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- Jun 21, 2003
OK, now we're getting somewhere! :agree: I bet he hasn't forgotten the hula-hoop girl either (but he probably doesn't want to admit it to his girl friend. 
)
Sasha. Comeback. Believe it.
- Thread starter Particle Man
- Start date
OK, now we're getting somewhere! :agree: I bet he hasn't forgotten the hula-hoop girl either (but he probably doesn't want to admit it to his girl friend. )
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- Mar 23, 2008
Particle Man said:
That with all the Sasha-bashing and hype over the new girls, Sasha is still the only US lady to get a GPF medal in the past 5 1/2 years.
The GPF is listed by USFSA as being the second most important factor, after Nationals, in determining Olympic spots.
Conclusion -- it doesn't seem likely that anyone will score high enough GPF results to sway USFSA from overturning Nationals results, unless it's Sasha herself, and she has a series of minor miracles (strong and injury-free, and placing well at 2 GP events, then medaling at GPF.) And if she did all that, it would be amazing if she didn't even get silver at Nats. Well, unless she got a GPF medal and then got injured and couldn't go to Nats. Add that to my list as an extremely unlikely scenario.
So, I don't see the "priority list" as being very important. My own list still stands, and incidentally it already takes last season's 4CC and Worlds into account. The only new thing I am noticing -- it seems their list of priorities does not include the PREVIOUS season's Nationals. Does that mean Alissa is at square one again?
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- Feb 17, 2007
Um .... If you're talking about this thread, this is page 27. But my browser is set for 15 notes per page.
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- Feb 5, 2004
Hello....Caroline also beat Rachael at WTT.......
Caroline was sick as a dog at Jr Worlds. She came back and easily beat Alena in the LP, and beat her again at WTT. Alena is a nice but somewhat unpolished skater who will be 19 or 20 soon. Caroline just turned 16 a few days ago. Please dont stretch the facts to fit a point you are trying to make. I claim that privilige for myself
I don't think that was the point MM was making. Simply that Junior worlds and WTT don't have any place in the US selection criteria for the Olympic team, so it's irrelevant how she skated at those two events.
Ant
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- Feb 5, 2004
I just don't see how the USFSA could justify sending Sasha unless she comes in teht op two at Nationals. Even if she wins SA unless she gets another GP assignment she won't make the final. If Caroline and Rachel both make the final, and they come 1 and 2 at nationals, applying the guidelines they have well and truly pipped Sasha to the post.
Ant
My point was-the most recent GPF before the Olympics is on the priority list, not whoever was most recent medalist. That criteria is still TBD. If no Lady makes GPF or podium, than it is a non-factor in selecting team.
Why don't we see what happens this fall? You never know, someone may surprise us all, qualify for the GPF and medal! And I agree-if Sasha is healthy enough to make it to the GPF and medal, she should be right there to snatch top 1-2 at Nats.
Yes, Alissa IS at square one. She doesn't have any advantage over anyone else. Noone medaled at Worlds. It's TBD if anyone medals at GPF. The playing field should be leveled, but there will always be favoritism.
I don't se the "priority list" as being taken into huge consideration, especially with two spots. I think this "list" is more for if someone requests a bye, and unless Rachel wins GPF and then has a minor injury and can't be at Nats, I don't think any of the Ladies have a leg to stand on as far as a bye goes (and that is if TBTP decide 5th place at Worlds is of any importance). All in all, I believe whoever is top 2 at Nationals will make the team, even if, say, Ashley is 3rd at GPF and 3rd/4th at Nationals.
We can look just at what happened with Johnny this year-he was 3rd at 2008 Worlds, 3rd at the GPF, podium finishes at Nats for years, but his 5th at 2009 Nationals left him off the team. Granted, the top 3 made the decision easy-I believe had Jeremy not won GPF and Evan had won Nats and Johnny was 4th, the powers that be may have finagled things and placed Johnny on the team.
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
What puzzles me the most is the Olympic Committee permitting former podium aathletes to compete at their next Games. What is the Olympic Committee's point for these invitations only to be ignored by the Federations which will send whomever they please. can anyone explain that?
I think the Olympic Committee should qualify all former podium athletes as an additional qualifyers to compete irregardless of their national status.
I think the Olympic Committee should qualify all former podium athletes as an additional qualifyers to compete irregardless of their national status.
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- Feb 5, 2004
Joe can you explain where this rule comes from because I have never heard of the IOC or a national Olympic Committee permitting any former Olympic Athlete (podium or otherwise) to attend the Games without being selected by the national governing body of the particular sport.
It is always down to the NGB to put forward its athletes for the games and the national Olympic committee approves it. The only thing i've ever known national Olympic Committees do is put forward more stringent guidelines e.g. the British Olympic Association for years stated that if a skater did not make the top half of the draw at the worlds previous to the Olympics then they cannot go to the Olympics (the rule is now more lenient).
I understand that the swedish Olympic COmmittee wants it's singles skaters to have been top 8 in the previous worlds or they don't get to go.
I think that would be a pretty good rule to put forward for Olympics and worlds. A personal invite to the podium finishers (you can't substitue them for smoeone else on the national sqaud) and then the qualifying spots in addition to that.
Ant
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2007
I was at the Hartford, CT show in April 2006. The hula hoop girl put on quite a show.
http://gallery.photo.net/photo/4381693-lg.jpg
I haven't either.
I wonder if Joe is confused about this document:
http://www.usfigureskating.org/cont... WOG FSK Athlete Selection Procedures web.pdf
It's selection procedures that US Figure Skating had to submit to the US Olympic Committee outlining how they will select athletes for the the 2010 Olympic team. In other words, USOC sent a form with questions about qualifying procedures to all the Olympic sport governing bodies, and USFS had to fill it out with the details specific to figure skating.
Page 1 lists the six events (Nationals first, followed by five international events, as already discussed in this thread) that they will directly consider in choosing the team. Page 2 asks about how athletes qualify for those events. The USFS answer starts by outlining the qualifying system of how skaters qualify for Nationals through regionals and sectionals. Then it gives a list of criteria by which a skater can earn a bye ("invitation") directly to Nationals. One of those criteria is being a medalist at the most recent (2006) Olympics, and Sasha Cohen and Belbin and Agosto are listed by name because it's already known exactly who fulfills that particular criterion.
I can imagine how someone reading that document carelessly might take the fact that it's a USOC document about 2010 Olympic team selection and the fact that Sasha Cohen is specifically mentioned as eligible to receive an invitation based on her 2006 Olympic medal and put them together into the belief that the Olympic Committee has already chosen Cohen to receive an invitation to the Olympic team. However, that belief would be incorrect.
To repeat: It's a form that USFS submitted to USOC that mentions that USFS would invite Cohen directly to compete at US Nationals.
It mentions no invitation from the USOC nor any invitation directly to the Olympic team.
Oh, and by the way, Joe uses both the words "permitting" and "invitation," as if being permitted automatically means being selected to go. It would be more accurate to use it to mean eligible to be selected.
And of course medalists from previous Olympics are permitted in the sense of being eligible, unless they have actively given up their eligibility in some way. That doesn't mean they've already been selected for the team. We've often seen previous Olympic medalists return to subsequent Olympics, including some American skaters (Boitano, Kerrigan, Kwan), whether having competed actively through all the years in between or having taken time off. But sometimes a former Olympic medalist attempts to make the next Olympic team and falls short (e.g., Goebel). There's no guarantee.
[musing about the International Olympic Committee hypothetically inviting past medalists to compete at the next games]
I like this in the sense that it would be a way to add star power and attract media attention to the Games without lessening the chances of other up and coming athletes from countries with strong fields from also achieving the Olympic experience. The top of the field would only be stronger, assuming that the returning athletes are still competitive, which is great for audiences.
And I wouldn't be worried about the invited past medalists being handed medals on the next try without earning them on the ice that time -- we've seen the results of former Olympic medalists when they return to a subsequent Olympics, especially after time off.
However, would that cut down the number of total Olympic slots available, for countries that have to fight it out for the final slots at the fall Olympic qualifying competition?
I guess if the invitations are only for medalists from the Olympics immediately preceding, not from 8 or 12 years ago, then there would only be a maximum of 3 extra entries per discipline. That wouldn't cut the bottom of the field by too much . . . and the IOC might be willing to allow up to 3 past medalists as bonus competitors in addition to a full field, because their presence would increase the length of the competition by approximately half an hour, but the publicity they draw might be worth it.
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- Oct 22, 2005
But for the Olympics, the National Champion is not guaranteed a berth.
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- Jun 21, 2003
This is an interesting idea, but I don't think it will ever happen. As detailed in the first part of your post, the Olympic Committee does not invite athletes to compete in the Olympic Games. Rather, each nation is invited to send its champions.
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- Feb 5, 2004
I love the Queen's English!
I didn't realise it wasn't a phrase used in the US (assuming it isn't!)Ant
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- Feb 5, 2004
^ The only reason I knew about it is that my wife watches Coronation Street every day.
That's news to me - they show coronation street in the US
Manchester isn't really like that (except the weather - that part is completely right
)Ant
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- Jul 11, 2003
Joe has never read that ISU document. He was looking for an Olympic Committee document. Having read that now, I am not confused about the ISU regulations, but would like to know if anything exists from the OIC regulations. If nothing then end of story.
Very happy and surprised you do appreciate my thoughts on this even though you used a later post to discuss it. And yes, it is just a thought. Now if you want to give some real information about what the deliberations will be like during the Sub-Committee meetings in choosing the Team, please do. Nothing general, we all know that, but specifics.
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