Jump hype or soap opera: what can make the general public of the U.S. fall in love with figure skating again?

[Magill]

Wow, are you telling me, that a Japanese 2x Olympian and 3x World champion and beloved skater who skated for 10+ years and also made her mark in figure skating and who has garnered a lot of sympathy (possibly even more because she didn't get that OGM) and respect over the years, who doesn't do a lot of shows, skates at Stars on Ice JAPAN and gets big applause and adoration from a Japanese audience, perhaps more so than the new guy from America who just started his senior career a few years ago?! Shocking. Was this thread about the US general public or Stars on Ice Japan??

No. What I am telling you is that it is yet another season when the current crop of world champions is not able to sell Stars on Ice Japan shows to any extent acceptable for the organizers so they have to reach out and bring their retired greats to save the sales.
And FYI, SOI Japan is meant to be a show where the skaters active in the competitive skating shine, not the pro ones. Still, it just does not work this way recently. It did not work two years ago, a year ago, or this year. Yet it had not been such a case several years ago.
It just shows how the current crop of champs is less popular with Japanese audiences which are basically most welcoming skating audiences in the world, and despite great efforts, these current champs are not able to win this public over.
So before they and their fans start to brag about how big stars they are and will be, maybe they just take the responsibility for bringing in the audience needed to pay them their fees.
That's all.
And FYI, Mao Asada is performing a lot in ice shows, she even opened her own ice rink recently, just she's performing in her own shows, not Stars on Ice. She was brought there this year in desperation to avoid the flop. Just like Yuzuru was brought in two years ago - to avoid the flop. They are both very busy with their very successful pro careers and yet still have to be called in to save the sales...
From what synesthesia posted, I understand in the case of Mao it was not enough and more Japanese retired greats (Dai, Kana) had to be brought in to save the sales. Still it had been enough with Yuzuru...

 

[Magill]

Where did he post that?

That's the quote:



It was not posted. It comes from an interview for the Washingtonian published on March 20, just before the Worlds.
What strikes me - and in the wrong way - is that it is just about fame and celebrity, and money I guess, no actual sport or human achievements, or artistry, or anything that really matters, involved in this dream or ambition, whatever it is. It's empty and vain, just vanity fair at its worst, nothing else. To me, it says tonnes about him, which I could do without.

Ilia Malinin Is Leaping Into Figure Skating Stardom

The 20 years old figure skater is winning titles with his daring quad jumps. How much farther can he push figure skating’s limits?

www.washingtonian.com

 

[Arigato]

It was not posted. It comes from an interview for the Washingtonian published on March 20, just before the Worlds.
What strikes me - and in the wrong way - is that it is just about fame and celebrity, and money I guess, no actual sport or human achievements, or artistry, or anything that really matters, involved in this dream or ambition, whatever it is. It's empty and vain, just vanity fair at its worst, nothing else. To me, it says tonnes about him, which I could do without.

Ilia Malinin Is Leaping Into Figure Skating Stardom

The 20 years old figure skater is winning titles with his daring quad jumps. How much farther can he push figure skating’s limits?

www.washingtonian.com

“Now I’m trying to become more than just a skating celebrity. I want to be one of the top celebrities in the world—like Cristiano Ronaldo, [Lionel] Messi, Dwayne Johnson. I want to be on that level.”

I'm going to respond to that self-serving quote with a quote from Konstantin Stanislavski:

"Love the art in yourself, not yourself in the art."

 

[TallyT]

To go back to the OP's question (and from the POV of someone whose country never has, never will, fall in love) there probably isn't any way except serendipity which is incalculable anyway. And going on from @skatingfan4ever's comment... on an individual, fannish basis we are lucky, we live at a time where we can follow what we want where we are. Livestreams get geoblocked? There's VPNs. Videos get yanked? We can download them first. Videos are in a foreign language? Subbed, if not officially then by fans. And photos and programs and flash across the world with the news.

Pretty much every fandom I have is from somewhere else and by someone else. It's okay.

 

[Mathman]

What I am telling you is that it is yet another season when the current crop of world champions is not able to sell Stars on Ice Japan shows to any extent acceptable for the organizers so they have to reach out and bring their retired greats to save the sales

It makes me wonder if Japan is entering a period of skating malaise like USA suffered 20 years ago (and has yet to reb0und from). For whatever reason the new kids on the block do not spark the same interest as their predecessors did. Is it a change in the skating, or a change in public mood amid cultural drift?

 

[Mathman]

I'm going to respond to that self-serving quote with a quote from Konstantin Stanislavski:...

For me, it's"judge not that you be not judged." I can remember being 20 and full of fantasy dreams about how I was going to solve the world's thorniest math problem and become as famous as Einstein.

Granted, we would prefer for skaters to do their talking with their blades, not their mouths. But for me, I have only a finite amount of outrage to distribute -- I can't waste in on tsk-taking high-spirited youths.

 

[Arigato]

Granted, we would prefer for skaters to do their talking with their blades, not their mouths.

There is no "we" here. There is my preference, your preference, Bob's preference, Betty's preference, and so on. Nothing more. And every person is entitled to their preference. This is a discussion forum.

 

[Magill]

It makes me wonder if Japan is entering a period of skating malaise like USA suffered 20 years ago (and has yet to reb0und from). For whatever reason the new kids on the block do not spark the same interest as their predecessors did. Is it a change in the skating, or a change in public mood amid cultural drift?

Or is it just honest feedback from the public as to what the new kids on the block bring to offer?
Unlike in US, the pro scene is thriving in Japan. They have a good choice between the pro and the current crop - and they obviously make good use of their wallets and credit cards buying much better quality for the same amount of money. Who could blame them? Or be surprised?
And their verdict as to who the MVPs of the sport are is rather obvious. And quite different from the ISU Awards, and from what ISU rewards ...

 

[Mathman]

Or is it just honest feedback from the public as to what the new kids on the block bring to offer?

I do wonder, though, if this might be an ominous sign going forward. If the public does not warm to new talent then the continuing and future popularity of the sport conceivably could be in jeopardy. Kaori Sakamoto won three consecutive world championships. Yet she cannot fill an arena and Mao Asada can.

 

[Magill]

I do wonder, though, if this might be an ominous sign going forward. If the public does not warm to new talent then the continuing and future popularity of the sport conceivably could be in jeopardy. Kaori Sakamoto won three consecutive world championships. Yet she cannot fill an arena and Mao Asada can.

I know. Same is true about 2 x world champion Ilia Malinin, and this despite all the buzz and PR push. Seemingly they are not that interested to see him.
Same true about Chock and Bates, 3 x world champs, if I remember correctly...
Would that be a vote of distrust and disinterest towards the whole sport establishment and decisions they make when awarding medals? The public taking their money and going for the skating style and stars from before the 2018 IJS reform when skaters were still supposed to be able to skate, and they were winning with iconic programs the public still remembers - and can tell apart?
Or is it that those few retired superstars are doing things so much more interesting as pro skaters, that the public is losing interest in the old-time style of an ice show?

 

[Mathman]

Or is it that those few retired superstars are doing things so much more interesting as pro skaters, that the public is losing interest in the old-time style of an ice show?

That is a very interesting question. I can only make observations about how it progressed in the United States. In the U.S. the "old-time style of an ice show," as represented by Ice Follies in the 1930s and Ice Capades in the 1950s, was basically a Las Vegas girly show on ice.

https://d3h6k4kfl8m9p0.cloudfront.net/uploads/2015/01/Follies-Pair.png

By the 1980s and especially in the 1990s audience's tastes in entertainment had matured to the point where the two major touring companies were Stars on Ice (featuring mostly affecrionately-remembered recently retired Olympic medalist/world champions such as megastars Kurt Browning, Kristi Yamaguchi and Scott Hamilton), And Champions on Ice which presented the current crop of competitive stars skating more or less watered-down versions of competitive programs, with a few movelty acts thrown in, together with a few older mainstays like Victor Petrenko and Surya Bonaly. Both SOI and COI were very successful at the box office for for many years, and avid skating fans embraced both with, I would say, equal enthusiasm.

But by 2002 the bottom had essentially fallen out of the professional skating market on the national sports-and-entertainment scene, I don't know why. People offer various explanations, but to me none of them in isolation in entirely convincing. My pwn personal opinion is more along the lines of -- no explanation. Public taste in entertainment morphs and meanders. In the days of the Ice Follies,. after a while people just lost interest in girls on ice skates posing as Playboy bunnies -- audiences moved on.

 

[Jeanie19]

That is a very interesting question. I can only make observations about how it progressed in the United States. In the U.S. the "old-time style of an ice show," as represented by Ice Follies in the 1930s and Ice Capades in the 1950s, was basically a Las Vegas girly show on ice.

https://d3h6k4kfl8m9p0.cloudfront.net/uploads/2015/01/Follies-Pair.png

By the 1980s and especially in the 1990s audience's tastes in entertainment had matured to the point where the two major touring companies were Stars on Ice (featuring mostly affecrionately-remembered recently retired Olympic medalist/world champions such as megastars Kurt Browning, Kristi Yamaguchi and Scott Hamilton), And Champions on Ice which presented the current crop of competitive stars skating more or less watered-down versions of competitive programs, with a few movelty acts thrown in, together with a few older mainstays like Victor Petrenko and Surya Bonaly. Both SOI and COI were very successful at the box office for for many years, and avid skating fans embraced both with, I would say, equal enthusiasm.

But by 2002 the bottom had essentially fallen out of the professional skating market on the national sports-and-entertainment scene, I don't know why. People offer various explanations, but to me none of them in isolation in entirely convincing. My pwn personal opinion is more along the lines of -- no explanation. Public taste in entertainment morphs and meanders. In the days of the Ice Follies,. after a while people just lost interest in girls on ice skates posing as Playboy bunnies -- audiences moved on.

For me,I prefer competitions. I rarely watch the gala, and only my favorites. Maybe doing shows that are like the 2016 Team Challenge Cup, as it incorporates all countries. WTT is just 6 countries. I think competitions are more interesting and exciting to watch.

 

[TontoK]

Again, evidence of the complete illogic of skating fans.

On this page, we complain about the crowd/star appeal of newer skaters to a broader audience.

And we complain about the new guy who has expressed his intention to change that.

We want skaters with more personality, right up until the moment we get one.

 

[TontoK]

For me,I prefer competitions. I rarely watch the gala, and only my favorites. Maybe doing shows that are like the 2016 Team Challenge Cup, as it incorporates all countries. WTT is just 6 countries. I think competitions are more interesting and exciting to watch.

Agree. I almost never watch a gala, although I did watch the tribute program.

I find gala performances generally to be uninspired or just plain silly. Different strokes for different folks.

 

[Jeanie19]

Agree. I almost never watch a gala, although I did watch the tribute program.

I find gala performances generally to be uninspired or just plain silly. Different strokes for different folks.

I watched the tribute program, too.

 

[Mathman]

About galas, I don't usually watch them either, but I think I understand their purpose. This is the denouement of the three act play, which follows the climax (the definitive performances in the LP that determine the winners).

Like when you sit down to a sumptuous feast and then, when you have eaten your fill, you hate to get up from the table and you enjoy just sitting there for a moment reminiscing over the crumbs.

 

[Arriba627]

For me,I prefer competitions. I rarely watch the gala, and only my favorites. Maybe doing shows that are like the 2016 Team Challenge Cup, as it incorporates all countries. WTT is just 6 countries. I think competitions are more interesting and exciting to watch.

I agree. Even if I go to the competition in person, I rarely go to the gala. For me, no gala or ice show can ever compare to the adrenaline and cheering of competition.

 

[Mathman]

As to the question of which we like better, competitions or shows, I think that this is the wrong query. I think that both forms of entertainment thrive or languish together. Furthermore I believe that this is determined by societal and cultural forces that are beyond the control of the people who are in change of developing figure skating and marketing it to the public. I am not really sympathetic to charges that it's all he ISU's fault, or it's all on the stupid TV networks, or "if only Sonja Henie could come back from the grave."

For me personally, when I was able, I went to every competition I could, and plus I never missed a Detroit stop of COI or SOI. The funny thing about COI especially was that, although the headliners might be Michelle Kwan and Alexei Yagudin, the four acts that stole the show year after year -- the guts and glue of the COI crew -- were the comic ice acrobats Besedin and Polischuk, the hula hoo[p girl (Irina Gregorean), plus Victor Petrenko -- always good for a quirky concept -- and Surya Bonaly.

I mean, where else are you going to see this:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

(Of course it helps -- or does it hurt? -- when your wife has a big crush on Victor Petrenko.)

 

[el henry]

And to circle back to the header…..

There are definitely folks who may start out watching a gala and go hmmm, this figure skating business looks interesting, let me see more.
We have had posters on this forum say their friends’ introductions were shows and galas.

Rope ‘em in first, and get all sophisticated later.

 

[NanaPat]

(Of course it helps -- or does it hurt? -- when your wife has a big crush on Victor Petrenko.)

It helps if you prefer to not go alone to shows. It hurts if you want to save money by buying only one ticket. I would take the companionship over the savings.