Men's short

[cloudkicker09]

Good job Siberia82, taking on the man or possibly woman in this case

I am confident that Brian will come back with a vegence and will win the gold.

 

[Medusa]

My 2 cents

Bradley
He is pretty low in the standings, but he was good, the jumps were enormous, the spins horrific, he didn't seem as slow to me as he did at Skate Canada. I think that he and Préaubert were a bit underrated - it's like they both got hit by the KVDP-curse: Clean program, good jumps - but wait, you are not on our list of top artists/performers - let's give you around 30 for PCS.

Préaubert
He was solid. He said that he worked on his skating skills over the summer and it payed off in my opinion, good speed, nice flow. The program was a bit, I don't know, aimless perhaps. I don't know if the music in the Russian feed was perfectly synchronised - but if it was, then Préaubert missed the music a bit. One last thing - is it possible that the Triple Axel was downgraded? It looked like an awful lot of prerotation. But then again nearly 40 points for TES is pretty good, they really dinged him on the PCS...

Joubert
Artistry is not PCS. And in my opinion artistry should not be PCS. That would limit creativity and make the sport more boring. I think that Joubert deserves about the same PCS Kozuka and Chan get. Small differences (like Joubert getting 0.4 points more than Chan) seem to be purely subjective. If anything Kozuka got a bit too low scores. Joubert's skating skills are very good, he is very powerful and reasonably fast over the ice, there is a sureness about his skating, a self-confidence that certainly influences the PCS. And I loved the program, it was nicely built, well-executed except for the blunder in the beginning (cost him about 13 to 15 points - which is a lot). He could get close to 90 points with a clean performance.

Kozuka
Ahh, those skating skills are a thing of beauty. Incredible flow over the ice, even better than Superchan. A bit underrated in my opinion, especially with 0.25 less on the skating skills than Chan, where in my opinion Kozuka should beat the Wonderchan.

Chan
The superlatives used above are not purely sarcastic. I am amazed by the abilities of this very very young guy. This program doesn't seem to be his natural habitat - but he does very well in the wilderness. If you look at Lambiel's earlier performances to Latin music you see that Lambiel too lacked character and interpretation in those performances, he got that later with Poeta or Carne Cruda. If Chan does well tomorrow and is not handed the victory by the judges I will be very happy.

Footwork
With the introduction of COP footwork gained importance - and at the same time lost some of its appeal. Morosov/Nichol footwork sections were seen everywhere, choreographed by everyone. Lambiel was the dazzling exception. But watching the footwork of the three leading men I was amazed by the creativity. There were no slow painful steps with no connection to the music, no senseless flailing, no trying to catch the mice on the ice.

All three men have different but equally creative footwork, that suits the music. With Joubert I couldn't really tell when a footwork section started, he was skating very well to the music and the movements of the inbetweens were related to the movements during the footwork sections, everything belonged together - he had some great footwork last season, and he has great footwork this season, but it's still different from last season (some skaters seem to do the same footwork sections every year in the short and the long - Lysacek and Weir come to my mind, but I don't want to single them out, I think lots of skaters kind of repeat the same footwork over and over again). Chan has a great awareness of his body, he really reminds me of Lambiel - his entire body moves to the music. Kozuka's footwork seemed surreal, like watching painting of Kandinsky to some jazzy 20ties music.

So all men had very different footwork and very different programs; Joubert had the in-your-face showman footwork plus a very energetic crowd-pleasing performance, Chan had the interpretive footwork - he interpreted the Tango and moved well to the music. Kozuka has the surreal performance, where he doesn't really try to interpret the music (which is pretty complicated with this music anyway) but where the music, the skating, the skater and the expression of the skater come together to paint a picture, where the overall impression makes the program.

I loved those shorts. Amazing skating. Geez, I love the men.

 

[Tonichelle]

I know we already have a general reminder thread but I'll say it again

if there is something offensive do not go and police the board on your own. the best way to get this taken care of is to report the thread. The minute you respond to the post that creates a much more difficult job for the mods because in order to deal with the original we end up having to deal with the others who have joined the fight... once the water is muddied it's a whole new ball game.

 

[sillylionlove]

I know we already have a general reminder thread but I'll say it again

if there is something offensive do not go and police the board on your own. the best way to get this taken care of is to report the thread. The minute you respond to the post that creates a much more difficult job for the mods because in order to deal with the original we end up having to deal with the others who have joined the fight... once the water is muddied it's a whole new ball game.

Good post Toni. Well said. Thanks!!

 

[ks777]

My 2 cents

Bradley
He is pretty low in the standings, but he was good, the jumps were enormous, the spins horrific, he didn't seem as slow to me as he did at Skate Canada. I think that he and Préaubert were a bit underrated - it's like they both got hit by the KVDP-curse: Clean program, good jumps - but wait, you are not on our list of top artists/performers - let's give you around 30 for PCS.

Préaubert
He was solid. He said that he worked on his skating skills over the summer and it payed off in my opinion, good speed, nice flow. The program was a bit, I don't know, aimless perhaps. I don't know if the music in the Russian feed was perfectly synchronised - but if it was, then Préaubert missed the music a bit. One last thing - is it possible that the Triple Axel was downgraded? It looked like an awful lot of prerotation. But then again nearly 40 points for TES is pretty good, they really dinged him on the PCS...

Joubert
Artistry is not PCS. And in my opinion artistry should not be PCS. That would limit creativity and make the sport more boring. I think that Joubert deserves about the same PCS Kozuka and Chan get. Small differences (like Joubert getting 0.4 points more than Chan) seem to be purely subjective. If anything Kozuka got a bit too low scores. Joubert's skating skills are very good, he is very powerful and reasonably fast over the ice, there is a sureness about his skating, a self-confidence that certainly influences the PCS. And I loved the program, it was nicely built, well-executed except for the blunder in the beginning (cost him about 13 to 15 points - which is a lot). He could get close to 90 points with a clean performance.

Kozuka
Ahh, those skating skills are a thing of beauty. Incredible flow over the ice, even better than Superchan. A bit underrated in my opinion, especially with 0.25 less on the skating skills than Chan, where in my opinion Kozuka should beat the Wonderchan.

Chan
The superlatives used above are not purely sarcastic. I am amazed by the abilities of this very very young guy. This program doesn't seem to be his natural habitat - but he does very well in the wilderness. If you look at Lambiel's earlier performances to Latin music you see that Lambiel too lacked character and interpretation in those performances, he got that later with Poeta or Carne Cruda. If Chan does well tomorrow and is not handed the victory by the judges I will be very happy.

Footwork
With the introduction of COP footwork gained importance - and at the same time lost some of its appeal. Morosov/Nichol footwork sections were seen everywhere, choreographed by everyone. Lambiel was the dazzling exception. But watching the footwork of the three leading men I was amazed by the creativity. There were no slow painful steps with no connection to the music, no senseless flailing, no trying to catch the mice on the ice.

All three men have different but equally creative footwork, that suits the music. With Joubert I couldn't really tell when a footwork section started, he was skating very well to the music and the movements of the inbetweens were related to the movements during the footwork sections, everything belonged together - he had some great footwork last season, and he has great footwork this season, but it's still different from last season (some skaters seem to do the same footwork sections every year in the short and the long - Lysacek and Weir come to my mind, but I don't want to single them out, I think lots of skaters kind of repeat the same footwork over and over again). Chan has a great awareness of his body, he really reminds me of Lambiel - his entire body moves to the music. Kozuka's footwork seemed surreal, like watching painting of Kandinsky to some jazzy 20ties music.

So all men had very different footwork and very different programs; Joubert had the in-your-face showman footwork plus a very energetic crowd-pleasing performance, Chan had the interpretive footwork - he interpreted the Tango and moved well to the music. Kozuka has the surreal performance, where he doesn't really try to interpret the music (which is pretty complicated with this music anyway) but where the music, the skating, the skater and the expression of the skater come together to paint a picture, where the overall impression makes the program.

I loved those shorts. Amazing skating. Geez, I love the men.

Nice post!! thanks! I can watch Kozuka all day long, just watching his feet move.

 

[Mehdi]

He's fast, he's powerful, he's showing the athletism which is truly lacking in today's figure skating world. FS is losing market rapidly because only a few rabid fans are into a universe dominated by boring femnine performances by both girls and balleria-wantable male skaters such as Johnny Weir.

Thank you.

 

[Hsuhs]

Préaubert............. One last thing - is it possible that the Triple Axel was downgraded? It looked like an awful lot of prerotation. But then again nearly 40 points for TES is pretty good, they really dinged him on the PCS...

I agree, it did. To tell the truth, I found his 3F to be 1/2 prerotated as well.
Also, madam Zazoui, IMO, has done wonders with Alban's posture.

 

[Mathman]

...male skaters such as Johnny Weir.

? Is Johnny Weir at Eric Bompard? Please try to stick to the topic, or post in the appropriate folder.

 

[ks777]

? Is Johnny Weir at Eric Bompard? Please try to stick to the topic, or post in the appropriate folder.

I heard Yagudin was there watching!

 

[Eevun]

I just watched Joubert's skate. O_O He almost gave me a heart attack when he popped out that quad! Even though I already knew it and was prepared, I thought... It almost looked like he didn't took off from the ice. Omg, omg, omg...
Just a thought. Wont his costume fall under rule 500.2 in Special Regulation & Technical Rules of 2008?

The clothing of the Competitiors must be modest, dignified and appropriate for athletic competition [...]
a) The clothing must not give the effect of excessive nudity for athletic sport.

Ok, maybe he think it's very warm and he needed some ventilation holes. But what do I know...

 

[Bennett]

Wow, a surprise from men, too! But I think that any of the top three could win. So cool:agree: Kozuka seems to have falled at rather a bizarre place.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I have to agree that Preaubert and Bradley were underscored. One really has to assess a skater by what he did right then and there. Not the historic skater who did wonders some time ago.

Unless the answers to the following couple of questions are known, can we really say the SP is to ensure a skater has the ability to perform at the Senior Level.

How serious is leaving out a required element in the SP? Is it just a no credit as it would be in an LP?

How serious is a leaving out one jump from a Combo? Same as in the LP?

If the answers to these questions is 'the same as in the LP' then why have an SP?

For me, Preaubert and Bradley passed the Tech test, and their PCS were more than adequate. Since this SP is primarily a Tech test, the PCS scores should almost be irrelevant but no more than 20 per cent of the total score.

 

[Bennett]

I don't know it's just me, but I thought Joubert has become cuter, although I had never gotten why he was considered hot before. His hairstyle changed?

 

[siberia82]

Bradley is the only skater who landed a clean quad in the SP, yet I don't hear Joubert insisting that Bradley should've won this segment of the competition. Just an observation...

 

[bekalc]

Bradley is the only skater who landed a clean quad in the SP, yet I don't hear Joubert insisting that Bradley should've won this segment of the competition. Just an observation...

Bradley isn't on the same level as the top men are basic skating wise. There's no comparision in this situation. Bradley's basic skating is poor. And going up against three guys (Chan, Kozuka, and Joubert) who all have great skating skills, he really suffers in comparision.

 

[turtle]

I don't know exactly why, but I just love Chan's programs this year. Perhaps his choice of music or perhaps he has become much more expressive this season. His programs move me. I just hope that he will skate a clean program tomorrow so that he will show that he 'deserves' to win this time. Joubert can certainly challenge Chan and win it all tomorrow especially if Chan skates like in SC. I agree Joubert looks cuter for some reason this season. As a matter of fact I think he is the cutest of all male skaters.

 

[siberia82]

Bradley isn't on the same level as the top men are basic skating wise. There's no comparision in this situation. Bradley's basic skating is poor. And going up against three guys (Chan, Kozuka, and Joubert) who all have great skating skills, he really suffers in comparision.

I'm not disagreeing with the results. I saw Bradley's LP live at SC, and his skating is rather sluggish and "clunky". All I wanted to point out is that Brian complains when it suits him. He implied with his ill-timed remark that he deserved the gold at Worlds because he had quads in his programs while Jeff had none. If Brian was truly a man of his word, he would've protested about the unfairness of Ryan being ranked behind him in the SP. Brian's silence seems somewhat hypocritical to me, that's all.

 

[fumie_fumie]

I'm not disagreeing with the results. I saw Bradley's LP live at SC, and his skating is rather sluggish and "clunky". All I wanted to point out is that Brian complains when it suits him. He implied with his ill-timed remark that he deserved the gold at Worlds because he had quads in his programs while Jeff had none. If Brian was truly a man of his word, he would've protested about the unfairness of Ryan being ranked behind him in the SP. Brian's silence seems somewhat hypocritical to me, that's all.

This is a bit off-topic, but did you notice all the girl fans of Bradley at SC? Half a dozen girls sitting in front of me screamed on top of their lungs for Bradley. Oh my goodness, you wouldn't believe it.

 

[bekalc]

Personally Joe, I think that missing an element in the short should incur an automatic 2 point deduction, along with automatic 3 GOE points... (It should be altogether three for a fall) that's my personal opinion on this subject.

I'm not disagreeing with the results. I saw Bradley's LP live at SC, and his skating is rather sluggish and "clunky". All I wanted to point out is that Brian complains when it suits him. He implied with his ill-timed remark that he deserved the gold at Worlds because he had quads in his programs while Jeff had none. If Brian was truly a man of his word, he would've protested about the unfairness of Ryan being ranked behind him in the SP. Brian's silence seems somewhat hypocritical to me, that's all.

Once again, how so? Joubert never said quads were the only thing that mattered... (I don't recall him saying that)... I mean we are talking about the difference between two good basic skaters (and the difference a quad should make. Albeit with two completely different styles but two solid skaters)

And a skater with very mediocre below par skating skills versus three skaters who have some of the best skating skills in the world. You can't compare the two scenarios.

Besides I could be wrong, but I bet that Bradley's TES scores were extremely hard, it was the PCS that rightfully kept him down) It was Joubert's TES that kept him down not the PC marks...I thought Joubert would have had a better argument though if he had done a more COP friendly program. If Joubert had done three quads and still lost to Buttle he'd have a big reason to complain.

Or when Joubert lost to Buttle that one time when he was clean and Buttle fell several times (Joubert had reason to complain there too!)

 

[siberia82]

This is a bit off-topic, but did you notice all the girl fans of Bradley at SC? Half a dozen girls sitting in front of me screamed on top of their lungs for Bradley. Oh my goodness, you wouldn't believe it.

Yeah, I noticed the crowd went completely NUTS over Bradley! (I confess to being one of them---I yelled out "You're hot, Ryan!" before he took his opening pose, and I'm usually too shy to do anything that "fan girlish"! ) Only Shawn's LP received a more enthusiastic response. I hope Ryan was very touched by the fact that many Canadian fans have adopted him as one of our own!

Once again, how so? Joubert never said quads were the only thing that mattered... (I don't recall him saying that)... I mean we are talking about the difference between two good basic skaters (and the difference a quad should make. Albeit with two completely different styles but two solid skaters)

And a skater with very mediocre below par skating skills versus three skaters who have some of the best skating skills in the world. You can't compare the two scenarios.

Joubert dismissed Buttle's programs at Worlds as not having any "great difficulty", so clearly he doesn't consider Jeff to be his equal as a skater. Brian made no mention of the in-between stuff (that was Buttle and Weir's rebuttal to his argument) as to why he deserved to be the winner; he focused solely on the quad. By his own limited definition of what makes a good athlete, Bradley trumped him in the SP at TEB.