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- Feb 4, 2008
Well to be fair, Brian has become the judges' new pet.
Let the Competition and Complaining Begin!
- Thread starter jettasian
- Start date
Well to be fair, Brian has become the judges' new pet.
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- Mar 25, 2008
Based on one SP? I think it's never a good idea to read to much into the result from one event. If Patrick had not done so, maybe he wouldn't have felt the need to complain about his scoring and trash Brian again last night (though at least this time he limited himself to on-ice stuff). Honestly, the people at Skate Canada really need to re-think their strategy. Chan's a great skater but he's not doing himself any favors with his off-ice behavior this week.
I really want to see a video of the SP press conference. Has anyone seen anything surface?
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- Feb 5, 2004
I didn't watch Chan's skate i went to bed but i did watch the penultimate group skate, and dislike Evan's skating as I do - he was clean - his triple axel axel was good, and despite thinking the one colour costume makes him look far too gangly (i kept thinking of Laurent Tobel!) i don't understand why Joubert is sat in first place - he gave up on the program after the error on the quad and did nothing to sell it at all. Hand down on the quad and step/fall out of the triple toe - i'd like to see the protocols for that. Also work as he has on his spins with Ruh he's still not sitting in his sit spin - it's higher up than at Europeans - his calf and thigh don't even make a right angle - but it must have been called a sit spin. I don't think he'd get away with that at an adult competition!
Ant
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- Mar 25, 2008
I thought Evan skated very well, with the caveat that like Brian and Tomas I only saw him on Youtube, so it's not quite the same effect (I somehow woke up for Chan and KvdP - go figure
). He doesn't look like Tobel to me, but I agree his costumes and arm length make him look like his flapping and flaliling even if he's not, something that could be remedied with better costumes. Good for him for staying out of the quad skirmish and saying nothing but nice things about everyone and everything (though I must say I feel Joubert has also handled it well). I think Evan can be very proud of last night's performance.No need to wonder about Brian's 4-3 marks - it's been reported in several places that he got a 10.6 for it, which I believe works out to about -1.4 GOE. I agree it wasn't the best performance Joubert's given of Rise, but FWIW, Chan wasn't at his best either, and still got higher marks than Buttle did at 2008 Worlds. I thought Tomas Verner was unlucky with his score. He had a wonky landing on the axel but was otherwise fantastic.
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- Jun 3, 2008
It was nice that evan skated like this in front of his home crowd, but i found his performance too much. His costume has anything to do with bolero?
The cross is scary..
What kozuka has to do to make judges notice him more?He is a tornado, i loved him!
The cross is scary..What kozuka has to do to make judges notice him more?He is a tornado, i loved him!
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- Feb 5, 2004
I thought Evan skated very well, with the caveat that like Brian and Tomas I only saw him on Youtube, so it's not quite the same effect (I somehow woke up for Chan and KvdP - go figure
Sounds like i've missed some "controversy" at the conference! The men#s thread is over 50 pages though and i haven't found anything about it yet - can you shed some light Buttercup?
Sounds like Brian got lucky with his GOE on the quad combo and getting his sit spins called.
Ant
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- Mar 25, 2008
Sorry, I didn't see too much of it. The thread is long because there was PBP right from the start - 50 men! I think people will always find the judging controversial, no matter which system is used.
Or maybe since the judges feel that since -1 GOE drops the score by 1.6 - which is quite a bit - they should adjust their scoring accordingly? He did lose 2.2 points off the base mark.
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- Feb 5, 2004
If they did then i'd feel disappointed (there's a surprise to be disappointed with the judges) because the -GOE errors are clearly spelled out in the rules and Brian had at least three, possibly four errors with that combination. I would say that he only lost 2.2 off the base mark which means that he still got more points for a 4T-3T with errors on both jumps than the base mark for a clean 3Lz-3T.
I wonder how Ponsero faired on his GOE for the same element?
Actually - here's a question for poeple who understand the mathematics of scoring better than me.
If someone does a 4T+3T as Brian did - with errors on both jumps, how is teh GOE worked out on the element at a whole - because the -GOE are different for the 4T and 3T - how does it work mathematically? If e.g. he had fallen on the triple toe at the end and the GOE was -3 across the board would he just lose 3 ponts from the combo base mark for the fall on the triple toe? Or would he lose 4.8 marks from the combo base score, or would he lose e.g. 3.9 points being a split between the -3 tariff for teh triple toe and the -4.8 tariff for the quad?
Ant
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- Feb 4, 2008
I mean in general. I am Brian's biggest fan, but sometimes I'm quite surprised at the grades he gets. This is mostly due to the fact that before he used to be quite severly judged, so such a change in the grades he gets is quite a surprise ( a very nice one don't get me wrong!). It's just when I look back, Brian used to get fairly low grades when it came to choreography etc, but now he gets the highest on the circuit. Take for example his LP at Euros this year. If he'd have skated that same program two or three seasons ago he'd have got very low artistic grades. And he's not being so harshly punished anymore for his mistakes, just look at the grade he got for his SP during this year's TEB, despite not executing the quad-triple. The judges have really started re-appreciating Brian since 08 world's and it's really nice (and well deserved). Before he really wasn't allowed to make any mistakes, but now the judges forgive him.
The judges have really started re-appreciating Brian since 08 world's and it's really nice (and well deserved). Before he really wasn't allowed to make any mistakes, but now the judges forgive him.[/QUOTE]
... as long as he doesn't try a spiral or a camel.... unnnngh
... as long as he doesn't try a spiral or a camel.... unnnngh
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- Jul 28, 2003
Brian Joubert never let go of his angst from last season when he lost his World Title to Jeff Buttle. It's kind of sad and childish behavior. I am not a huge Joubert fan at any rate. I find his programs kind of boring and his costumes never make any sense. He is not the most inspiring skater.
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- Mar 25, 2008
Well, that was last year. This week Brian Joubert's handling of the "controversy" was far classier than that of Chan, Chan's coaches, and his media fan club.
Though I must say the most unpleasant article I saw this week came not from anyone in Canada but from Christine Brennan of USA Today, who after the SP pretty much accused Didier Gailhaguet of orchestrating a conspiracy on Brian's behalf, and selectively quoted people to try and stir up more controversy. Give me Philip Hersh over her any day.
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- Feb 5, 2004
Thanks MM, again that seems pretty harsh to have the quad GOE applied to the whole lement when it contains a triple. Maybe someone should try for a 4/4 combo!
Ant
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- Feb 4, 2008
Whetever! Brian isn't the only skater to have been favoured by the judges but because he's French, then there's obviously corruption behind! Whatever!!! I doubt that Gailhaguet would try something like that as he knows everyone's on the look-out.
Some poor journalists need this kind of controversy to exist though. Poor thing.
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- Mar 25, 2008
Was anything ever proven against him? I really don't remember. But that's besides the point - even if Ms. Brennan was less than impressed with Joubert's SP, she shouldn't make such an allegation without offering some evidence to back it up (and no, her gut feeling or "nobody understood the score" is not evidence).
Also, her quotes from Frank Carroll were deliberately misleading - she essentially cut out his pointing out Brian's strenghs and left only "he was a World Champion" to make it seem like reputation-based judging. There's no excuse for that - it's just bad journalism.
He was banned for 3 years wasn't he?
I disagree with you. Once someone cheats no one should ever trust them again.
He will always be suspected.
As for the newspaper I agree with you. Leaving out half the quote is dis-honest and should not be allowed.
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
I think the point is twofold, both sort of Zayak related.
First, they want to treat a combo as an element in its own right, different from a jump and then a jump. So if you do the quad part and mess up the second jump, you didn't really do a "quad," what you did was a "flubbed combo."
The other thing thing is they don't want to give full credit for a solo 4T and then also full credit for the quad part of a 4T/3T. Zayak again.
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