Tatsuki Machida

[ioanna]

That's no answer at all, Tatsuki.

Imo, he doesn't need a 2-quad SP or 3-quad LP to be competitive. I think the sport's "advancement," jumping-wise, has been overhyped. There were many reports of crazy jumping layouts over the summer, but so far none of them have panned out, and we're still on the semi-clean 2-quad LP.

I totally agree. But it's still another 4 years so who knows. He definitely changed his mind though, he was determined to retire at the end of this season at first.

 

[Maria Victoria]

I will just take joy in Tatsuki's skating in the here and now, knowing a lot can happen between this season and the Olympics in 2018. I read a post expressing concern for Tatsuki, saying that Tatsuki may be pushing himself too hard on the thinking that this season is his best chance to reach for the brass ring. The kind of effort it takes
to reach for the very top can be extremely demanding and draining so I understand if he cannot fully
commit until Pyeongchang.

 

[ioanna]

I will just take joy in Tatsuki's skating in the here and now, knowing a lot can happen between this season and the Olympics in 2018. I read a post expressing concern for Tatsuki, saying that Tatsuki may be pushing himself too hard on the thinking that this season is his best chance to reach for the brass ring. The kind of effort it takes
to reach for the very top can be extremely demanding and draining so I understand if he cannot fully
commit until Pyeongchang.

I feel the same way and I agree he's pushing himself too hard, this is exactly what happened at TEB. He skated a clean FS in practice the day he arrived in Bordeaux (with a 3A and a 3F-2T-2Lo combo in the second half and everything), he even landed a clean quad right in front of the camera in the 6 minute warm up but imploded when it most mattered. I believe the article also suggested he hurt his ankle when he fell on the opening 4T but he says he's fine.

 

[iceberg]

He did say Sochi was his first and last Olympics but it's probably going to depend on the way things will be going in the next 4 years. His body is definitely unable to perform a 2 quad SP or a 3 quad FS.

28 is still a viable age to medal an olympics.. And he's right I guess now he just needs to go with the flow and remain competitive with all the advancements this sport will eventually lead through. Brian Joubert at 30 was still able to do 2 quads in his long program this year. Plushenko was a 4time olympian in his prime. If machida sustains his competitive state through the years i'll bet my fortunes for him to win a medal at the pyeongchang 2018. I wish him the best as always!

 

[Sandpiper]

The worst thing for Tatsuki to do would be to psych himself out with, "I need 2-quad SP and 3-quad LP! The other men are going to bring it by 2018!" Firstly, it's unlikely to happen. We're still stuck in 2002 jumping-wise (for the men). Secondly, who knows how many--if any--of those 5-quad programs are going to hit off on the given day.

I think it's good he's taking things one season at a time. I hope he deals with the layout in a similar manner: focusing on what he could do, rather than listening to rumours about needing to increase his content.

 

[ioanna]

Retired skater Kensuke Nakaniwa (who is now a technical specialist) wrote a lengthy article about Tatsuki and what happened at TEB. It sounds very informative - especially from a technical point of view, but I could only understand very few details.
http://www.athlete-journal.com/figureskate/kensukenakaniwa20141126.html

 

[ioanna]

The worst thing for Tatsuki to do would be to psych himself out with, "I need 2-quad SP and 3-quad LP! The other men are going to bring it by 2018!" Firstly, it's unlikely to happen. We're still stuck in 2002 jumping-wise (for the men). Secondly, who knows how many--if any--of those 5-quad programs are going to hit off on the given day.

I think it's good he's taking things one season at a time. I hope he deals with the layout in a similar manner: focusing on what he could do, rather than listening to rumours about needing to increase his content.

The news reports before Skate America revealed the fact that he's been practicing 4Lz and 4-4 over the summer and while there are slim chances he will include any of those in competition I guess it shows the fact that he's not yet ready to give up.

I feel like this season he's better than last season, and last season he was better than 2 seasons ago. He's definitely a late bloomer and seems to be improving (both presentation-wise and technical-wise) with age so it would be a pity if he retires before Pyeongchang. He basically got his quad consistent in less than a couple of years and I think all of his jumps are beautiful now (he has a lot of speed going into them, he gets decent height and nice air position and his landings are smooth), his spins have great position and speed (they used to be pretty bad when he was younger) and he's capable of completing everything with intricate footwork.

I've seen people commenting he may soon fill in Stephane Lambiel and Daisuke Takahashi's shoes if he sticks around and keeps evolving and at the same time his style would be nothing like his predecessors'. If anything I think his style is sometimes reminiscent of Lambiel but the rest is all Machida, even if it provokes strong opposite reactions. I admire the fact that he's bringing something new to the table and not playing safe and trying to fit certain standards.

 

[iceberg]

Retired skater Kensuke Nakaniwa (who is now a technical specialist) wrote a lengthy article about Tatsuki and what happened at TEB. It sounds very informative - especially from a technical point of view, but I could only understand very few details.
http://www.athlete-journal.com/figureskate/kensukenakaniwa20141126.html

can translate?

 

[ioanna]

can translate?

That would be great, thank you. I hope it's not too much of a bother since the article is pretty long.

 

[iceberg]

That would be great, thank you. I hope it's not too much of a bother since the article is pretty long.

oh no i meant "can you translate?"

 

[ioanna]

oh no i meant "can you translate?"

Oh I wish I could understand everything but I mostly have to rely on google translate with this one. Nakaniwa agrees with Tatsuki and says he seems to be having a bit of a stamina problem - understandable though, this year's FS is packed with jumps, footwork, transitions and more jumps - and that his TES was considerably lower because he had no 4T-2T combination, nor his planned 3F-2T-2Lo. In fact there were errors with the 3F because he underrotated and double footed it and it was also marked with an unclear edge. He also didn't get a level 4 for his StSq (he did get one in the FS at Skate America) and Nakaniwa felt like his legs "did not move as freely".

 

[iceberg]

Oh I wish I could understand everything but I mostly have to rely on google translate with this one. Nakaniwa agrees with Tatsuki and says he seems to be having a bit of a stamina problem - understandable though, this year's FS is packed with jumps, footwork, transitions and more jumps - and that his TES was considerably lower because he had no 4T-2T combination, nor his planned 3F-2T-2Lo. In fact there were errors with the 3F because he underrotated and double footed it and it was also marked with an unclear edge. He also didn't get a level 4 for his StSq (he did get one in the FS at Skate America) and Nakaniwa felt like his legs "did not move as freely".

That is really good insight thanks ionap! That;s what I also thought of why Machida had a low score considering the quality of his LP, he missed a lot in his TES. I can't help but compare Yuzu's LP with Machida's because Yuzu had like what 4 or 5 falls? and yet he scored 5 points more than Machida's on the LP.

BTW can i ask why was Yuzu's 3A scored 9.35 vs Machida's 3A+2T scored 9.80? Not even a point difference? Can you pls enlighten me?

 

[ioanna]

I can't help but compare Yuzu's LP with Machida's because Yuzu had like what 4 or 5 falls? and yet he scored 5 points more than Machida's on the LP.

BTW can i ask why was Yuzu's 3A scored 9.35 vs Machida's 3A+2T scored 9.80? Not even a point difference? Can you pls enlighten me?

As long as Yuzuru was able to rotate his jumps the penalty for falls is -1 so the jumps get full credit -3GOE and his 4T was basically worth 7.30 points. Furthermore, Yuzuru's 3A was in the second half of the program and its base value was multiplied by 1.1 but the final result was actually 6.35 because he got -3GOE.

 

[HanDomi]

That is really good insight thanks ionap! That;s what I also thought of why Machida had a low score considering the quality of his LP, he missed a lot in his TES. I can't help but compare Yuzu's LP with Machida's because Yuzu had like what 4 or 5 falls? and yet he scored 5 points more than Machida's on the LP.

BTW can i ask why was Yuzu's 3A scored 9.35 vs Machida's 3A+2T scored 9.80? Not even a point difference? Can you pls enlighten me?

ah I looked in protocols, you took wrong numbers from protocol on Yuzuru 3A - 9.35 is the base value for 3A, but Yuzuru got -3GOE for fall so he scored 6.30
Tatsuki for 3A2T scored 10.66 - base value for that was 9.80

 

[ioanna]

Yuzuru scored perfect 3.0 GOE for 3A, and Tatsuki got lower GOE for this combination I believe ( I don't remember protocols ) 2T in combination doesn't have too much points really

I think iceberg was comparing Yuzuru's 3A from the FS with Tatsuki's 3A-2T from the FS (if I understood correctly).

 

[Wo|flax]

Sorry for random jumping in;
Yuzuru's 3A is in the second half, therefore second half bonus; whereas Tatsu's is in the first half, no bonus, but has the 2T, so it works out to higher BV. You should look at the furthest right hand column for final scores (scores of panel) (10.66 vs 6.34 [and of course the mandatory -1 deduction not counted in this], so all in all more than 5 points more than what Yuzuru got for his fall; Machida also only got 0.86 goe but I can't remember the jump to tell you why; one judge gave him +3 though [unfortunately not counted])
ETA:slow and late:

This just made me notice Machida has a 4-4 split not a 3-5 split :think: why not?

 

[ioanna]

Sorry for random jumping in;
Yuzuru's 3A is in the second half, therefore second half bonus; whereas Tatsu's is in the first half, no bonus, but has the 2T, so it works out to higher BV. You should look at the furthest right hand column for final scores (scores of panel) (10.66 vs 6.34 [and of course the mandatory -1 deduction not counted in this], so all in all more than 5 points more than what Yuzuru got for his fall; Machida also only got 0.86 goe but I can't remember the jump to tell you why; one judge gave him +3 though [unfortunately not counted])
ETA:slow and late:

To iceberg - this is the complete explanation. Thank you WoChair

 

[iceberg]

ah I looked in protocols, you took wrong numbers from protocol on Yuzuru 3A - 9.35 is the base value for 3A, but Yuzuru got -3GOE for fall so he scored 6.30
Tatsuki for 3A2T scored 10.66 - base value for that was 9.80

You also got it wrong on Yuzu's 3A. Base value is 8.5 (not 9.80) +10% bonus because its on the 2nd half of the program hence he got 9.35.

But thanks guys for the enlightenment! Totally forgot about the 10%! lolz

 

[iceberg]

To iceberg - this is the complete explanation. Thank you WoChair

Yasyasyas! thankies!!

 

[ioanna]

This just made me notice Machida has a 4-4 split not a 3-5 split :think: why not?

Maybe he wants to prevent further loss of stamina by performing 5 jumping passes after the StSq, I'm not sure :think: Even with a 4-4 split he's still not fully adjusted to the program.