Men free skate

[Tonichelle]

there are a lot of Americans who wear frills, velvet and sparkles....

there are a lot of American male figure skaters that should not wear velvet pants... Boitano and Baldwin both come to mind....

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Well, it's ok for you to feel that way. And it's also ok for me to be glad that Adam, who had a rough year, had such a great competition with Brian Orser.

I have said that Orser made the man. I thought Adam's LP was skated exceptionally well. It was the level of the competition that bothered me, and all those other would be seniors, all of who hit the podium and others near it. Who would have been the Junior World Champion if Senior skaters were not permitted?

 

[lmarie086]

I'm so pleased for Adam, I can't wait for it to be on-demand! Though I was rooting for Brezina to win, it's great to read that Adam had his best competition of the season. In the award ceremony they showed his 3A-definitely improved. All he really was missing was the right coach I guess. Can't wait to see him next season!

Michal...I can't wait to see his performance either. It was a great competition between him and Adam, it sounds like they were once again the class of the field. I hope Michal continues to recover well from his knee problem, because IMO he's a very special skater with great musicality. I can't wait to see him as a senior full time in the fall.

Also can't wait to see Artem. I haven't seen him before but in the award ceremony he looks like a mini-Yagudin!

I was so disappointed for Florent, I really liked him at JGPF. Not his competition, but he did have a better LP than SP. Hope to see more of him in the future!

And as for the seniors at junior worlds thing...the situation with Adam and Michal is a bit different, and I can kind of see where Joesitz is coming from. Adam skated as a senior all season long with this as his first junior competition since last years junior worlds. Michal competed mostly as a junior with two senior competition. Even so, I don't really have a problem with Adam competing here.

 

[Snowgirl]

I have said that Orser made the man. I thought Adam's LP was skated exceptionally well. It was the level of the competition that bothered me, and all those other would be seniors, all of who hit the podium and others near it. Who would have been the Junior World Champion if Senior skaters were not permitted?

Grigoriev (3rd place) turned 17 today. Ten (4th place) is 15. Are they considered as seniors too?

I'm really happy for Adam, it was his best performance of the year. And for Artem as well, he had some problems in the beginning of the season, but his first JR worlds medal turned the season into a good one.

 

[Buttercup]

Adam, as a Senior Skater won over a cast of Juniors. I am not happy that there isn't a new Junior World Champion. Let's see how Adam does next year with so many US skaters in Nats, eyeing the Olys. Maybe Orso will do it. Meanwhile we will check out Weir, Lysacek, Abbott, and Mroz.

Remember that there was a host of senior skaters at Europeans who skated as Juniors; case in point Michal Brezina among others. There is some parity here.

I'll admit I was kind of conflicted about Rippon's win. He skates very, very well and was deserving of the championship, but like Joe I wasn't that happy to see a 19-year old who's skated as a senior all season beating a bunch of kids. Brezina is an exception, as he has done Europeans twice already, but Brezina did do junior GPs this year, so it wasn't like he'd completely transitioned to seniors. Still, they were both great, and it was very enjoyable to see them skate.

Originally Posted by COP
It will be easy for Ten to qualify for Olympics. The top 24 skaters at worlds will automatically advance to Olympics, right? He was 7th at 4cc.

Each country gets a certain amount of spots based on the Worlds results from the year before. You need a total of 13 or less for 3 spots and 20-something for 2, I think.

Are we talking about Denis or Jeremy? Because Jeremy might find it difficult to qualify, but who else is representing Kazakhstan that might get to go instead of Denis? I'm pretty sure so long as he qualifies personally, it won't be a problem.

Elladj Balde
I love him. He has such a distinctive personality, so much spunk. He is like the Canadian Joubert. Excellent basics; good speed, great edging. Spins are mediocre - but hey, others became European and World Champion with mediocre spins.

Yuzuru Hanyu
His spins are great, good over the ice - so much potential. I loved the inabauer, excellent arch for a male representative of the human race. I am looking forward to more Hanyu. Last year I was a bit worried that there would be some kind of void in Japanese men's skating after the great trio (Dai, Nobu, Taka), but this guy is certainly a great talent.

I liked them both. Balde is great, certainly different both in terms of his looks and his style of skating. I wasn't reminded of Joubert, but I did think he was different from the Canadian skaters we usually see.

Hanyu was adorable. Simon and Nicky were very impressed, rightly so IMO. The spins were fabulous, he seemed to be enjoying himself, and it was an imperfect but fun performance. He's got a lot of potential, and I'd love to see what he can do in two-three years.

 

[chuckm]

I have said that Orser made the man. I thought Adam's LP was skated exceptionally well. It was the level of the competition that bothered me, and all those other would be seniors, all of who hit the podium and others near it. Who would have been the Junior World Champion if Senior skaters were not permitted?

Under ISU rules, "Senior" skaters are those who have reached the age of 19 by July 1, 2008, therefore the JW Champion would be Adam Rippon.

By YOUR rules, anyone who skated at his/her Nationals as a Senior, or at any Senior interational competition, is a Senior. There was an aborted attempt to change the age rules at the last ISU Congress, but the rule was not passed. And even that rule change did NOT reference how skaters competed at their own nationals.

Just because you don't like the ISU rules doesn't give you the right to dismiss more than half of the competitors as not qualified:

Adam Rippon - SGP 2008-2009, Senior Nationals 2009
Michal Brezina - Nebelhorn 2007, 2008; Euros 2007, 2008; Senior Nationals 2008
Artem Grigoriev - Senior Nationals, 2008, 2009
Denis Ten - 4CC 2009; Senior Nationals, 2005-2007
Curran Oi - Senior Nationals 2009
Elladj Balde - Senior Nationals 2009
Chao Yang - Senior Nationals 2006-2009
Kevin Reynolds - SGP 2007-2008, 2008-2009; Senior Nationals 2006-2009
Nikolai Bondar - Senior Nationals 2004-2009
Yuzuru Hanyu - Senior Nationals 2009
Alexander Majorov - Euros 2009; Golden Spin 2007, 2008; Senior Nationals 2009
Florent Amodio - Senior Nationals 2006-2009
Stanislav Kovalev - Senior Nationals 2008-2009

By your rules, these would be the medalists:
Nan SONG (7th)
Ross MINER (10th)
Denis WIECZOREK (14th)

 

[Sdongxie]

Not really, Nan Song has been the new senior national Champion of China in January 2009 He beat Chengjiang Li and Jialiang Wu.

 

[viv]

if Adam does make the 2010 Nats and goes to the Olys, and then beats Oda, what will Morozov say?

and if Dai beats Oda. Oh Morozov.

Sorry to spoil the fun, but I don't see this. Oda can do a 4T-3T-3L combo which he did not show in competition yet, but I'm sure he will soon, and I also believe that it was an easy skate here for Adam, being the most experienced skater and skating against boys who (most of them) were at least one year younger than him.
I am glad he has won, though, because I like his skating a lot, but the real challenge will come next year, when he has to skate against people like Abbott, Weir and Joubert. And, of course, Oda.

 

[Buttercup]

Under ISU rules, "Senior" skaters are those who have reached the age of 19 by July 1, 2008, therefore the JW Champion would be Adam Rippon.

By your rules, these would be the medalists:
Nan SONG (7th)
Ross MINER (10th)
Denis WIECZOREK (14th)

I can't speak for Joe, but where I see a difference between Rippon and Reynolds and most of the guys on your list is that Adam and Kevin have been skating as seniors all season, and most of the others have not.

Almost everyone you listed only did Nationals, and many only this year. Even for those who have skated at senior nationals more than once, I don't think it's the same as competing in international events. In many countries, very young skaters skate as seniors at Nationals because there aren't that many people competing - but they are not senior skaters in terms of age and often in terms of their abilities. Denis Ten, for instance, first skated as a senior at Nationals at the age of 11, and his only senior international appearance was this year's 4CC. He's 15. That is clearly a junior skater, though obviously a talented and promising one.

Adam Rippon is a senior skater. So, for that matter, are Elene Gedevanishvili and Alena Leonova over in the ladies' event. It's not a level playing field IMO, and I'd rather see junior skaters at Junior Worlds. Obviously skaters can do what the ISU allows; I would just like it better if there was more of a differentiation between seniors and juniors.

Oh, and you're wrong about Hanyu. He's the junior national champion of Japan and has never skated as a senior. He just turned 14 a couple of months ago.

 

[mrd2301]

Oh, and you're wrong about Hanyu. He's the junior national champion of Japan and has never skated as a senior. He just turned 14 a couple of months ago.

No, chuckm is right. Hanyu also competed at the senior Nats 2009, where he placed 8th.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

What I am saying, is once a skater competes at a higher division, that is now his division. I don't care if the ISU just carries on about age. If a skater is under age and skates at the next hgher division, it stands to reason he is part and parcel of that Division. If a skater is qualified for junior because of age and never skated senior, than he is most qualified for Juniors.

I'm a Rippon fan from way back and was very happy when he won Juniors last year. This year, imo, belong to a new Junior.

 

[Buttercup]

Hanyu also competed at the senior Nats 2009, where he placed 8th.

Ok, thanks for the correction. His ISU profile had a 1J notation for 2008-9 Nationals and on Eurosport they only mentioned his being the junior national champion, so I figured he hadn't done seniors. Still, I don't think it can be argued that he is a senior skater at this point in his career.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Exquisite. That Ashley really turned it on!! Yes?

 

[viv]

What I am saying, is once a skater competes at a higher division, that is now his division. I don't care if the ISU just carries on about age. If a skater is under age and skates at the next hgher division, it stands to reason he is part and parcel of that Division. If a skater is qualified for junior because of age and never skated senior, than he is most qualified for Juniors.

I'm a Rippon fan from way back and was very happy when he won Juniors last year. This year, imo, belong to a new Junior.

ITA. As much as I like Adams skating, and as much as I am about his performances here, I think it should be once a Senior, always Senior.

 

[mrd2301]

Still, I don't think it can be argued that he is a senior skater at this point in his career.

No, me neither.
Anyway, this young boy has shown promising ability. I liked his skating.

 

[Buttercup]

Anyway, this young boy has shown promising ability. I liked his skating.

I thought so, too :agree:. If anything, Hanyu was undermarked on PCS. Some of the skaters who did better there have noticeably poorer basic skills; his presentation was also good, especially for such a young skater. I look forward to seeing more of him in the future.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I thought so, too :agree:. If anything, Hanyu was undermarked on PCS. Some of the skaters who did better there have noticeably poorer basic skills; his presentation was also good, especially for such a young skater. I look forward to seeing more of him in the future.

Hanyu is among my three to watch next Jr.Worlds, and I hope they do not put in a bunch of Senior GP skaters.

 

[Luciana]

I don't understand why some of you are arguing about skaters' division.
I know there have been several skaters who have done both Senior's and Junior's and some of them got medals. Asada did and she won silver. Flatt did she won gold. Zhang and Nagasu came back to JW.

Is that problem Rippon is defending Champion? It's unfair.
I'm so happy he is the first defending Champion.
Orser really did a good job with Rippon.
I hope some US ladies work with Orser.
He is a really good skater and conductor.

 

[Tonichelle]

people are just as upset with the ladies competing in both.

 

[ks777]

I don't understand why some of you are arguing about skaters' division.
I know there have been several skaters who have done both Senior's and Junior's and some of them got medals. Asada did and she won silver. Flatt did she won gold. Zhang and Nagasu came back to JW.

Is that problem Rippon is depending Champion? It's unfair.
I'm so happy he is the first depending Champion.
Orser really did a good job with Rippon.
I hope some US ladies work with Orser.
He is a really good skater and conductor.

Ok, Asada didn't compete in both Jr Worlds and Sr Worlds in the same year.
What is a depending champion? you mean.. defending champion??