Men's Short Program

[amateur]

...So does anyone have thoughts about the Men in the SP in THIS competition??

I caught the midnight CBC broadcast...

Joubert: Pretty nice, still "getting there" in terms of being completely well-rounded and appearing "dominant" - interesting that the music was composed for him (seems all the French skaters do that at some point)... Not that I though it was "good" music, but it does suit him yet push him to be more soft/expressive, so it is pretty well done.
Footwork quite good, amazing how he was able to carry the beat through it. He seemed just a tad more Plushenko-like to me in this SP

Ponsero: It was almost 1am, I don't remember much about him. Fairly solid skater, has a certain elegance and flow, not refined yet

Buttle: He seemed to be struggling all the way through this - footwork and spins did not seem as sharp as they can be. Interesting music choice - Doesn't quite come off as amazing as most of his SP's do, but I like the program and think it will get alot better... this one demands something different interpretation-wise, not an easy one to interpret at all. I like that he's tackling it. Some brilliant moments, even now, but it will get better. Don't really think he was held up in PCS despite numerous mistakes/tight spots... the brilliant moments were really that good, and his PCS were soundly and rightfully beaten by Joubert anyway, and I don't think the others are as good, simply put.
Kurt seemed in awe of some of the choreo, from the standpoint of knowing how difficult some of it is,

Van Der Perren: Uninteresting. Commentators were rather down on him too. Can't remember details having seen this so late at night

Mabee: Interesting development in his sense of movement, as Kurt pointed out. A rather striking program!! Really interesting work from I think Lori Nicholl, and Chris seems quite committed to the interpretation BUT is just a little one-note still, and he needs more power. But really a nice program... perhaps my favourite until Buttle steps his up a bit.

Cipheur: Not sure if he'll ever be a star, but is rather fun to watch. WOW at his triple axel!! I was rolling my eyes at the cliche blues moves at the beginning, but still ended up enjoying watching him. (quite a contrast of styles from him to Mabee after him - Vaughn is squarely in the "jock" camp for sure)

 

[museksk8r]

Despite Brian's improvement in the presentation aspect, Stephane is still miles ahead of him in this aspect. Lambiel's body is more typical of a skater's frame and he has a much better ease of movement with his body than Joubert does, almost a balletic/dancer quality. Brian's frame seems more stocky and his movement more stiff. For me watching Stephane is like watching an artist share his emotions on a canvas of ice while watching Brian is like watching a gladiator fight a battle on the ice. Once again, it's a skating rivalry of artist vs. athlete and I much prefer the artist.

 

[bekalc]

Oh, I agree, I prefer watching Stephane.

But the thing is when everyone gets on Joubert's PCS, Joubert is a phenomal basic skater, he's better than Lambiel in that department. The issue with Joubert is he's just not a dancer.

In someways Joubert reminds me of Meissner with better jumps. But Joubert's PCS are going to show the fact that his basics are very good.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

as did every other big name multi title winners of the past... this crop is no different than previous generations... the tricks are just harder and the costumes change, but at the same time it's still skating... the ice is still slick and many times unforgiving...

ITA. I wish the music would change once in a while too, though.

True, but if Joubert has improved a lot aristically with this program, if I may say so and if he continues to improve he will be unbeatable.

As for Lambiel, I think the issue with him, is while he's wonderful, will he ever have a triple axel?

If Joubert's able to improve artistically, I think it's fair to say that Lambiel may also improve his triple axel. It's not like he's never landed it before.

Re: this competition. I sad for Buttle and sadder for Abbott. They both have such awesome programs.

 

[slutskayafan21]

There is no argument for Joubert winning 2006 Worlds, absolutely none. Like I said he will never deserve to win any title he doesnt win, to think Joubert would ever not win a title he deserved to win is proposterous. I am just reading again a poster stating they feel Joubert deserved a title the judges did not give him and I cant help but .

I think there is a much stronger argument that Takahashi deserved the 2007 World title based on Joubert's PCS being lowered slightly to what they should be, making it very close.

 

[bekalc]

There is no argument for Joubert winning 2006 Worlds, absolutely none. Like I said he will never deserve to win any title he doesnt win, to think Joubert would ever not win a title he deserved to win is proposterous. I am just reading again a poster stating they feel Joubert deserved a title the judges did not give him and I cant help but .

I think there is a much stronger argument that Takahashi deserved the 2007 World title based on Joubert's PCS being lowered slightly to what they should be, making it very close.

UGH, I didn't say Joubert deserved to win, I said there's an argument that Joubert should have won... Joubert was really held down in the qualifying rounds at that particular Worlds, and he was the only one who was clean through all 3 phases of the competition.. I didn't say though that Joubert should have won.

 

[slutskayafan21]

UGH, I didn't say Joubert deserved to win, I said there's an argument that Joubert should have won... Joubert was really held down in the qualifying rounds at that particular Worlds, and he was the only one who was clean through all 3 phases of the competition.. I didn't say though that Joubert should have won.

Joubert was not clean in the qualifying at the 2006 Worlds. He doubled both a triple loop and triple salchow late, and his second quad turned into a solo triple toe which is a killer under COP. Look at the protocals yourself:

http://www.isufs.org/results/wc2006/WC06_Men_QB_Scores.pdf

 

[bekalc]

Joubert was not clean in the qualifying at the 2006 Worlds. He doubled both a triple loop and triple salchow late, and his second quad turned into a solo triple toe which is a killer under COP. Look at the protocals yourself:

http://www.isufs.org/results/wc2006/WC06_Men_QB_Scores.pdf

True but didn't Lambiel have a much worse short program at that Worlds.

 

[slutskayafan21]

True but didn't Lambiel have a much worse short program at that Worlds.

Lambiel did not have as good a short program as Joubert, and was rightfully placed below. He wasnt that bad though, he landed a quad toe-double toe (opposed to the quad-triple he wanted) and dragged his free leg on the ice on the landing of the triple axel. He was placed 4th in the short, below Sandhu with a fall on a triple lutz and quadless but clean Oda, while Joubert wast 1st, so he definitely was not held up in the short IMO.

 

[museksk8r]

Yeah, I didn't get the placement of Stephane behind Emanuel in the SP at those Worlds . . . that was a big surprise! Lambiel was definitely not held up there.

 

[bekalc]

Lambiel did not have as good a short program as Joubert, and was rightfully placed below. He wasnt that bad though, he landed a quad toe-double toe (opposed to the quad-triple he wanted) and dragged his free leg on the ice on the landing of the triple axel. He was placed 4th in the short, below Sandhu with a fall on a triple lutz and quadless but clean Oda, while Joubert wast 1st, so he definitely was not held up in the short IMO.

What I'm suggesting is that I remember people saying that Joubert was underscored in the qualifying..Even with yeah, his mistakes.

 

[slutskayafan21]

Yeah, I didn't get the placement of Stephane behind Emanuel in the SP at those Worlds . . . that was a big surprise! Lambiel was definitely not held up there.

I think the reason is because it was in Canada. Nowhere else would the judges have marked it that way IMO. That being said I was hoping Sandhu could capatilize and win the bronze that year, since that was his last real chance and he almost did but not quite in the end.

 

[slutskayafan21]

What I'm suggesting is that I remember people saying that Joubert was underscored in the qualifying..Even with yeah, his mistakes.

Fine, but qualifying scores are divided by 4. He lost gold by over 3 points. So his score would need to increase alot, by about 14 points in qualifying, to win overall. As it was it was still enough to be in the final group for the short program, so he was not hurt that way either IMO.

 

[bekalc]

Fine, but qualifying scores are divided by 4. He lost gold by over 3 points. So his score would need to increase alot, by about 14 points in qualifying, to win overall. As it was it was still enough to be in the final group for the short program, so he was not hurt that way either IMO.

Once again, I don't have issues with Lambiel winning that competition, I just remember talk was that Joubert was underscored. Of course the most egregious example, where Joubert really should have won was the competition that year where Buttle fell twice and still beat Joubert. It was on the grand Prix circuit. Even Plushenko made comment about how he thought that was just completely wrong.

 

[Tinymavy15]

I am glad Joubert took his chance. the Men's SP was a splat feat, and he took advatage. Should be a easy win for him. Just plain luck getting Skate Canada. Now i wonder who will get 2nd?