2021 Cranberry Cup Int'l - Senior Pairs FS

[moonvine]

The Crafoords achieved the minimum TES for Worlds in both SP and FS here. They didn't have it yet.

Pfund/Santillan achived minimum TES for Europeans in both segments. They also achieved the FS minimum TES for Worlds. They were less than 2 points short in the SP (they need 27).

Kops/Kranopolski achived minimums for Europeans.

Awesome!!!!

 

[moonvine]

C/J have effortless quality on their 3-twist, as well as smooth, effortless speed and great SS. C/H have improved by leaps and bounds, but they are still developing their skills, confidence and knowledge of each other. And I hope this showing will push C/H over the hump to be confident under intense pressure situations. C/H hesitated on their second throw, or they might have landed it. That was the one thing they looked like they were thinking about and wanted a DO OVER, when they finished the program and glanced at each other.

Spencer & Emily are both 24, but Spencer will turn 25 in September, so they are 11 months apart in age. Jess & Brian are close in age as well, about 9 months apart. Jess turned 26 in February, and Brian will be 26 in November. So C/J are slightly older than C/H, and C/J are slightly ahead in pairs development too. It's a fact. It's the reason why C/J were scored so much higher with more mistakes.

I agree that C/H look like they are fast catching up, which means C/J will have to fix the pesky sbs jump issues.

Another thing is as fans, do we completely give up on skaters when they aren't going well? It feels good to get behind skaters who are going well. But the real test of fandom is continuing to support skaters you love when they are going through ups-and-downs. For sure, it can be frustrating. I was about ready to give up on Spencer & Emily because they have been inconsistent and disappointing at times. But they were working things through, and it clearly takes time. Maybe something begins to sink in, and suddenly they get it. Or else, they get the right music and choreography, and it all begins to come together.

I also think the new training venue, with the historic legacy that The Skating Club of Boston is endowed with, truly helps all the skaters who are training there. Look at what we are seeing from Max Naumov recently. Does Jimmy Ma train in Boston too? Or is he in Colorado?

Jimmy is in Boston.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Yes!

Spencer is great friends with Canada's Justine Brasseur. They used to train together when Spencer was with a different partner and being coached by Gauthier/Marcotte.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Jimmy is in Boston.

Ahhhh! It figures, yes! Glad to hear it. He's looking very good.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

I'm with you on J/C pairs excitement and innovation.

Yep, they still have tons of followers on YouTube who have only recently realized why J/C aren't together anymore, and have found out that Vanessa now has a new skating partner. Some of these J/C admirers are obviously new to skating altogether, and they have been mesmerized by James/Cipres' programs. The ISU needs to truly realize and recognize the promotional value of allowing skating performances to be widely viewed on YouTube.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

I suspect there will be no complaints about the difference in points with the other pairs this time (not like yesterday in the SP). They were really a lot better than everyone else. I hope they keep it up. .

Sure, but I still say that K/F and C/J skated very well in the sp and both deserved to at least break 70 pts for their fine efforts. Had they been Russian teams with the same performances, they would have been better rewarded. Let's not kid ourselves. Other styles and skills not attached to Russian skaters deserve to be rewarded too.

And obviously, as I said, U.S. skaters will still have to back up strong performances time and again, because they get no breaks and no gifts from the judges.

 

[anonymoose_au]

Well to be fair, at EVERY practice session they said “if we mispronounce your name please let us know so we can fix it for the competition.”

That's good of them! I wonder if Zhenya was too shy to tell them.

Or maybe she did and they still messed it up. Because I'm not entirely sure I say Evgeni/a right myself

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

@Andrea82, does the fact that P/F don't have the TES minimum in the sp needed for Worlds mean that they have to obtain it first in order to qualify for Worlds, even despite having the FS minimum for Worlds?

A strong skate from K/F but bring honest from a personal point of view I’d rank it 3rd behind the other two US couples. Big score

Go T/M The announcer butchered her name.

I went back through the thread and found that I said something completely different right after your above post, though I hadn't noticed your post at the time. Can you say why you would rank K/F third behind C/J and C/H?

I think it's obvious that U.S. fed favor K/F because they fully support Alexa, and thus would like to see her on top. I think K/F are well-matched and doing enough to warrant their position at the moment. They are different than the other U.S. teams in that they seem to have a strong, synchronous athleticism, but they are still working out who they are as a team presentation-wise, which is understandable since they are still a new pairing in only their second season after an abbreviated competitive year in their debut together.

All pairs teams are always in the process of tweaking and improving and figuring out how to be in sync together on the ice. It isn't easy. But the best teams make it look easy.

If C/J could believe in themselves more, they could be a very magical team. But they need to land their jumps with no self-doubts. If they get stuck on that hurdle, they won't be able to fulfill their exciting potential.

C/H are still a developing team. I hope they can gain more international competitive opportunities this season, so that they can further grow in experience and further build their confidence.

 

[Yeslekyelnats]

Goodness K/F looked FAST and were able to keep it up through the whole program.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Goodness K/F looked FAST and were able to keep it up through the whole program.

Yep, that's the synchronous athletic quality I'm talking about. They truly match in athleticism in a way they didn't with their former partners.

 

[gold12345]

Both of Knierim/Frazier's programs maintained great energy til the end. It was a strong competition for them this soon after World Team Trophy. I don't think they even got their LP until maybe June. It almost looked like they forgot what the ending pose was supposed to be haha. But they looked great with room to keep getting better.

Their throw triple loop was stunning. When Brandon throws her correctly, their throws are truly amazing. Credit to him for changing his technique to suit Alexa better. She has the best athleticism on the throws that I've ever seen from the US and she was really confident on them today. I can tell she loves flying across the ice on the throws in a way that Aljona Savchenko does.

I agree that K/F's athleticism and energy matches better with each other than with their former partners. They're also both calmer and more confident now because they're not worried about the other person. When they made a little mistake, they came away from it smiling instead of tensing up. I appreciated all of Chris Knierim's best qualities, but K/K never had the steadiness that K/F are already showing on pretty much a regular basis. They didn't skate perfect here, but they avoid making bigger mistakes. Brandon got a bit antsy on the 3-jump-combo today, but it's new for them and at least they both landed the 3T.

It was also great to see their 3twist was stronger today than in the SP- it had a better pop and came down better. I'm baffled how one judge only gave it +2. That judge also gave them +3 on their throw loop, which was stingy given how high quality it was. But you can often find a weird thing or two on a protocol sheet. Overall they scored a well-deserved Personal Best (I think Sr B's count towards PBs anyway).

OMG, I completely agree. I don't understand why they chose that cover for the first 3/4 of the program. Why why why? At first I thought it was bc they didn't have the legal rights or whatever to use the original, but then they ended with the original Coldplay version which was SOOOOO much better, and the skaters and audience all seemed so much more inspired for that last 25%!! I hope they just scrap that cover and switch to Coldplay 100% of the program!

I actually kinda liked that there was both a female and male vocalist instead of the original Coldplay version all the way through, it adding something interesting. If I look up that cover on Youtube, a lot of people love it, but I know skating fans have strong opinions on covers. What was the version of Fix You that Ziegler/Kiefer once skated to as part of a Coldplay medley? I remember liking that version too. Alexa is the star of the team and so I don't mind a female vocalist. The program builds towards the end, so naturally there will be a stronger reaction towards that part. But we could take literally any song or cover and some people like it and some don't.

 

[Andrea82]

@Andrea82, does the fact that P/F don't have the TES minimum in the sp needed for Worlds mean that they have to obtain it first in order to qualify for Worlds, even despite having the FS minimum for Worlds?

Yes, they need to obtain the minimum TES in both segments. It is not necessary to obtain the SP and FS minimums in the same competition.
I think the SP minimum is doable for them. Looking at their Cranberry score, they would need to avoid the negative GOE on the twist.

 

[lariko]

Sure tastes in costumes can differ. What is it exactly that you don't like though? I don't see anything wrong with the shade or the styling. What would you do differently?

The shade.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

The shade.

What shade would you suggest though, since you don't like this shade? I think they look fine. I like their fp costumes. This shade goes well with Vlad's red hair and with Evgenia's blond good looks.

There's no doubt that a lot of thought and reflection by Eteri, T/M, the costume designer, and even Max & Zhulin, went into this choice.

It's a deep, rich shade of gray, with sparkles. The design and cut of Vlad's top is particularly flattering on him. A matter of taste, if you don't like the 'shade.' The SP costumes are interesting. Not bad. But I really like the FS costumes.

ETA:
I have to admit I barely realized Zhenya did a costume change during the sp. LOL! I think the first dress look was good enough, and they really didn't need the change gimmick. The change had nothing to do with the actual program in terms of adding anything to telling a story. It's just an Eteri gimmick. Not necessary.

 

[Skater Boy]

Sure, but I still say that K/F and C/J skated very well in the sp and both deserved to at least break 70 pts for their fine efforts. Had they been Russian teams with the same performances, they would have been better rewarded. Let's not kid ourselves. Other styles and skills not attached to Russian skaters deserve to be rewarded too.

And obviously, as I said, U.S. skaters will still have to back up strong performances time and again, because they get no breaks and no gifts from the judges.

Well they were good but not great not sure deserving 70. then what give the Russians and Chinese low 80s with errors???

 

[Skater Boy]

I loved the bumblebee costumes, too.

LOL I wasn't a fan of the bumblebee look. Reminded me of 1988 Valova and Vasiliev's costumes for the Final Countdown. Who could forget the forgotten ones V squared people forget they were always at least second for years. Then in the final skate of their careers when all hope was lost they beat G and G (who missed their throw 3Salchow.

 

[PaulE]

LOL I wasn't a fan of the bumblebee look. Reminded me of 1988 Valova and Vasiliev's costumes for the Final Countdown. Who could forget the forgotten ones V squared people forget they were always at least second for years. Then in the final skate of their careers when all hope was lost they beat G and G (who missed their throw 3Salchow.

I don't remember Valova and Vasiliev, so thank you for the names. They had quite the yellow costumes. Here is a link to their 1988 performance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWgHWLhrjMs

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

That's good of them! I wonder if Zhenya was too shy to tell them.

Or maybe she did and they still messed it up. Because I'm not entirely sure I say Evgeni/a right myself

I've been pronouncing 'Evgenia' with a hard 'g.' I just realized that it's probably pronounced accurately with a soft 'g.'

 

[anonymoose_au]

I've been pronouncing 'Evgenia' with a hard 'g.' I just realized that it's probably pronounced accurately with a soft 'g.'

Yeah me too!

Also Zhenya...which judging from Med's Insta account name is supposed to be more like "Jen-ya" than "ZEN-ya" But I feel cool when I say it that way

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Well they were good but not great not sure deserving 70. then what give the Russians and Chinese low 80s with errors???

I'm not sure what you're trying to say. I'm discussing scoring for this particular event. And I said that the top two U.S. teams skated well enough to break 70 in the sp! At least 70+ for C/J and at least 71+ for K/F.

How they each performed here has nothing to do with the judging of Russian and Chinese teams at other events in the future! As it is, T/M were slightly over-scored in the sp, particularly in view of how K/F and C/J were judged here. T/M deserved to be ahead, but not necessarily by that much in the sp. T/M's beautiful skating in the FS was a confidence grab. They knew they really couldn't lose with the score the judges gave them in the sp.

I agree with Dave Lease who was at the event in person, when he said that C/J's speed, skating skills, superb 3-twist, and quality on lifts rivals T/M. It is C/J's amazing high-level qualities which has everyone shaking their heads about the sbs jump problems, and the difference in their technique on throws which they haven't yet figured out, which is why Jess gets great height but not much distance. And then Brian somehow throws her rather crooked, and she generally tends to straighten out and land like a cat.

K/F too are exceptionally good, especially for a team in only their second season, after an abbreviated competitive first season. Stop looking down on U.S. pairs. It's an exciting group of skaters in one of the more exciting disciplines in figure skating today.