Throws vs SBS jumps

[Tutto]

I have always wondered why for so many ladies in pair skating the SBS jumps seem to be a problem while throws - not.
I would think to land a throw a way more difficult as there is so little control on her side. What is your explanation?

 

[cyndyt]

My opinion is that sbs jumps are harder because you have to match your jump timing to your partner and are trying to stay relatively close together. I have always wondered if the timing for a throw jump being different that a sbs jump messes up the check out of the sbs jump. Also, from my observing of pairs practices, throws get worked on way more than sbs jumps.

 

[noskates]

I think a lot of it has to do with they practice throws all the time with their partner and probably not as much time on their singles moves. I also think that pairs ladies are chosen for their size rather than their skating skills. Other than getting into position, which I'm not minimizing at all because they're daredevils, the man does most of the work. If he sets her wrong or doesn't throw her straight she's going to have a hard time correcting that in the air. I just watched the Jr Pairs final in Riga and that was never more apparent.

 

[Diana Delafield]

My opinion is that sbs jumps are harder because you have to match your jump timing to your partner and are trying to stay relatively close together.

And we're lucky if our jumping style matches. I've skated with one or two partners whose style was so different from mine we looked like two random clubmates who just happened to be working on the same jump at the same end of the rink.

 

[Tutto]

I think a lot of it has to do with they practice throws all the time with their partner and probably not as much time on their singles moves. I also think that pairs ladies are chosen for their size rather than their skating skills. Other than getting into position, which I'm not minimizing at all because they're daredevils, the man does most of the work. If he sets her wrong or doesn't throw her straight she's going to have a hard time correcting that in the air. I just watched the Jr Pairs final in Riga and that was never more apparent.

That's precisely my point - a throw IS more difficult element. And one would imagine if a lady can consistently land throws successfully why on earth would she struggle with a jump where she is in a full control. And mind you the pairs nowadays mostly go for 3ts & sals and 2 axels, the easiest jumps.

 

[Diana Delafield]

Other than getting into position, which I'm not minimizing at all because they're daredevils, the man does most of the work.

No. No. No. Nonononono. (Although I admit we like to dump the blame for a botched lift or throw on our poor guys, who are too chivalrous to object .)

Pairs girls do half the work. You each have your job to do in any element where you connect, and for her it's not just passively allowing herself to get picked up and tossed around.

 

[ladyjane]

No. No. No. Nonononono. (Although I admit we like to dump the blame for a botched lift or throw on our poor guys, who are too chivalrous to object .)

Pairs girls do half the work. You each have your job to do in any element where you connect, and for her it's not just passively allowing herself to get picked up and tossed around.

That's what I thought, I once heard a throw is in reality an assisted jump, and yes both partners are important. For example I recall Minerva Fabienne Hasse landing most of her throw jumps nowadays, which she didn't in the past. Better throw technique or better fitting together as both partners work on it. The SBS jumps can be a problem with both, certainly not just the girls. I've seen many men going wrong there as well.

 

[paulusfr]

From what I understand with throws even if your technique is not good, you can just re-learn and do them (*if you got a good partner who throws you the same way every time). Jumps don't work like that. Either you can jump or you can't. And there is not much you can do about that.

 

[noskates]

paulusfr kind of made the point I was trying to make. As I said, I don't minimize anything a pairs girl does but I still believe in a throw triple or double the guy has to be right on or the girl is going to splat. She has to rotate and land which I still don't think is as challenging as doing a triple on your own. But then...........I've never done it so...

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I have always wondered why for so many ladies in pair skating the SBS jumps seem to be a problem while throws - not.
I would think to land a throw a way more difficult as there is so little control on her side. What is your explanation?

Skaters also get more height on throws, so they're not rotating as fast and it's easier to check out of the jump. Everything is more rushed when doing the individual jump. Some of these pairs could do throw quints if they rotated as fast as the do on the SBS jumps.

 

[NanaPat]

That's precisely my point - a throw IS more difficult element. And one would imagine if a lady can consistently land throws successfully why on earth would she struggle with a jump where she is in a full control. And mind you the pairs nowadays mostly go for 3ts & sals and 2 axels, the easiest jumps.

I think on the SBS jumps, it's not a case of controlling the landing but of getting enough power to jump high enough to get the rotation done. Plus the problem of matching your partner, which has already been discussed.

 

[Mathman]

No. No. No. Nonononono. (Although I admit we like to dump the blame for a botched lift or throw on our poor guys, who are too chivalrous to object .)

Pairs girls do half the work. You each have your job to do in any element where you connect, and for her it's not just passively allowing herself to get picked up and tossed around.

This seems quite apparent, to me. A pairs lady is not just a sack of potatoes that the man tosses around. In lifts, too, the liftee does half the work.

Plus, if you mistime a throw jump, the result is likely to be total disaster and maybe even injury. Whereas side by side jumps, even if the unison and style is not in perfect synch, OK, so you lose a couple of points in GOE.