Ladies SP

[Piel]

I think that in the quest to make sure FS is taken seriously as "sport" Sp$$dy has left behind a lot of the "art". DG, we will just have to agree to disagree on this. If I want agressive and in your face I watch football. I watch FS to see beautiful musical interpretation on ice. Not "precious"mind you but beauty. And that is me whining, LOL. This thread should be to celebrate Irina's win today no matter what I think about it. So unless I just can't contain myself about something, I will bow out of it now. I'm sure everyone else will do the same when MK wins the Olympics .

 

[gezando]

Mao completed triple lutz, triple flip/triple loop, and a double axel. Maybe she will put in a triple axel next time.

 

[CDMM1991]

Well, on another note, Shiz and I have the same short program music this season.

 

[Doggygirl]

Well, on another note, Shiz and I have the same short program music this season.

I hope you don't have the same costume!!! (Onda already has a wrap on the Japanese Ladies Rusty Hanger Award as far as I'm concerned....)

All kidding aside, the music is beautiful. Wish I had a talent like you do (skating) to have that form of expression. And of course, you have excellent taste!!

DG

 

[R.D.]

Still haven't seen Slutskaya's SP. But, I'll take the people's word for it that she should be in first right now. But should she be THAT far ahead of everyone else? Something about all this just seems ridiculous to me. Imagine this happening at the Olympics. No more suspense. We know who's going to win this thing anyway. *YAWN* :sheesh:

I don't want to lose it right now, so I'll wait to see how she is scored at her other two events (including the GPF). If she is overmarked there, then we all know she'll be the 06 Olympic Champion. *groan*

 

[gezando]

we all know she'll be the 06 Olympic Champion. *groan*

Be positive, if Irina wins olys 06, most likely she will retire, and Mao will be the 07 world champ

 

[R.D.]

True. But at least now I have someone to root against in Torino.

 

[Doggygirl]

Still haven't seen Slutskaya's SP.

And so you offer your opinion in spite of that fact....because.....why??????

 

[R.D.]

Well, it wouldn't be the first (or the second, or the third) time this has happened. But I'll reserve further judgement until I see the performance. I'm just a little suspicious right now, that's all.

It just kills me to think that Irina might be a shoo-in for an OGM, with everyone else not having so much as a chance. But that's my thought only.

 

[SusanBeth]

I don't understand why everyone is seeing this short and trying to judge the Olympics. First, we know that some extremely unexpected things have happened on Olympic ice. The pressure there is unlike any other competition. Sure bets have faltered there before. Also, I don't think it's necessarily a good thing for skaters to be this good so early in the season. Who wants to peak at CoC?

 

[Piel]

SusanBeth your post gives me hope..THANKS! Now if some just don't peak at Marshall's, LOL.

Hey DG maybe we could sell t-shirts that say...... "It's an Olympic year and I peaked at festival de fromage"

 

[SailorGalaxia518]

I'm still going to hope for Michelle :frown2:

 

[Rgirl]

I don't understand why everyone is seeing this short and trying to judge the Olympics. First, we know that some extremely unexpected things have happened on Olympic ice. The pressure there is unlike any other competition. Sure bets have faltered there before. Also, I don't think it's necessarily a good thing for skaters to be this good so early in the season. Who wants to peak at CoC?

Amen! And also a hope for "restraint" on COP conspiracies at least until we've seen the SPs--just a hope, LOL. Hmm...Slutespiracy, Kwanspiracy, Asadaspiracy, Sashaspiracy, Shizzaspiracy, etc. They all roll off my tongue equally well.

Just for the record, I've always felt that, in general, Irina has skated with great musicality, flow, and upper body line. In fact, prior to the footwork section in "Aranjuez" and since, I'd posted for many years (watch Mathman go crazy) that Irina's upper body expression was far superior to Michelle's (those were the two being compared). And even though Irina has bowed legs, which helps skaters in their jumping, and her feet don't point, I think she's made the best of her anatomical design.

Also, ITA with those who've said that Irina's power, speed, and control of the ice are second to none when she's skating "in the zone." As I've said before, I've been fortunate enough to have seen Irina (and Michelle, Sasha, Fumie, and many other skaters) skate live.

One last point: I don't think "pretty" and "beautiful" are necessarily synonymous when describing an essential quality figure skating should have. For example, Dictionary.com's first entry for pretty is: "Pleasing or attractive in a graceful or delicate way."

For beauty, the site's first entry is: "The quality that gives pleasure to the mind or senses and is associated with such properties as harmony of form or color, excellence of artistry, truthfulness, and originality."

IMO, skating should have "beauty" as a quality, but it does not necessarily have to be "pretty." OTOH, "pretty" skating without intrinsic "beauty" is. at least IMO, lacking an essential quality. I find Irina to be a skater with great beauty.

When I see Irina's SP, you can be sure that I'll weigh in on whether I think she has been overmarked, which I do feel she has been sometimes in the past.

Rgirl

 

[Mathman]

Rgirl, I think the reason that some people (me, for instance) are saying that the Olympics are over is this. Irina did not just get the best short program score of this event. She got the highest short program score in the history of figure skating.

I didn't look this up to see if it is literally true (but I think it is). However, if you look at the Code of Points in detail, Irina's point total is not only higher than anything Michelle, Sasha, Shizuka or anyone else has ever done (I don't count Sasha's string of 197s in the first experimental year of CoP scoring) -- it is higher than anything Michelle, Sasha, Shizuka or anyone else can possibly get, no matter what they do.

Comparing Irina's score to the men from last years Worlds, Irina beat Takahashi, Griazev, Weir, Sandhu, Van der Perren and Goebel (beautiful skaters, one and all).

Well, the LP starts in a few hours. If Slute gets 140, the fans of other skaters will just have to shoot themselves now and get it over with.

MM

 

[Mathman]

PS. To put this in perspective, here are the winning SP scores from last year and this year so far:

2004/2005

Skate America 53.64
Skate Canada 57.76
NHK 64.20 (Shiz's best)
Cup of China 62.96 (Irina)
Eric Bompard 55.96
Cup of russia 61.12 (Irina)
G Final 65.46 (Irina)
Euros 65.02 (Irina)
Worlds 62.84 (Irina)

2005/2006

Skate America 57.94
Skate Canada 58.54
Cup of China 70.22 (Irina)

Michelle's best: 61.22
Sasha's best last year: 61.37

Now, look at Michelle's and Sasha's SPs from worlds last year and tell me where they are going to get an extra 9 points?

 

[swannanoa54]

Well, that's it then. All the other ladies shouldn't even bother showing up for the Olympics since Irina has already got the OGM in the bag. Although there are still the silver and bronze medals to win, maybe they could just give Michelle the silver and someone else the bronze now and be done with it. No need to go to all the trouble of training, flying to Italy, skating, just to watch Irina win.

And as much as I have loved watching Irina skate, I don't care for her presentation at all. Never have. I like her power and speed but the rest of it just goes by me. And from what I'm hearing, it's a Biellman-fest SP. Now there's something I'm so excited about watching. Not.

 

[Mathman]

Wait, all is not lost after all! Michelle could do a quad Axel instead of a double. This would raise her SP score by 9.7 points (13.0 versus 3.3).

Adding a quad Axel to Michelle's already excellent Worlds SP would give her a total of 70.92 points, edging Irina's 70.22 by seven tenths of a point.

Are we starting to see the lay of the land here?

 

[layman]

Upper body line

Just for the record, I've always felt that, in general, Irina has skated with great musicality, flow, and upper body line. In fact, prior to the footwork section in "Aranjuez" and since, I'd posted for many years (watch Mathman go crazy) that Irina's upper body expression was far superior to Michelle's (those were the two being compared). And even though Irina has bowed legs, which helps skaters in their jumping, and her feet don't point, I think she's made the best of her anatomical design.

Upper body line? Are you kidding?

When Irina skates, her upper body is usually bent over at the waist (torso almost parallel to the ice). She does not hold her upper body up nor does she maintain an upright back position as she skates. She's round shouldered and her arms flail about like they are fabric appendages sewn onto a rag doll.

She has really poor posture and line whether we are talking about her upper body or her lower body. She makes no attempt to stretch ANY position ever.

 

[SusanBeth]

I am wondering if the outrageously high marks were a reflection of how Irina rated by comparison to the other skaters. I know the judges aren't supposed to do that anymore, but insert the old dogs/new tricks cliche here. Irina's technical prowess and experience packed a wallop that made Asada look decidedly juniorish. The fact that Irina wasn't being compared to Kwan and Cohen did make her look even better. She (IMO) wasn't as outstanding as those marks would indicate. However, she was that much better than the rest of the field.

 

[Mathman]

Irina's technical prowess and experience packed a wallop that made Asada look decidedly juniorish.

You might be on to something. Mao's score was higher than anything Michelle or Sasha ever posted, so when Irina came along, what are you going to do?

Layman, thanks for joining in, and welcome to the forum! (Even though you are kind of hard on my girl, Irina, LOL.)

Rgirl, true, but look how pretty Michelle is

http://www.eastwesticepalace.com/photos/michelle-kwan/7687.jpg

MM