Why is it so hard to transition from Juniors to Seniors?

[lesnar001]

Do you all remember Ann Patrice McDonough? She won Junior Worlds and was billed as the Next Michelle Kwan. I think she had one decent season as a Senior and then she burnt out. I remember seeing her during her final season and she just looked miserable. I'm sure it's hard for a parent to give up on all that invested money but, you can only push a person so far before they say, Enough Is Enough.

For some reason, I had the impression that Ann Patrice's mother pushed her into skating much more than she wanted it for herself. By that, I don't mean skating itself, but becoming a champion and/or star. I'm kind of hesitant to post this because I don't want to give any false information. I'm just curious if anyone else remembers this scenario as well.

All I know is that at the time she left competition, she did indeed look absolutely miserable - like skating was the last thing she wanted to do.

 

[mrrice]

For some reason, I had the impression that Ann Patrice's mother pushed her into skating much more than she wanted it for herself. By that, I don't mean skating itself, but becoming a champion and/or star. I'm kind of hesitant to post this because I don't want to give any false information. I'm just curious if anyone else remembers this scenario as well.

All I know is that at the time she left competition, she did indeed look absolutely miserable - like skating was the last thing she wanted to do.

I feel the same way. I remember an interview where her mom said that she had AP, pegged as a skater the day she was born.

 

[CrazyKittenLady]

The current problem in Russian men's skating, if it can be called a problem, is too many young skaters of roughly similar level who feel they can make it to the top with enough luck and effort. They know what tech level it will take (at least five quads per two programs or someone else is going to the important competitions) and are not prepared to give up without a fight. This inevitably will break quite a few skaters in the process, and even if it doesn't, will bring inconsistency and consequent ridicule.

Agreed, I also have the impression that in the case of the Russian men it's not that they suddenly lose interest in figure skating and discover the more thrilling things in life when they grow up and transition to seniors. It's more that they want it too much, training to the point of physical exhaustion and often attempting the most difficult content to achieve their goals. And when you have a lot of young guys doing that in a rather deep field, there inevitably will be a higher number of injuries.

 

[skatingfan4ever]

Okay, you all. I am THRILLED that there's a thread where this video fits!

On April 16, 2018, Patrick Chan officially announced his retirement from competition at a special gathering in Toronto. He gave a 10-minute speech. In this speech, he thanked everyone from his sponsors to his boot and blade companies (even thanking the person who sharpened his skates by name) to Skate Canada to his choreographer and his first coach. But the best part was when he thanked his parents. Please watch below, and notice Patrick's obvious emotion:

Patrick Chan Thanks His Parents

Patrick Chan officially announced his retirement from competitive figure skating on April 16, 2018. In this clip from a 10-minute speech in which he thanks ...

youtu.be

Please note the story Patrick tells about his thoughts before a Junior Worlds: "I was struggling with a few of my jumps, and it was one of the first times I started feeling the pressure and the incredible cost of competitive figure skating. I sat on the side of the Cricket Club ice rink, face buried in my hands, until my dad came over to ask what was wrong. 'I’m not ready to go to Worlds. It’s all a waste. Just save your money and forget about going if I can’t land my jumps,' I said." My fan heart is SO grateful for Patrick's dad's response: "Our sacrifice has nothing to do with results. We’re happy to give you everything we have so that you can do what you love. All we ask of you is to give it 100% of that day. That’s all we ask.” Patrick was worried about whether skating was "worth it" if he couldn't land his jumps and specifically wondered whether it was financially worth it.

Patrick, of course, went on to win 3 Senior Worlds, 2 GPFs, 3 4CCs, individual OSM, team OSM and team OGM, and 10 Canadian National Titles. Perhaps most impressively, he never finished outside the top 10 in ANY international competition he skated in. But he didn't know what would happen back then as a junior skater. How many other skaters, most of whom will never rise to Patrick's level, have also wondered these things? It's like lightening in a bottle. You need the right training environment, the right support system, good luck regarding your health and injuries, skating well in the right competitions, talent, hard work, etc. Not to mention you have no control over how your competitors are going to skate.

Patrick learned that his parents' support meant more than any medals, in the end. May many more skaters be able to come to this conclusion as well.

Also, here's Patrick reading and reacting to a letter from his parents while in Pyeongchang. SO LOVELY AND HEARTWARMING!!! He had "never cried on camera" before.

Dearest beloved son (rus sub)

Love letter

www.youtube.com

 

[4everchan]

the number of teenagers giving up on many things because they realize the sacrifices of their parents ... yup... very very good point to bring in this thread @skatingfan4ever

 

[eppen]

Just bumbing this up with sth I was going to write to the other juniors to seniors thread, until I realized that this is a better fit.

I have dabbled a little bit with that junior to senior time by looking at what happens to skaters who participate in the Junior worlds (1975-2020). They'e obviously already elite skaters, have to be to get assignments and qualify for that. So they don't probably represent all the skaters.

But it was interesting to see that for the top juniors there were 4 different kinds of career trajectories for seniors. Some disappear completely, maybe quit for whatever reason. However, this is usually a relatively small proportion of them per season, about 10%. They are pretty good and committed to their sport, so continuing to the next level is a natural step. Then there are those who never get to the major leagues - they continue competing in the national level or minor ínternational competitions. This happens to ca. 20-25% of the participants every season.

The very successful skaters can be divided into two - those who get to go only to Europeans or 4CC as their most prestigous competition and those who continue to the Worlds and Olympics. The Euro/4CC ones consists of maybe 20% of the participants and then the top group is amzingly large, almost half of them.

It would be very interesting to see a big study on why skaters quit competing as well as why they keep on doing it.

E