Nathan Chen
- Thread starter matmuh
- Start date
He won against Yuzuru. And when you win against a popular skater with the types of fans Yuzuru has, the bashing is inevitable. Figure skating is not that serious so I just scroll past those threads or skim through the comments, like that 3rd one they've got going on now, lol.
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- Joined
- Apr 4, 2016
Someone commented that Nathan does not know how to skate at all, only jump. It's those kind of comments that get me to react. I just shouldn't read those threads at all.
I would suggest to not read them if it gets a rise out of you. It's usually the same people, or types of people if their new, complaining anyway
. Sport, especially ones like FS where it is very subjective on how spectators view skaters and even how it is judged by professional judges, is never serious imo to argue about. His LP is crappy this season but I think Nathan has wonderful skating skills, as do many other commentators. And he's demonstrated that in his EX and past programs. But if others don't want to see that cause he beat their fav well... 
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I don't think his LP is that crappy. He still skates to the music and tries to land the jumps on the music. When he executes his LP cleanly like at GPF, the performance still has a pretty good impact on the viewers. But the perception of the LP really depends on the execution of the elements. I think the execution of any program significantly impacts the reception of that program.
I honestly don't think Nathan or his team expected him to be so successful this year so the FS was just meant to be a vehicle to showcase his jumps and get noticed by the judges. I also suspect they wanted to make the other top skaters a little nervous and hopefully induce them to raise their technical content beyond what they are capable of handling.
In other news, Nathan appears to be becoming quite well known in Japan. According to a survey he ranked #10 on the list of most internet searched athletes in Japan for the month of February. Honda (#9), Mihara (#8), Uno (#7), and Hanyu (#1) were also included. I believe Nathan was the only foreigner on the list.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5daf1c
In other news, Nathan appears to be becoming quite well known in Japan. According to a survey he ranked #10 on the list of most internet searched athletes in Japan for the month of February. Honda (#9), Mihara (#8), Uno (#7), and Hanyu (#1) were also included. I believe Nathan was the only foreigner on the list.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5daf1c
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- Joined
- Feb 13, 2017
"Crappy" is an insult to Nathan's LP. It's not sophisticated, yet it's not as bad as many people have belittled it. The last step sequence is the most passionate one among the final group, and Nathan, after doing 5 quads, still had the energy to perform it so passionately and accurately, every step was to the beat. Even the speed of his spins matched the tempo of the music. Too bad many Hanyu fans choose to not see it. But it doesn't matter. The judges did.
- Joined
- Sep 25, 2016
I am irked by the notion that when Nathan (or even some other skater) gets criticized it's always the Hanyu fans. "Many" of his fans have the consensus that Nathan's LP is empty until the step sequence (it's the truth right? besides, not everyone will love his LP, even Yuzu gets criticized for his H&L). And I share this similar thought, so what does it say about the rest of the program? "Crappy" maybe too strong of a word but perhaps for other fans of other skaters if it's not sophisticated it's crappy! The stsq is one element and he did wonderfully on this and we Hanyu fans don't deny he is a talented jumper. Majority of the complaints come from the judging that Nathan receives almost the same score for SS and transitions as Yuzuru / Patrick (which is laughable, but doesn't matter now really). Nathan is only 17 and I'd hope he'd make his programs more sophisticated in the future, at least add steps before his jumps. Many Hanyu fans also think Nathan's SP is nice. Anyway, end of rant gotta go to the edge to see the source. :dev2:
- Joined
- Apr 4, 2016
That is also my evaluation of this year. They had a plan to get his name out there and his main goal was to get through a season without injury (which he has done so far). I don't think anyone expected this fast rise. His season has been a complete upward trajectory. I recall that Nathan talked about getting to senior worlds to get his name out there. We're not even at worlds yet and everyone is talking about him. Pretty crazy when you think about his first grand prix event and how so many thought he was taking on too much too soon.
His current LP is an insult to what he can do. I stand by my original opinion that this season's LP isn't good or "crappy". He's a first year senior and it's a great vehicle to show off his jumps but that's about it. He tries to sell it, but choreographically it's just not that great. This season's SP is though. I like Nathan and you can go in my previous posts and see that, but just because I like him, doesn't mean I'm going to call something good when I don't think it is. And it doesn't mean I'm a Hanyu fan either.
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- Feb 13, 2017
Currently Nathan cannot perform a LP full of transitions and with 5 quads. This season he chooses to focus on the jumps. Now that the jumps are stable, I am sure next thing he will work on is the 2nd marks. It's not fair for you to say "His current LP is an insult to what he can do". He has a plan, he knows how to reach his goal.
p.s. Let's not forget he was injured last year and off ice for 5.5 months! Don't you think you are too demanding?
p.s. Let's not forget he was injured last year and off ice for 5.5 months! Don't you think you are too demanding?
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The bolded I agree with and has been what I have been saying all over this forum. However, his LP still isn't very good. And that's okay. He's a first year senior and is still growing. He will get there.
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Lol, I for sure think he will. I think if Marina would have choreographed his LP, it would have been better like his SP, but I think this season was about him getting his jumps in order since he was injured. I can't wait to see what types of programs they (Marina?) makes for him next season. :agree:
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- Feb 13, 2017
Based on his interviews, his original goals were: 1. make it to the WC, meaning at least a silver at the Nationals; 2. land 5 quads in the competition, because he can.
I don't think either he or his coach expect things would happen to him so fast.
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- Joined
- Apr 4, 2016
I think the plan to take this season to focus on getting his tech solid was what he needed. I don't think Nathan or anyone else on his team thought he's be in the talks to win the world championships this year, this early.
Next year it will be fun to see what they come up with, and where Nathan will go once he has more coreography in his long. I personally think it is not as horrendus as some of the posters around GS have said, they picked nice bombastic music which worked with what he was offering. I just can't wait to see the full package of the musical side of Nathan brought in with his tech.
Next year it will be fun to see what they come up with, and where Nathan will go once he has more coreography in his long. I personally think it is not as horrendus as some of the posters around GS have said, they picked nice bombastic music which worked with what he was offering. I just can't wait to see the full package of the musical side of Nathan brought in with his tech.
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- Feb 13, 2017
To be honest, I agree Nathan's LP's PCS should be one or two points lower, but his SP's PCS should be one point higher. I believe the judges were determined to award the gold to the first man to land 5 quads in a program.
The PCS and GOE are relative scores, not absolute scores. I generally only look at the gap of goe and pcs between two skaters, not the absolute values of pcs and goe a skater gets because the pcs and goe can either get inflated or deflated depending on how generous or stingy the judges are, the location and time of the competition. E.g. GOE and PCS are deflated at the beginning of the Olympic cycle and gets more inflated as we approach the Olympics. Frankly, I think all top skaters are overscored in GOE & PCS relative to 2nd tier or 3rd tier skaters. What should the appropriate pcs and goe gap be? The way I see is that the PCS & GOE advantage you give to a skater is equivalent to how many error cushions you want to give to that skater, i.e. how many mistakes do you allow that skater to have and still outscore a clean performance of same bv by a skater in the same tier? After the rule change in 2010, the deduction for mistakes decreased significantly in order to encourage men to attempt quads. A fall only gets 3-5 points now. So a pcs gap of more than 5 points mean a skater can win with a fall. Unless I want to reward flawed performances and controversial wins, which is exactly what happened many times before Sochi, I wouldn't give more than 5 point PCS gap between two medal contenders when they both give clean performances. The judges don't necessarily think like me, or do the math like I do. But with the way feds are pushing their top skaters before the Olympics, and judges being afraid to judge outside the corridors, that's the result you will get, i.e. the PCS & GOE gap is small among medal contenders. The end result is a skater with a flawed performance can't win over a cleaner performance. Whoever skates the cleanest or makes the least mistakes will win, especially at the Olympics.
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ETA: Relatively speaking, the margin between Nathan and yuzuru's PCS at 4CC is about right. When Yuzuru's fans suggest that Nathan should be scored lower, while Yuzuru's PCS stays the same, the implication (whether or not it's intentional) is that Nathan doesn't deserve to win 4CC because Nathan will lose 4CC if he scores a few points lower in PCS. So if Nathan is overscored in PCS, Yuzuru is also overscored in PCS because Nathan deserves to win that title. The reason that many Yuzu fans' complaints result in negative perception from non-Yuzu fans is that they think Nathan is overscored while Yuzuru isn't overscored. But they are both equally overscored relative to 2nd and 3rd tier skaters. In fact, all of Patrick, Shoma, Nathan and Yuzuru's PCS were significantly higher than the rest of the field at 4CC because judges see them as medal contenders. (Patrick got almost 93 for a messy skate. Shoma got almost 92 for falling twice. Javier got 93 for a very messy skates in Euro.)
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- Feb 13, 2017
@gsyzf that's an interesting way to interpret PCS! I never thought that way. As to 4cc, I believe Nathan deserved the title. Although I agree his LP PCS should be 87, but it's still enough for him to win. I think because his performance was monumental, the judges would rather see he got the gold when the two actually had a tie. The 5 quads were the tie breaker!
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I was expecting Nathan's PCS to be 86-87 and Yuzuru's PCS to be 92+. The margin is still about 6 points. (If Nathan was cleaner, the margin will be smaller.) But judges gave Javier 93+ PCS for a very messy skate in Euro, then they would have to give Yuzuru a higher PCS for a performance with much less mistakes. Judges actually gave similar PCS to top skaters of all discipline (except ladies because 2 top skaters withdrew from 4CC) at Euro and 4CC. So if Yuzuru's PCS goes up, Nathan's PCS will also go up.
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- Feb 13, 2017
Do you think the PCS at worlds will be different because of the European judges are involved?
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