Stojko Speaks Out

[ImaginaryPogue]

But because he implicitly says something between lines or because your you want to understand implicitly something.?

Probably both, but I'll say the former. While there's probably a bit of me reading too much into these comments based on his previous comments and general attitude, I don't see how you can read his comments here and dismiss my thoughts out of hand either.

 

[i love to skate]

I knew I was going to be in the dog house for saying that. Well, anyway, for whatever reason Skate Canada lost control of a well-intentioned public relations campaign, which unfortunately came back to bite them in the behind.

A large part of what happened was due to poor journalism and reporting. Journalists made assumptions and misinterpreted words and statements that people from SC had said. I don't think it really came back to bite them, for the most part it has long been forgotten and hasn't affected interest in skating here at all.

Elvis has had nothing to do with Skate Canada for a very long time and he carries a huge chip on his shoulder for Canada for whatever reason. He comes across as a bitter, bitter man. Just look at this article:
http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2009/05/03/9330621-sun.html

 

[jennylovskt]

I knew I was going to be in the dog house for saying that. Well, anyway, for whatever reason Skate Canada lost control of a well-intentioned public relations campaign, which unfortunately came back to bite them in the behind.

Yes, MM, that's where we should put you if you say that. Stoijko massed up with Skate Canada's well intentioned plan and mislead the campaign. So he was the one to be blamed, not Skate Canada!

 

[sk8rdad]

Elvis's motivations are somewhat suspect as well. He is currently reviving his touring career and making controversial statements assures him media attention.

 

[champs]

http://web.icenetwork.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100117&content_id=7929494&vkey=ice_news

"Technically, he(Plushenko)'s almost untouchable. I see that he's practicing triple Axel, quad toe just for fun. (the rest omitted)"

I'm wondering if the author of the article understood what Stojko meant exactly and this is just the way she denotes a combination jump, or if she did not know what he was talking about and misinterpreted it as just two individual jumps.

 

[Nadine]

You know I was thinking a lot about Elvis today because of this article, and I hope he's allright, because practically every article that comes out about him always seems slanted in such a way as to cast kind of a bad light on one of my favorite skaters of all time. Thus, I can see how people might think he has a chip on his shoulder.

Elvis is so very talented & strong willed, not to mention his mental toughness is unsurpassed. If one were to look up the word in the dictionary there would be a picture of Elvis Stojko. So I was thinking why doesn't he go to college, or at least become a judge! I honestly think Elvis's presence in that aspect of figure skating would be monumental/earth shattering/unprecedented. What changes he could make, just thinking about it gives me chills!!!!!!!!!!

 

[prettykeys]

Yes, I agree with some of his points. What I don't agree with is his extremely narrow view of masculine behaviour and the massive chip on his shoulder comes through in his comments. He's also got a different view of what powerful skating is. Additionally, in between the lines, implicitly he is commenting about gender roles in a way I find harmful and spurious at best.

Elvis Stojko, in that interview, made a lot of good points. Also, his story and the way he is living is quite fascinating to me--he seems very independent, strong-willed, and prefers doing things by his own ideals, which I deeply respect.

However, I agree with you, Pogue, on some of the questionable links that were made between "masculine"; "ballet = boring"; "strong and powerful." And WHO in the HECK made the stupid connection between a preference for "masculine" as "anti-gay"? Effeminate =/= Gay, silly journalists...

My take on it is that ballet is neither boring or non-masculine. There is a reason why male ballet dancers are ripped. It is an extremely demanding discipline. Now Elvis doesn't like ballet, or overly soft and lyrical figure skating performances by men, and that's fine. I guess what he meant is that he wants it to be more macho. I can accept that, even if I agree more with the posters here who'd rather have a "complete presentation."

Besides that, I don't get the sense that Elvis is bitter or has a chip on his shoulder against Canada.

If I recall the original Canadian article correctly, I believe they had pictures of Plushenko and Johnny Weir up. Which is ironic, considering that Elvis does appreciate Plushenko and believes he will be the one to beat.

 

[jcoates]

I thought the recruiting program was ill-conceived as well. Stojko was also not the only one getting hammered publicly. Debbi Wilkes also got a fair amount of criticism as did Slipchuck.

Regarding perceptions of powerful skating, isn't part of great skating the ability to make the difficult look easy? Does power always have to be obvious, knock-you-over-the-head type of stuff? One of the reasons people love Kurt is because he made a lot of powerful stuff look delightfully simple. Looking back as some of his competitive stuff, I realize there was a lot of hidden difficulty in them I failed to appreciate at the time.

 

[schiele]

Elvis is really a sentimental favourite of mine. I actually don't think he feels bitterness at all.



That was actually the most interesting thing he said. I always thought and still do that he took himself dead serious. I don't mean playing air guitar or doing some fun stuff on the ice but the way he sees himself and constructs his own myth and legend.

Has anyone read the title page of his web site? I strongly recommend it :agree:

Hmmm, just saw it...

I am also sure he takes himself and what he has brought to the sport very very seriously. Unfortunately some of the good points he has made come off as very biased and bitter and make him look very unfavourable. He will always remain my fav canadian male skater but I happen to think his insistence on tieing masculine skating to not being gay and implying the lyrical skaters are sissies is not very constructive or open minded approach. I always happen to agree with his enthusiasm that men skating should feel powerful and energetic and push the envelope technically but that doesn't mean different styles shouldn't exist or mens skating should all look like his or Plushy's, Joubert's, Lysacek's style. A skater should develop the style that comes the most natural to him and I hope to think such variety can exist and be welcomed under this system. What is worrying, however, is that some coaches are becoming more and more predominant in the skating world and are creating COP friendly look-a-likes rather than individual skaters. That, I do not want to see.

Btw, K, I love your new banner! I hope we won't jinx anything..

 

[janetfan]

Elvis Stojko, in that interview, made a lot of good points. Also, his story and the way he is living is quite fascinating to me--he seems very independent, strong-willed, and prefers doing things by his own ideals, which I deeply respect.

)

I have been to Guadalajara and have thought of moving there when I have had enough of the rat race and cold weather.

Nearbye is Lake Chapala and the largest community of Canadian and American expatriates in the world.

Many say the climate is the best in the world and the people are very friendly.
It is a center for Mexican arts and crafts and an interesting place to live. The town of Tequila is closeby

Hard for me to know if Elvis is bitter but his life sure sounds very interesting.

 

[janetfan]

And you could always drive over to San Miguel and pay Toller a visit.

I didn't know Toller was living in San Miguel - but it is supposed to be a good place for painters and artists.

 

[Buttercup]

And you could always drive over to San Miguel and pay Toller a visit.

I wish some skaters would drive over to San Miguel and talk him into doing choreo again. Wasn't Toller the choreographer for Lulu's Last Emperor? That was an awesome program and vastly preferable to most everything around today. I bet he could come up with cool programs even for the current system.

As for the Elvis interview, schiele said it perfectly.

 

[Sk8n Mama]

*cringe* about his career in music business. I dunno. I love ya Elvis but, really, music?

As far as what he's saying I can understand.

1) the marks at Canadians were significantly higher than at US Nats. I noticed that right away. It proves there's still a lack of consistency in CoP.

2) I don't like that CoP has put it so far away from the jumps. The jumps are the tricks. While it shouldn't become "figure jumping" (which was kind of Elvis' style), I have concerns that it's moving too far away from the jumps. I thought the idea of the CoP was to reward all elements to make sure the programs were more balanced, now I think they're too balanced. And I think this is why maybe the reference to the "ballet recital", not to mention almost every skater is skating to the same old classical music that's been used hundreds of times.

3) I do appreciate a more masculine style as long as it still incorporates fluidity. Some male skaters have a tendency to do a big trick then stand in the middle of the ice posing or maing a face to the music for 5-10 seconds to regroup. That's not artistic either, even if it's a little more 'masculine'. Jeremy Abbott does a good job of keeping it masculine while keeping it fluid and artistic, IMO.

I think this debate between the jumpers and the "program components" skaters will be huge in Vancouver. It's been talked about plenty within the ISU skaters (ie: Brian Joubert) but that's not the same as putting it under the microscope of the international public, the way the Olympics will. Personally, I'm finding myself caught in the middle. I guess I don't want it to be an either/or choice: I just want to see some exciting jumping mixed with some artistry, edges and quality spins. Is that wrong?

 

[schiele]

I think this debate between the jumpers and the "program components" skaters will be huge in Vancouver. It's been talked about plenty within the ISU skaters (ie: Brian Joubert) but that's not the same as putting it under the microscope of the international public, the way the Olympics will. Personally, I'm finding myself caught in the middle. I guess I don't want it to be an either/or choice: I just want to see some exciting jumping mixed with some artistry, edges and quality spins. Is that wrong?

Nope, that's what we all want! But since not all can be Lambiel or Abbott, I'm ok with "less balanced" skaters more skewed to one pole or the other, as long as they bring their best to the table.
In general, I agree with most of what you say. I feel I am especially concerned of something blowing up at the olympics, especially given the increasing inconsistency in scores lately.

 

[janetfan]

Since you brought up Toller earlier - I prefer this:

http://www.jenkinsshowlergallery.com/dynamic/artwork_display.asp?ArtworkID=5276

I like anything better than your previous link

 

[Mathman]

What exactly is "masculine" skating?

When Brian Joubert and Evan Lysacek put on their make-up and theatrical costumes and go out to perform, what exactly do they do that makes them more "masculine" than Lambiel or Chan?

 

[janetfan]

You don't want to sign him on the spot?

Nicht tue ich nicht

 

[antmanb]

What exactly is "masculine" skating?

When Brian Joubert and Evan Lysacek put on their make-up and theatrical costumes and go out to perform, what exactly do they do that makes them more "masculine" than Lambiel or Chan?

Silliness Warning!

I'm surprised you even have to ask MM - Brian thrusts his hips in a totally-not-gay way and the females in the audience scream, if there's any doubt he does the "running man" later on.

Evan throws his arms around with no style, tension or poise whatsoever thus proving he's a real man when he flaps his arms ;-)

You can now return to your normal viewing.

Ant

 

[janetfan]

Is anything more fashionable and masculine than the mighty finger?

http://erikabranca.blog.uol.com.br/images/john_travolta.jpg

 

[schiele]

Silliness Warning!

I'm surprised you even have to ask MM - Brian thrusts his hips in a totally-not-gay way and the females in the audience scream, if there's any doubt he does the "running man" later on.

Evan throws his arms around with no style, tension or poise whatsoever thus proving he's a real man when he flaps his arms ;-)

You can now return to your normal viewing.

Ant

Hey, I'm all for the screaming!