No, not exactly. But seemed like it was freaking URs again. Argh. I just have mixed thoughts about sending Flatt again this year after being hammered by the int'l judges.
Ladies FS
- Thread starter Chemistry66
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No, not exactly. But seemed like it was freaking URs again. Argh. I just have mixed thoughts about sending Flatt again this year after being hammered by the int'l judges.
Don't know if this will link correctly but I had to try. Quite a picture of Rachael.
http://sports.yahoo.com/oly/gallery;_ylt=ArUGUIcKfazuQLXnKcfEDqLNycIF#photoViewer=urn%3Anewsml%3Asports.yahoo%2Cgetty%3A20050301%3Aoly%2Cphoto%2Ce164698ff21e2e112cf3b70856c50996-getty-97635742sl049_u_s_figure_sk%3A1
http://sports.yahoo.com/oly/gallery;_ylt=ArUGUIcKfazuQLXnKcfEDqLNycIF#photoViewer=urn%3Anewsml%3Asports.yahoo%2Cgetty%3A20050301%3Aoly%2Cphoto%2Ce164698ff21e2e112cf3b70856c50996-getty-97635742sl049_u_s_figure_sk%3A1
- Joined
- Oct 31, 2006
I'm REALLY hoping for greatness from Russia in Sochi too, particularly in pairs and ice dance! I
Maksim + Tatiana and Elena + Nikita with all my heart! I would love to see improvement from Jana + Fedor, Lubov + Nodari, Katarina + Alexander, and Vera + Yuri as well! <3
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Really? I can't find them try as i might.
- Joined
- Jan 7, 2011
Actually both Mirai and Rachael got a UR call (Mirai on her 3lutz, Rachael on the 3toe after her 2axel). Mirai may have lost a tiny bit more points on her UR due to it being on a higher scored jump after the halfway mark, but really it's a wash. The difference in their FS score (not their total score!) is 7.15. From studying the protocols, here's where Mirai really lost to Rachael:
Obviously getting 0 points on a spin element hurt. She normally gets 3.5 points+ on her flying sit spin.
In terms of points they got from jumps, Rachael got 3.37 more points than Mirai on them. They actually made very similar mistakes on their jumps. They both got UR calls, they both doubled a planned triple, and had a wonky landing on their final jump. So why the point difference? Because Rachael had a jump plan that scored more points to begin with, so with them losing almost identical points with the failures thrown in, Rachael came out ahead. Summary of Rachael's superior jump plan:
Rachael's two (planned) repeated triples were 3lutz and 3flip, whereas Mirai planned to repeat her 3lutz and 3toe.
Rachael put her highest scoring jumping passes in the second half, whereas Mirai had one of her highest scoring jumping passes in the first.
Rachael planned a 3sal (for a 7 triple program if she landed all her jumps) whereas Mirai planned a second 2axel.
It's almost uncanny that they wound up losing identical amounts of points from their planned jumps. But since Rachael had more points to begin with, she comes out ahead.
Mirai also lost around 3.5 points for getting a big fat 0 on her flying sit spin.
The remaining point or so difference in their FS is in the PCS, where besides skating skills, Mirai came out slightly behind in all other areas (and fairly so, given how tense she looked whereas Rachael actually took time to perform and sell the program).
And there you have it. That's exactly why Mirai lost the FS to Rachael and the whole competition.
Obviously getting 0 points on a spin element hurt. She normally gets 3.5 points+ on her flying sit spin.
In terms of points they got from jumps, Rachael got 3.37 more points than Mirai on them. They actually made very similar mistakes on their jumps. They both got UR calls, they both doubled a planned triple, and had a wonky landing on their final jump. So why the point difference? Because Rachael had a jump plan that scored more points to begin with, so with them losing almost identical points with the failures thrown in, Rachael came out ahead. Summary of Rachael's superior jump plan:
Rachael's two (planned) repeated triples were 3lutz and 3flip, whereas Mirai planned to repeat her 3lutz and 3toe.
Rachael put her highest scoring jumping passes in the second half, whereas Mirai had one of her highest scoring jumping passes in the first.
Rachael planned a 3sal (for a 7 triple program if she landed all her jumps) whereas Mirai planned a second 2axel.
It's almost uncanny that they wound up losing identical amounts of points from their planned jumps. But since Rachael had more points to begin with, she comes out ahead.
Mirai also lost around 3.5 points for getting a big fat 0 on her flying sit spin.
The remaining point or so difference in their FS is in the PCS, where besides skating skills, Mirai came out slightly behind in all other areas (and fairly so, given how tense she looked whereas Rachael actually took time to perform and sell the program).
And there you have it. That's exactly why Mirai lost the FS to Rachael and the whole competition.
Beyond happy for Alissa! Beautiful skate, it brought tears to my eyes.
Sad for Mirai. Yes, she gave it away with the spin, but I thought the scores should have been much closer. Rachael's score here is much higher than anything she's done internationally ever, and we all know it wasn't at all a good skate. She was judged extremely generous. I'm not sure if sending her is the best idea - she hasn't been all that consistent this year, and the international judges don't love her. If anything called for a 4CC skate off, it's this one.
There's something about Agnes I like - huge jumps and she does have some musicality - but I'd like to see her get a different coach, as I don't think the team around her is the one that will fully develop her potential.
The calling in this competition has been crazy. Why is Lisa Ervin a technical caller again? Mirai gets an edge call on her flip, but Wagner, Lam & Gao with visible flutzes get none? Erm, OKAY.
Sad for Mirai. Yes, she gave it away with the spin, but I thought the scores should have been much closer. Rachael's score here is much higher than anything she's done internationally ever, and we all know it wasn't at all a good skate. She was judged extremely generous. I'm not sure if sending her is the best idea - she hasn't been all that consistent this year, and the international judges don't love her. If anything called for a 4CC skate off, it's this one.
There's something about Agnes I like - huge jumps and she does have some musicality - but I'd like to see her get a different coach, as I don't think the team around her is the one that will fully develop her potential.
The calling in this competition has been crazy. Why is Lisa Ervin a technical caller again? Mirai gets an edge call on her flip, but Wagner, Lam & Gao with visible flutzes get none? Erm, OKAY.
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Thanks for the detailed explanation! It makes sense to me. I agree Mirai looked tense. She also lost steam at the end of the program which is probably just a killer for PCS. Rachael did perform to the end.
I think Mirai was right on when she said she just didn't attack. Probably that's what led to the UR and doubled jump.
I wonder if Frank is going to make her work on her salchow. It must be hard to decide what to work on. Does she try to get a triple triple? or concentrate on improving her lutz? Or getting a salchow?
What I don't get is - with all those things she needs to work on, why is she also trying to work on a 3a?
I can't post the links. The medal ceremonies are under the schedule page. The seniors aren't up yet but the junior and novice are all there. The press conferences are on the video page - then go to video archives. You may have to scroll down a bit.
Tom Z must be doing something right.
His skaters are currently 1-3 in the men's SP and 2-4 in the ladies.
But it's definitely Yuka Sato's night as a coach. If Jeremy wins tomorrow she should get an honorary U.S. nationals gold medal for guiding those two to victory.
I don't mind Agnes's style, although I don't like her programs this year, her Chicago program last year was fine. What I don't like is Agnes's stroking and speed. She's a HUGE talent though.
As for those criticizing Frank for his comments, I'd say that Frank knows his skater, and maybe its time that he gives Mirai a little tough love. He mentioned in an interview earlier how he felt that Mirai needed to have a more consistent even keeled attitude in big competitions or something like that. Mirai absolutely needs to develop a killer instinct. Frank knows his students and what they need. He doesn't strike me as a cruel coach.
As for those criticizing Frank for his comments, I'd say that Frank knows his skater, and maybe its time that he gives Mirai a little tough love. He mentioned in an interview earlier how he felt that Mirai needed to have a more consistent even keeled attitude in big competitions or something like that. Mirai absolutely needs to develop a killer instinct. Frank knows his students and what they need. He doesn't strike me as a cruel coach.
Well, Evan raves about him and Mirai speaks highly of him. I think he's just very tough and no-nonsense.
And I think what he's trying to do with Mirai is impress upon her how good she can be and how far she can go if she embraces the right mentality. He doesn't want her to settle. It's tough. I don't know if I'd have it in me to work with a coach like Frank. Hopefully, Mirai does.
He can teach the jumps, but his skaters have all the same flaws: lack of speeds, so so basics, and many of them are pretty boring. I think he's pretty bad at packaging his female skaters in particular. I just don't think he has what it takes to take skaters to the highest level.
Well, maybe not. But I do love Ryan Bradley. And Jeremy came from his school and won the GPF and his first national title under Tom Z. The one thing about Jeremy that is Tom Zish about him is that his spins are not that great.
But maybe Agnes can break the Tom Z blah spins trend.
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2009
I'm so sad for Caroline and Ashley. I think I'm going to watch some of Caroline's juniors videos to cheer myself up ...
I'm happy for Flatt, but I've never been able to warm up to Alissa. I always get the feeling that she front loads her programs.
Jeremy has trained ice dancing skills before he went with Tom Z. Ryan Bradley's skating skills absolutely hold him back. I think Agnes has a lot of talent, but her stroking and speed need work. The thing is that IMO a coach isn't always going to be great at teaching everything, but a good coach should know his/her weakness and at least seek the outside help needed for their skaters to improve. It seems to me that a new skating skills coach is necessary in Col Springs.
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2008
I literally gasped when Alissa did the 3Toe-2Toe-2Loop (first time in her career to finally hit the 3 jump combo with a +2Toe+2Loop !!!) and then cheered wildly on the second 3Lutz-2Toe. It's so great to see her getting stronger and stronger this season, more than she has ever been. If she skates perfectly at Worlds it would not be out of the realm of possibility that she is WORLD CHAMPION. Her ability is that great. If she hits the 3Loop cleanly at Worlds in addition to everything else, and performs with her utmost grace and beauty, it really would be worthy. Only a perfect Yu-Na or perfect Mao Asada would deserve to beat her.
I'll go with that assessment
But realistically, it'll be hard for Alissa to beat Miki Ando, too. Especially in Japan. After that, there's Carolina Kostner, Kiira Korpi and Murakami. Alissa can beat them. But she has to be perfect. But I will say that Alissa's skate tonight was way ahead of the ladies in Europe this weekend and the lovely Canadian champion Cynthia Phaneuf.Was that really her first time hitting that 3 jump combo?
I think that may be the most hilarious jumping picture I've ever seen. Thanks for the laugh!
Congrats to Alissa on her second US title. The US judges have always shown a preference for having a champion who's a woman, and really, in the field she was competing with this year, Alissa's maturity really does stand out. I think if she continues with a string of middling to almost clean performances, she may sneak onto a couple of podiums here and there, but I do think she'll be overtaken come Sochi.
Rachael? I don't like her skating at all, but even I don't think she'll finish lower than 10th at Worlds. I still think she's a more consistent bet than Czisny, and if the World team had been Mirai and Alissa, I'd have less hope for regaining three spots even though Mirai's skating pwns Rachael's in every respect. Mirai's been on the decline this season (I attribute it to a post-Olympic funk), and she's shown that she doesn't handle the stress of being 1st after the SP very well.
As for Caroline, if her placements don't improve by next year then I'll say she's done. She may very well start to show progress from 2013 onwards, but as we all know, reputation counts for a lot in this sport, and if let's say she completes a 7-triple LP at the 2014 Nats, I don't think she'll be placed on the Olympic team when her results beforehand had been dismal.
- Joined
- Mar 23, 2010
I'll be totally honest here I WANT YUNA KIM TO KICK ALISSA CZISNY'S *** AT WORLDS!!!!!!!!
I don't like Alissa's skating, she herself is an obvious angel, but her skating sucks big time for me. SAFE skater.
God has given you your moment, now please leave, and that's exactly how I feel inside.
Pleeaassee...Yuna doesn't want to kick anyone's *** at Worlds. She just want to skate.
Soo sad for Mirai. But she's young, I hope she can bounce back.
Congrats to Alissa and Rachael.
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