Strange Fruit, Inappropriate for Skating?
- Thread starter dorispulaski
- Start date
)
Moa IWANO 2019-2020 SP "Strange Fruit", "Sinnerman" 30sec fragment (8'38" - 9'08") from JSF Jr Camp late July
She will likely enter JGP #4 Russia. well.. she don't.
She will likely enter JGP #4 Russia. well.. she don't.
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2014
Very thoughtful and interesting post Orlov (and others in this thread).
I think one of the things about Strange Fruit is that is a historical song. This is not Shindler's List which was written for a movie about an event that happened in the past but a song written and performed about lynching which were happening at the time in the South. It is a protest song as well as a song of great sorrow and pain. It is also a song that brought the notion of lynching right up and into the faces of Billie Holiday's many white, non Southern fans. It was meant to stir a reaction in people who loved her music but were not politically aware.
In my opinion (and I'm probably in the minority here) if this song is used for skating it should only be used by a African American person. However, you may feel differently and that is okay. Hopefully the program is at least respectful and the costuming is not tacky.
I think one of the things about Strange Fruit is that is a historical song. This is not Shindler's List which was written for a movie about an event that happened in the past but a song written and performed about lynching which were happening at the time in the South. It is a protest song as well as a song of great sorrow and pain. It is also a song that brought the notion of lynching right up and into the faces of Billie Holiday's many white, non Southern fans. It was meant to stir a reaction in people who loved her music but were not politically aware.
In my opinion (and I'm probably in the minority here) if this song is used for skating it should only be used by a African American person. However, you may feel differently and that is okay. Hopefully the program is at least respectful and the costuming is not tacky.
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2018
I will say this - if I decided to take this music, I would definitely talk before that with, at least several, black Americans, respectfully ask their opinion about this situation, would ask - can I do it with respect to the history of their suffering? etc
But to be honest - I would only be interested in the opinion of black Americans.
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2003
As an American, I would also only be interested in the opinion of black Americans, if I were trying to use this song, and yes, I would ask quite a few. In fact, that is one reason I would, myself, be unable to use the song. I am not up to the task of asking someone, and then finding out their father, or great uncle or grandmother had been lynched. I would not want to dredge up that pain for them.
My father was murdered 25 years ago, and the case was never solved. If you talk to dad's cousin Phil, who was his closest friend, about it in any detail, it upsets him for about three months.
It does me in for about a week, but the police or the reporters do this about once a year even yet, so I am a little more resilient about it than Phil. I have had too much practice.
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2014
Oh Doris. I'm sorry. I didn't know that. My condolences.
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2018
My deepest sympathy... and thank you for this post, it shows courage and great sensitivity and I hope helps me to see - if only from the outside - another side to the harsh questions.
- Joined
- Mar 3, 2014
@Orlov, thank you for your detailed post. A very minor point, which does not detract from the thesis, is that I believe Eteri was present at in Oklahoma City at the time of the Oklahoma City bombing, which was a domestic terror incident in 1995, and not at 9/11. But I am not an Eteri expert, and I could be wrong. 
@Doris, I am so sorry about your father.
And it does bring up a good point: even if we wanted to consult with persons about a tragic event, they might not want to consult with us. No matter how many people affected "approve", one might be immeasurably hurt. Why take the chance
@Doris, I am so sorry about your father.
And it does bring up a good point: even if we wanted to consult with persons about a tragic event, they might not want to consult with us. No matter how many people affected "approve", one might be immeasurably hurt. Why take the chance
- Joined
- Jun 19, 2018
@Orlov, thank you for your detailed post. A very minor point, which does not detract from the thesis, is that I believe Eteri was present at in Oklahoma City at the time of the Oklahoma City bombing, which was a domestic terror incident in 1995, and not at 9/11. But I am not an Eteri expert, and I could be wrong.
Yes, it's true. I wanted to say that she experienced this horror (horror a terrorist atack) on herself. She talked about this terrorist act in a documentary about her and Medvedeva, she spoke in an interview with Pozner (russian Larry King) - it’s clear that for her this atack had a great influence on her.
I said that I first saw this program by chance, even before I found out who they were at all - Medvedeva and Tutberidze (and the whole world of figure skating). I remember the feeling that came over me in the middle of the program - Irreversibility. Music, choreography - everything was woven together and gave rise to this feeling in me. I sat numb, although a couple of minutes before that I just carelessly clicked on the video with a beautiful girlish face on the screen. And then I became interested in figure skating. I watched a documentary about Zhenya and Tutberidze. When she said (there are eng sub) - "...world has just changed around you" - I immediately remembered my feelings in the first view of Zhenya's program.
I just want to say that a person who has experienced this, in whom it left a scar on her soul for the rest of her life, will be very respectful in such a theme.
- Joined
- Nov 24, 2006
I just watched an old Cold Case episode, entitled Strange Fruit. And the final song was sung by Nina Simone while a little white girl watched a black young man being lynched. It was an extremely powerful scene. It made me angry as a white man to see such hatefulness in other white men. I thought that I need to learn this song and sing it if I'm ever in a piano bar, because as a white man, it shows how lynching and racism hurts everyone. The song is now on autoplay and I should have this memorized in an hour or so. I've known about this song and its historical significance, so I'd have no problem with any skater performing to it, just as long as it doesn't come across as exploitative. (I'd probably not do it if I was Starr Andrews because hasn't she gotten flack from TSL because they said her Mom tries to make her skate to anything African American? Lord knows what Dave Lease would say if she skated to Strange Fruit...) Also, as a gay man, I would have no problem with a straight ally singing or skating to any gay-themed song about a GLBT bashing/murder.
NPR’s Throughline podcast released an episode about Strange Fruit and what was happening when Billie Holiday was performing it.: https://bit.ly/2KZImtK?cc=aa9ec103e73f88a121751babd278b754
After listening to it, I think this song needs to stay far far away from competitive skating. I cannot imagine any skater doing it justice, even one who is African American. The songs topic and the cultural significance of its performance not to mention the real racial injustice Billie Holiday herself was experiencing is just too much for a competitive figure skating program. I can see maybe Rohene Ward doing this as a longer exhibition piece. But yeah any sort of performance of this song needs a lot of thought and discretion.
After listening to it, I think this song needs to stay far far away from competitive skating. I cannot imagine any skater doing it justice, even one who is African American. The songs topic and the cultural significance of its performance not to mention the real racial injustice Billie Holiday herself was experiencing is just too much for a competitive figure skating program. I can see maybe Rohene Ward doing this as a longer exhibition piece. But yeah any sort of performance of this song needs a lot of thought and discretion.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
have there been any updates on this matter? Is she still using the song?
Apparently, her team replaced it to Nina Simone's other song.
http://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00054898.htm
http://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00054898.htm
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2005
Thank you, Sweet Jesus. This must close to how the world felt after the Cuban Missile Crisis concluded with catastrophe narrowly averted.
- Joined
- Jan 28, 2013
Yes, a perfect comparison. A virtually unknown Japanese teenager almost skated to a song that some feel is inappropriate.
It is almost exactly like we've narrowly avoided a global thermonuclear human extinction event. This story will probably be on History channel next week.
- Joined
- Mar 3, 2014
One of the very few times that I am happy to see the cover of “I put a spell on you” in a program
(and OT, but a Ukrainian (?) junior man actually skated recently to Screamin’ Jay Hawkins. I stan
)
- Joined
- May 19, 2018
Good to hear. Moa doesn't need that kind of drama, nor does anyone else.
Um, I have relatives who still get the shivers at the words "Cuban Missile Crisis" to this very day. I don't think anyone except maybe a few of Moa Iwano's biggest fans are going to be crossing themselves and sighing with relief about her music change decades later like some people do about the Cuban Missile Crisis.
Um, I have relatives who still get the shivers at the words "Cuban Missile Crisis" to this very day. I don't think anyone except maybe a few of Moa Iwano's biggest fans are going to be crossing themselves and sighing with relief about her music change decades later like some people do about the Cuban Missile Crisis.
