan-forward.com/...bout-developing-ice-dance-and-pairs-in-japan/)

I will never understand why certain sports where they did not try hard enough to ban them, are an argument to get them back into completely different sports...

It's more of an inference (wrong IMO) of what he thinks is likely to happen than an actual argument in favor of it happening.

I am personally very skeptical Russian skaters will skate internationally next year at the senior level because it will be a complete mess to deal with on so many levels. Worlds being in Canada really doesn't help.

The least messy way to go forward IMO would be to let the Denis Ten Memorial(and maybe another event but it would probably have to be made out of an event that's currently not a challenger) serve as a benchmark event for skaters to get in the top 24 for Grand Prix spots for the 2024-25 season.

I find it interesting how the 2 spots Russia was given for the JGP were in Turkey and Thailand which are probably the 2 places that would have the least potential with problems hosting Russian skaters. The final is in China and Taiwan and there probably wouldn't be issues there either(Taiwan hosts these events to get international recognition of any sort... they're not going to deny visas).

[edit]

One thing I find funny about the absolutists for keeping Russians from skating is that I wonder just how happy they'll be if by the 2030 Olympics half(or more) the women's skaters in the free skate are introduced as "from Moscow". Because that's that fate that awaits them if they encourage country switches. Which would mean fewer skaters from smaller federation countries either making it to the Olympics or making it to the free skate in the Olympics.

 

[4everchan]

One thing I find funny about the abolitionists for keeping Russians from skating is that I wonder just how happy they'll be if by the 2030 Olympics half(or more) the women's skaters in the free skate are introduced as "from Moscow". Because that's that fate that awaits them if they encourage country switches. Which would mean fewer skaters from smaller federation countries either making it to the Olympics or making it to the free skate in the Olympics.

are you sure of that? Shirayeva moved to Canada with her family... never competed internationally... we saw her compete in a non-qualifying domestic event last summer... Latest news, though I admit I haven't been following the case closely, she hasn't received her release...
Cirisano was apparently told that the release would be 2 years from now... So he is not going to be able to compete until spring 2025. I sincerely doubt that Russian skaters will represent a dozen different countries by 2030.

Finally, if you visit the speakeasy section of this forum, there is an article about the ongoing inquiry started in 2015 about systemic doping. Over 200 Russian athletes have been sanctioned. It has been said that if the war wasn't a good enough of a reason for the IOC, the integrity of the sport itself (clean sport) might be what will take Russians far from international events. Not my opinion, just something that has been mentioned.

 

[TeamGubanova]

Maybe Russia would vie to go to 4CC. It would make way more sense to them given the higher entry quote, the only problem is how other feds in the 4CC would look at it. But they'd probably be better than Europe

 

[4everchan]

Maybe Russia would vie to go to 4CC. It would make way more sense to them given the higher entry quote, the only problem is how other feds in the 4CC would look at it. But they'd probably be better than Europe

I doubt this would ever happen for so many reasons. I understand your point about no quotas in 4CC versus Euros.. but you know, the ISU wouldn't fix a very temporary problem with such a drastic solution. Look at China for not getting much out there during covid times... well they lost spots and they will simply regain them... or Italy in pairs, when all their teams got covid... and couldn't enter worlds.. they will have more spots next year now.
1) other Feds would not want Russia in there (except maybe Kaz and China)
2) Russia wouldn't want to be part of 4CC
3) Euros would become very weak
etc etc
It's not happening... And on top of that, it's not just figure skating that does 4CC versus Euros... speed skating and short track speed skating do it too...

 

[Amei]

Article

The Italian government approved the recommendations of the IOC on the admission of Russians to the competition.

This was announced by the President of the National Olympic Committee (NOC) Giovanni Malago.

“The government has taken a position that has been officially communicated by Sports Minister Andrea Abodi after consultation with Prime Minister George Meloni and Foreign Minister Antonio Tajani.

I believe that this position will be formalized through an official note, ”Malago told reporters after the meeting of the leadership of the NOC of Italy .

Malago explained that Rome will comply with "all the regulations that the IOC has recommended to allow Russian and Belarusian athletes to participate as neutral athletes in upcoming sports competitions, including in Italy."

 

[JimR]

It is positive that it looks like Russian juniors might return next season. It's one thing to discriminate against adults, but to punish juniors was bizarre and cruel. I don't understand what that was trying to achieve.

 

[Jumping_Bean]

It is positive that it looks like Russian juniors might return next season. It's one thing to discriminate against adults, but to punish juniors was bizarre and cruel. I don't understand what that was trying to achieve.

What makes you think that the ISU is planning on letting the Russian/Belarusian Jrs return next season? Just that they are on the entry spots list for the JGP or do you have any other hints?

Because I hate to disappoint you, but they were already on the same list for the past season but didn't end up being allowed to compete back then either, so if that's the only hint, it's not a super strong indication in either direction.

 

[Amei]

It is positive that it looks like Russian juniors might return next season. It's one thing to discriminate against adults, but to punish juniors was bizarre and cruel. I don't understand what that was trying to achieve.

Pretty sure the junior spot allocation is something automatically done but the ban still holds. I believe its been said the ISU will discuss/announce a status of competing in June

 

[4everchan]

Article

The Italian government, can say that... but the truth is that the IOC's position hasn't changed... It's up to sportive federations to make the call. So far, those who have tried it (fencing, judo, etc) have had all sort of issues... including Ukrainian boycott.

 

[Magill]

The Italian government, can say that... but the truth is that the IOC's position hasn't changed... It's up to sportive federations to make the call. So far, those who have tried it (fencing, judo, etc) have had all sort of issues... including Ukrainian boycott.

Even so, in the reality this wording means nothing ATM. All the parties - governments, federations, organizers, athletes themselves - are taking now all sorts of stands backing themselves up with the holy "in compliance with IOC recommendations" phrase. It seems its wording was so vague and so open for interpretation it allows for inclusion, exclusion and anything in between, depending on which wagon you want to hop on...

 

[Alex65]

It is positive that it looks like Russian juniors might return next season. It's one thing to discriminate against adults, but to punish juniors was bizarre and cruel. I don't understand what that was trying to achieve.

If people like to hate Russians, then what difference does it make who they are - "adult" 18 year old athletes or 13 year old children? And in general - the old people who dragged politics into the sport, they do not care about all these athletes. Just another target for hatred.

 

[mrrice]

If people like to hate Russians, then what difference does it make who they are - "adult" 18 year old athletes or 13 year old children? And in general - the old people who dragged politics into the sport, they do not care about all these athletes. Just another target for hatred.

Sadly, I have to agree. My problem from the beginning has been that the wrong people are in the headlines. These skaters were minors when they began skating and I have to wonder if they've been on these substances for a while. A 15 year old child can't simply walk into a doctors office and get PED's. There are adults who need to be in the spotlight and I'd have Eteri and the Russian Federation at the top of the list. The Athletes have been out an entire season, and for them, I think the ban should be lifted. I think Eteri should be banned for life. Any coach who knowingly filled their athletes with drugs should be banned for life.

 

[4everchan]

@mrrice : the athletes are not suspended because of the systemic doping. Russian athletes are suspended from competition because of the ongoing war destroying Ukraine and killing its people, including children.

 

[mrrice]

@mrrice : the athletes are not suspended because of the systemic doping. Russian athletes are suspended from competition because of the ongoing war destroying Ukraine and killing its people, including children.

Wasn't their top skater, Kamila Valieva banned for doping? Am I wrong?

 

[4everchan]

Wasn't their top skater, Kamila Valieva banned for doping? Am I wrong?

You are incorrect. Kamila was suspended following a failed anti-doping control, then the suspension was lifted almost immediately and she was allowed to compete at the Olympics. Her case is not solved yet and no sanction has been imposed on her, except for the loss of her National title. There are a couple threads in this forum about it. I think you need major catching up

 

[Amei]

Wasn't their top skater, Kamila Valieva banned for doping? Am I wrong?

No she wasn't, long story short/summarized: the positive doping test came out she was provisionally suspended but due to some weird circumstances related to WADA rules and her age, she couldn't actually be provisionally suspended based on a CAS ruling at the Olympics. There is a timeline thread in the edge with bare bone legal facts and discussion thread in the speakeasy for further information/ discussion. Theoretically speaking if the war ban is rescinded and her doping case isn't resolved she could go to international competitions or at least it wouldn't be the doping case being the official reason* she is Ineligible to compete.

*i say official because I've seen people speculate that the war was a convenient way to get Russia banned because attempts at banning them completely for some length of time due to doping hasn't withstood legal challenges.