Trophee Lalique Free Dance and Unofficial Results (SpoilerS)

[Smiley0884]

Yes! I'm not the only one who has noticed that Ben is a total hottie LOL he looked so cute in that Elvis costume

Doris, you said that line, maturity, expression, ect. didn't get L&T or G&S anywhere internationally. Well it sure did work for N&K and A&P. I honestly think that they were getting dinged for the males being Russian immigrants, and for L&T leaving Shpilband, but well that's another story. I actually thought Tanith had the pontentail to have a very gorgeous line back around 2000, but she lost so much weight, it kind of makes her legs look gangly. I'm sure with a little ballet training, Tanith could have great lines and extentions. I agree about Shpilband. Thatt man has a twisted mind, and I hope Tanith and Ben will one day find a coach who cares about their well being, not just medals, medals, medals.

 

[Ptichka]

B&A are not long limbed/gorgeous -- they are never going to be. If that is the requirement, they had better quit now.

Bestemianova & Bukin were never not limber & gorgeous, and it did not stop them. B&A are a very young team; dance is one discipline where you need maturity. It's that way in non-ice dance as well. If you go to a tango club in Buenos Aires, it's actually a complement to be asked to dance by an older gentleman. One thing this all means is that teams must have a lot of patience to stay and improve in ice dance. B&A just need a lot of perseverance, and I think they CAN get to be the best -- but they are not there yet. Also, I think their win in SA was a bit of a fluke, not because they are not good, but because I think G&G are the better ice dancers at this point. I think B&A are at about the same skating level as De&Sh and D&L, except that they are younger and have much more time to improve.

 

[euterpe]

While not crazy about WSS program and the cuts, and also agreeing that maybe another coach would be better for B&S, when I saw the TL results, I went into a tail spin that B&A were beaten by not just 1 by 2 couples that they had been beating routinely, and in the past this has been the big sign,
" You are from US; you can't dance; accept it and quit." I am somewhat more hopeful for their future now that I hear they did not skate as well as they did at SA. But not much.

When you talk about line, maturity and expression, L&T had that, so did G&S, but they got absolutely nowhere internationally. So B&A have difficulty, now it's line, maturity and expression that are wanted. B&A are not long limbed/gorgeous -- they are never going to be. If that is the requirement, they had better quit now.
B&A do indeed move well to the beat--it's dance, yes? My personal ice dance prejudice is that the first requirement is to move to the beat and correctly express the rhythm you are using. Which is why the DelSchoes are not my fav team.
Doris

I agree wholeheartedly. I expect that B/A will be held down--for one reason or another-- simply because they are not European. Even if they switch coaches and work hard on line, maturity and expression, some other fault will be found and held against them. Remember Punsalan and Swallow? As eligibles, the highest ranking they ever received was 6th in 1998. Yet in their first year as pros, they won the World Pro Championship.

Something is very wrong indeed when a team consistently ranked below B/A has a fall and still is marked higher.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

My problem with Ben and Tanith is that his dancing is so over the top and she is like a Barbie Doll following him. It's just my view.

Peter, to me dances by the numbers - all quite good but I don't get much else from him while Naomi is putting heart and sole into the dance. Again, it's just my view.

Joe

 

[IceCastles1814]

I agree wholeheartedly. I expect that B/A will be held down--for one reason or another-- simply because they are not European. Even if they switch coaches and work hard on line, maturity and expression, some other fault will be found and held against them. Remember Punsalan and Swallow? As eligibles, the highest ranking they ever received was 6th in 1998. Yet in their first year as pros, they won the World Pro Championship.

Something is very wrong indeed when a team consistently ranked below B/A has a fall and still is marked higher.

I'm going to withhold my comments on the judging of Trophee Lalique ice dancing competition until I see it and the detailed scores. I've read a few reports and it seems, IMO, that it was an overall lackluster competition, but that there was some possibly questionable judging not only concerning B&A, but the other 3 teams as well in relation to each other. I don't want to cry "wuz robbed", because some people tend to when people bring that out, especially before seeing the competition, so I'd rather have tangible evidence. As far as placing behind D/L and Del/Shoes, those teams are reported to have made recent additions to their FDs, logically, if B&A do some fine tuning here and there and, needless to say, skate cleanly, they should be able to remain competitive with those teams, right?

OTOH, this is ice dancing, and all the top teams now have been victims of the judges whims and bias in the past, and even with COP, we're still likely to see some questionable scoring between close teams. And there's always one team's strengths and weaknesses versus another's that can be argued into the mix, which is subjective at times. Again, the key for B&A, because they are young and because American ice dance has never really been perceived as competitive for medals, is to continue to improve, skate cleanly, and dare the judges to give them lower than what they deserve. It may not be fair that other teams can fall and place ahead, but we all know that there's little to be done about that at a competition.

So Tanith and Ben can only focus on themselves. They are very capable of medaling in the next couple of years, but it all starts with them first, and the judging second. I agree that maybe Igor has given them all that he can, but who else can they go to in the near future, that would be a good fit? I don't know a lot about the different ice dancing coaches. No Morosov, please, though!

[turning my B&A fandom on] Anywho....well wishes to B&A at Cup of Russia!!! Kick some booty with that WSS FD and it's abundance of music cuts! I like it anyway. What good is a FD if it has no controversy? See they are already approaching the upper echelons of ice dance [turning it off]

And good luck to C&S there and more especially at NHK!

Lucy

 

[euterpe]

So....Tanith and Ben are expected to sit back, work hard and wait, because they are young. And wait. And wait. That's pretty much what Punsalan and Swallow did for years, and see how much good that did them.

 

[IceCastles1814]

So....Tanith and Ben are expected to sit back, work hard and wait, because they are young. And wait. And wait. That's pretty much what Punsalan and Swallow did for years, and see how much good that did them.

No, I think if they continue to improve and skate well, they won't have to wait. My only point is that, yes, they are going to have to push harder in order to make it difficult for the judges to mis-score them. That's the reality, because even the COP can be manipulated. Obviously, dealing with the ISU and the crooked judges will be an uphill battle. What do you suggest they do, except work hard because they are already considered a top team at this early in their careers? They can file a complaint with the ISU or USFSA, but B&K did this and they still didn't win worlds until last year and by a 5-4 split. Punsalun & Swallow were a great team and have pushed U.S. ice dancing further as have Lang & Tchernyshev. And all of the current crop of top teams D&S, N&K, D&L. Den&Sta have been victims of this system and are just now getting their due as well. It's not only N.A. teams, although they have had the hardest time of it when they've been contenders.


At anyrate, I believe that B&A will be contending for a World medal over the next couple of years, because they have the talent, they work hard, and have been received with pretty good enthusiasum by the judges. When I said how they improve and skate comes first, that's absolutely true, because if they don't improve or skate well, then how can anyone start in on the judging? But, if they continue to skate well and improve, I do believe, unlike the teams before them, that they have the power to medal sooner than later. I'm definitely a fan of B&A, but one of the reasons I have not always been into ice dancing is the judging. I think it's getting better, but it's still not completely fair and that's the system they'll be competing in unfortunately.

It's frustrating. I'm waiting to see what happened at TL and then what happens at COR before I start in on the judging. From there, again, I don't know what they or any of the other teams can really say or do to change the system any more quickly than it's changing now.

Lucy

 

[euterpe]

I'm interested to see what happens at Cup of Russia. The leading teams seem to be Navka/Kostomarov, Winkler/Lohse, Chait/Sakhonovski and B/A. I just hope they can make the podium there.

 

[LarasB]

I am just so glad to see so much interest in ice dance lately. It has been my favorite discipline in figure skating since I watched Torvill & Dean at the Olympics skating to Bolero. Maybe there's so much interest now because of B&A having improved so much and have actually medaled in the GP series. I appreciate almost all the ice dancers that are competing in the eligible ranks and it's hard to pick a favorite. I just hope this interest continues.

 

[gracefulswan]

b&a are a very good team... they have so much talent. they are so fast and their unison is wonderful. the close dancing and footwork is top notch... i wouldn't be surprised to find them on the podium soon at worlds. they should be nationals champs next year if they skate as they can and not make too many dumb errors.