Yuzuru Hanyu: 2016-17 Season

[Li'Kitsu]

IKR? I am actually not so bothered with what they said about Yuzuru because at least it was about his skating. But the things they said about other skaters are actually the one that rubs me the wrong way

I have to be honest, I never liked what they said about Yuzuru's skating either - because IMO it's so blatantly obvious they are using him as click bait and nothing more. But those parts, while making me not like them, didn't make me dislike them either. When they very enthusiastically made fun of Anna P. having a very rough skate and potentially injuring herself, that's when I decided they're idiots and need to keep their BS to themselves. There is no excuse for behavior like that.

So my only comment: please, nobody ever click on any of their links and give them any form of acknowledgement. Those people are best ignored

 

[mcq]

I agree with the assessment of music choice not affecting his PCS (as it should be). But for sure, it's affecting how a lot of commentators are talking about his program beyond things that are down to personal taste. Divisive to say the least. I've heard both that he looks drained and that he doesn't look remotely tired and wasn't even panting, that he was commanding in the performance and that he wasn't performing as much as he did in previous outings. And now TSL with their "empty program" "no transitions" comment. But I didn't click in to listen and don't intend to, so.

Because they compared everything with GPF/NHK seimei? That has been skated to its best? Much like many people here?

Personally for me, any program will pale in comparison to Seimei. Not just by Yuzuru, but by any skaters. That program is the ultimate FS program for me. Which is why I said I feel sad if anything Yuzuru does from that point onward is compared to that. I think HnL is a better program than NDP, RJ2 and POTO. It is subtle and shows a different side than his usual dramatic self. It's not for everyone and there will be different opinions about it, much like LGC is and how PW was (bear in mind some of his old fans despised PW), which is completely normal. But some has been acting as if this program was a total mistake and blunder to be chosen and skated to, which is a bit sad, especially since it seems to mean so much to him, about his skating history and all.:noshake:

Sometimes a program takes some time to gel too. I never look at requiem as an outstanding program until he performed it at worlds gala. Before that, it was just an ok gala number for me. But at worlds, it just transform into a heart-wrenching masterpiece.

 

[beki]

I personally consider this as culture difference…Do you like Yuzu‘s Seimei or gala from last season？

Yes, I like both, and Seimei is my favorite program ever. The cultural difference explanation comes up often, but I don't think I'm incapable of appreciating subtlety or Asian music.

 

[Sugiady]

Yes, I like both, and Seimei is my favorite program ever. The cultural difference explanation comes up often, but I don't think I'm incapable of appreciating subtlety or Asian music.

Emm…
I like H&L for it has been personal, Yuzu is not in his character anymore but the skating himself on the ice.
Sometimes I think it is something like dancing, people be connected with it differently. So maybe it's just not your style？

 

[YuzusHydroblade]

Yes, I like both, and Seimei is my favorite program ever. The cultural difference explanation comes up often, but I don't think I'm incapable of appreciating subtlety or Asian music.

I think the problem with H&L is that it isn't "asian" as in, you can easily identify it as asian, yet it is wildly different to western pieces. I feel like that's what's throwing people off about the music, they don't hear it as distinctively asian and try to connect with it in the same way you would do it with western music and failing.

 

[narcissa]

I grew up watching Miyazaki movies so I can't differentiate between that type of music and "Western" music at all....I mean, I guess I can differentiate if I tried to, but they both sound equally mainstream to me.

 

[Sugiady]

I think the problem with H&L is that it isn't "asian" as in, you can easily identify it as asian, yet it is wildly different to western pieces. I feel like that's what's throwing people off about the music, they don't hear it as distinctively asian and try to connect with it in the same way you would do it with western music and failing.

It's really a good point!
Since I am grown up with Miyazaki Hayao's anime films, Joe Hisaishi‘s music for these anime just like blood flow through my life. The first time I heard the H&L music, I know this must be Joe Hisaishi，and being easily to get what Joe and Yuzu want to say in this music.

 

[Fayruza]

I'm interested in seeing how H&L is evolving - the task of conveying and projecting inner peace, serenity and introspection while tackling such technical content is a paradox. I hope he gets there - because if he does, I'm sure it's going to be something rare.
In fact, given his drive to add up difficult stuff, dramatic music would just drive him on - but here the challenge is different. Even if he doesn't quite manage what he's aiming for, I value this year's LP as an experiment...

 

[gladiolusc]

Because they compared everything with GPF/NHK seimei? That has been skated to its best? Much like many people here?

Personally for me, any program will pale in comparison to Seimei. Not just by Yuzuru, but by any skaters. That program is the ultimate FS program for me. Which is why I said I feel sad if anything Yuzuru does from that point onward is compared to that. I think HnL is a better program than NDP, RJ2 and POTO. It is subtle and shows a different side than his usual dramatic self. It's not for everyone and there will be different opinions about it, much like LGC is and how PW was (bear in mind some of his old fans despised PW), which is completely normal. But some has been acting as if this program was a total mistake and blunder to be chosen and skated to, which is a bit sad, especially since it seems to mean so much to him, about his skating history and all.:noshake:

Sometimes a program takes some time to gel too. I never look at requiem as an outstanding program until he performed it at worlds gala. Before that, it was just an ok gala number for me. But at worlds, it just transform into a heart-wrenching masterpiece.

*automatic thumbs up*

I'm interested in seeing how H&L is evolving - the task of conveying and projecting inner peace, serenity and introspection while tackling such technical content is a paradox. I hope he gets there - because if he does, I'm sure it's going to be something rare.
In fact, given his drive to add up difficult stuff, dramatic music would just drive him on - but here the challenge is different. Even if he doesn't quite manage what he's aiming for, I value this year's LP as an experiment...

I also do agree with Brian that H&L is a wonderful vehicle for what he's looking to do this season. Balancing inner peace and introspection while tackling technical content is great homework. And whether or not it gels for people, he's definitely grown a lot from doing it.

 

[mcq]

I'm interested in seeing how H&L is evolving - the task of conveying and projecting inner peace, serenity and introspection while tackling such technical content is a paradox. I hope he gets there - because if he does, I'm sure it's going to be something rare.
In fact, given his drive to add up difficult stuff, dramatic music would just drive him on - but here the challenge is different. Even if he doesn't quite manage what he's aiming for, I value this year's LP as an experiment...

This could not have been worded in a more precise manner :agree:

 

[gladiolusc]

This could not have been worded in a more precise manner :agree:

Haha Fayruza for queen. We bolded the exact same part. So spot on.

 

[Fayruza]

Haha Fayruza for queen. We bolded the exact same part. So spot on.

This could not have been worded in a more precise manner :agree:

:

 

[teeannroo]

" she is so perfect and organized so obedient, wonderful example of future Asian mother and wife" something like this

Really tested my patience , they got immediate block from my feeds after that.

Wow it's 2017 and there are still people like that around...

 

[Lambari]

Because they compared everything with GPF/NHK seimei? That has been skated to its best? Much like many people here?

Personally for me, any program will pale in comparison to Seimei. Not just by Yuzuru, but by any skaters. That program is the ultimate FS program for me. Which is why I said I feel sad if anything Yuzuru does from that point onward is compared to that. I think HnL is a better program than NDP, RJ2 and POTO. It is subtle and shows a different side than his usual dramatic self. It's not for everyone and there will be different opinions about it, much like LGC is and how PW was (bear in mind some of his old fans despised PW), which is completely normal. But some has been acting as if this program was a total mistake and blunder to be chosen and skated to, which is a bit sad, especially since it seems to mean so much to him, about his skating history and all.:noshake:

Sometimes a program takes some time to gel too. I never look at requiem as an outstanding program until he performed it at worlds gala. Before that, it was just an ok gala number for me. But at worlds, it just transform into a heart-wrenching masterpiece.

I totally agree with these statements.

I didn't find neither NDP, R&J 2.0 or POTO absolutely great programs and I'm absolutely fine when people state these as some of their favourite Hanyu programs.

A real mistake for me would be to try to replicate the type of dramatic pull that Seimei had just one season after he achieved that type of success with it. It would be an expected move and for me any program in a similar vein would pale in comparison and receive a less enthusiastic reaction, even if he could be able to achieve an amount of succes with it. Staying away from a dramatic choice this particular season was a smart choice in my opinion.

I remember watching Requiem at GPF 2015 and thinking "Son, you're overdoing it" and "The costume, why." repeatedly. Then Worlds 2016 EX caught me off guard and this is now one of favourite programs from him. That performance was just right for the mood of the program.

Liking less or not liking at all a program doesn't make anyone less of a fan, if you're still a fan of the skater considering his/her skating overall. The same if someone absolutely loves any program ever done from him, even Vertigo and for that, I would commend you for being an admirable human being. k

Having said that, I'm a sucker for anything lyrical and remotely pretty so that's why I could connect instantly with H&L and a lot of people probably have different preferences. I don't think this is just exclusively related to cultural differences although yes, it can bear a certain weight on liking/disliking this program. or else I should be loving any samba ice dance program and that's not the case And If I didn't know that Joe Hisaishi is the composer I would think it was a western piece since I wasn't aware of his music previsouly.

I thought that I would hate LGC with all the cells of my whole being and now I don't even flinch when he does that literal phone-picking movement.

 

[YuzusHydroblade]

I grew up watching Miyazaki movies so I can't differentiate between that type of music and "Western" music at all....I mean, I guess I can differentiate if I tried to, but they both sound equally mainstream to me.

It's really a good point!
Since I am grown up with Miyazaki Hayao's anime films, Joe Hisaishi‘s music for these anime just like blood flow through my life. The first time I heard the H&L music, I know this must be Joe Hisaishi，and being easily to get what Joe and Yuzu want to say in this music.

I've been listening to japanese music for years, so i "get" it too, but i know they are different. There is a different feeling in western compositions and japanese compositions, and trying to connect with them with a western approach is impossible to me.

I totally agree with these statements.

I didn't find neither NDP, R&J 2.0 or POTO absolutely great programs and I'm absolutely fine when people state these as some of their favourite Hanyu programs.

A real mistake for me would be to try to replicate the type of dramatic pull that Seimei had just one season after he achieved that type of success with it. It would be an expected move and for me any program in a similar vein would pale in comparison and receive a less enthusiastic reaction, even if he could be able to achieve an amount of succes with it. Staying away from a dramatic choice this particular season was a smart choice in my opinion.

I remember watching Requiem at GPF 2015 and thinking "Son, you're overdoing it" and "The costume, why." repeatedly. Then Worlds 2016 EX caught me off guard and this is now one of favourite programs from him. That performance was just right for the mood of the program.

Liking less or not liking at all a program doesn't make anyone less of a fan, if you're still a fan of the skater considering his/her skating overall. The same if someone absolutely loves any program ever done from him, even Vertigo and for that, I would commend you for being an admirable human being. k

Havind said that, I'm a sucker for anything lyrical and remotely pretty so that's why I could connect instantly with H&L and a lot of people probably have different preferences. I don't think this is just exclusively related to cultural differences although yes, it can bear a certain weight on liking/disliking this program. or else I should be loving any samba ice dance program and that's not the case

I thought that I would hate LGC with all the cells of my whole being and now I don't even flinch when he does that literal phone-picking movement.

I think we've touched that subject before, i don't think the problem is that we're from a different culture and that means we can't like it because how different it is to what we know. I think that the problem is that we don't know the right approach, H&L is subtle (actually, i am not sure, anyone japanese please correct me if i'm using the wrong term but honestly the word "iki" comes to my mind when watching H&L). If it was just a cultural difference then people wouldn't have liked Seimei.

 

[narcissa]

I'm interested in seeing how H&L is evolving - the task of conveying and projecting inner peace, serenity and introspection while tackling such technical content is a paradox. I hope he gets there - because if he does, I'm sure it's going to be something rare.
In fact, given his drive to add up difficult stuff, dramatic music would just drive him on - but here the challenge is different. Even if he doesn't quite manage what he's aiming for, I value this year's LP as an experiment...

This is so true. The main criticism levied against him at 4CC was that he "let go of the performance" and became very focused, even assassin-like, and my first thought was: maybe he should stick with programs of Seimei or Phantom intensity? Because then his natural face full of concentration would be fitting to the theme, so he wouldn't need to exert extra energy to emote. Remember how he looked super intense at the end of Seimei but it fit the music beautifully? But then my second thought was: This just highlights how CHALLENGING it is to skate to H&L, and how he ENJOYS challenging himself like the Yuzuru we all know and love. Having to exude this soft, cloud-like serenity throughout the entire program WHILE brimming with the adrenaline needed to do 4 quads is pushing limits for the sport just as much as landing 5 quads. But it's so subtle (and when it's done well it's SUPPOSED to be subtle) and he's held to such high standards that some people just don't realize this. They see the mistakes on the quads and/or small breaks in the acting (and both his SP and FS require so much acting), and they somehow feel like the world is crashing down. Maybe because they want it to.

An "unpopular" opinion: It is so much easier for to skate to something like Prince Igor which is just dramatic music building up suspense as you attempt quad after quad. Kudos to Nathan for picking music that highlights his strengths, I guess. I'm having an entertaining time imagining him quadding it to Joe Hisaishi music.

 

[Yatagarasu]

I'm interested in seeing how H&L is evolving - the task of conveying and projecting inner peace, serenity and introspection while tackling such technical content is a paradox. I hope he gets there - because if he does, I'm sure it's going to be something rare.
In fact, given his drive to add up difficult stuff, dramatic music would just drive him on - but here the challenge is different. Even if he doesn't quite manage what he's aiming for, I value this year's LP as an experiment...

The Professor has spoken :agree2:

But the bold also has a wider implication, past Yuzuru. With all the quads now being inserted into the free skate, it is actually possible we'll be seeing less and less programs that are similar to H&L because it is just so difficult to pull it off. It would be a shame and another reason why it's so important to value the components part of it all properly.

 

[Sugiady]

I've been listening to japanese music for years, so i "get" it too, but i know they are different. There is a different feeling in western compositions and japanese compositions, and trying to connect with them with a western approach is impossible to me.

I am pretty fine with that. The story-telling feeling in japanese compositions is very unique,it's easy to tell which one is japanese music.

 

[narcissa]

The Professor has spoken :agree2:

But the bold also has a wider implication, past Yuzuru. With all the quads now being inserted into the free skate, it is actually possible we'll be seeing less and less programs that are similar to H&L. It would be a shame and another reason why it's so important to value the components part of it all properly.

Now I really want him to skate a clean H&L, so we can put it down in the history books as "that special performance to rewatch over and over" in case programs like that do go extinct.

 

[mcq]

I totally agree with these statements.

I didn't find neither NDP, R&J 2.0 or POTO absolutely great programs and I'm absolutely fine when people state these as some of their favourite Hanyu programs.

A real mistake for me would be to try to replicate the type of dramatic pull that Seimei had just one season after he achieved that type of success with it. It would be an expected move and for me any program in a similar vein would pale in comparison and receive a less enthusiastic reaction, even if he could be able to achieve an amount of succes with it. Staying away from a dramatic choice this particular season was a smart choice in my opinion.

I remember watching Requiem at GPF 2015 and thinking "Son, you're overdoing it" and "The costume, why." repeatedly. Then Worlds 2016 EX caught me off guard and this is now one of favourite programs from him. That performance was just right for the mood of the program.

Liking less or not liking at all a program doesn't make anyone less of a fan, if you're still a fan of the skater considering his/her skating overall. The same if someone absolutely loves any program ever done from him, even Vertigo and for that, I would commend you for being an admirable human being. k

Havind said that, I'm a sucker for anything lyrical and remotely pretty so that's why I could connect instantly with H&L and a lot of people probably have different preferences. I don't think this is just exclusively related to cultural differences although yes, it can bear a certain weight on liking/disliking this program. or else I should be loving any samba ice dance program and that's not the case

I thought that I would hate LGC with all the cells of my whole being and now I don't even flinch when he does that literal phone-picking movement.

Oh dear can I just thumb up every word you wrote here because I 100% agree to each and every one of them.

Agreed about the NDP RJ2 and POTO part. Just like PW was for me, I am (huh) at that program, but hey many actually become Yuzuru's fan because of that program and it was their fave. It's not a bad program too, i think the stsq was well-choreographed, it's just not my cup of tea.

Also agreed about the change of mood in his FS, I think it is a smart choice. It's good to see this side of him and he somehow experiment with a calmer program and not something dramatic. I consider RJ1&2 POTO and Seimei (even NDP) to be dramatic too tbh.

And yes about requiem. Same same same. For me I think I even got teary (no I am not crying you are) a bit at the end of that program at worlds. Just like you, I like lyrical programs too. Same with contemporary style programs. And I like goofy, pose-y or seductive program much less (which is why maybe I was never into Javi's or Plushy's skating lol). It's just preferences I guess. It is like asking me to like coffee when I like tea more, something like that? Lol. I don't think just because you are a fan of someone you have to like everything.

About LGC, I enjoy it much more than PW even from the first watch. I think it is a well-choreographed program (despite some cringey parts). But at the same time I doubt it will be in my top 10 list of a program.