2015-16 State of U.S. Men's Figure Skating | Page 28 | Golden Skate

2015-16 State of U.S. Men's Figure Skating

Baby P slept at 7:10 p.m. tonight which meant more time... to finish my U.S. men scoring spreadsheet!! The season has begun. :biggrin:

So power rankings (for seniors nationally), then some numbers. I'm going to keep it to Overall since we don't have everyone yet. And I'm going to spilt by Senior/Junior (nationally)

1.) Nathan Chen - He still has the highest score overall and in the free skate among the men and has landed the most quads (2, in case anyone was counting).
2.) Max Aaron - He had a awesome SP with the highest score, TES and PCS and a nice 4-3 combo. He did not do as well in the FS. It appears he is really working on his overall skating and performance, but he needs to make sure not to lose his money jumps.
3.) Vincent Zhou - He landed two quads! A very solid performance on the JGP. Solid performance ability. We'll see if he snags a JGPF berth!
4.) Jason Brown - We haven't seen him yet and some summer struggles (which comes with learning what looks to be tough programs) had me placing him barely in the top five, but then his jump coach went and posted a video of him landing a quad! For reals. Of course, it's not in competition, so I can't put him above the top 3 just yet. However, I felt this was a good compromise since he is coming off a decent season, and there's a quad.
5.) Timothy Dolensky - He had a decent summer and a decent showing at his first senior B (SLC, 4th), which apparently help him get another Senior B and a GP! He's shown to have a quad, but struggles on the triple axel.
6.) Adam Rippon - He's been posting some quad lutz videos that look good, but again hard to say if they would be ratified in competition. We haven't him yet either, but the others ranked below haven't wowed yet, so here he is. I debated whether to switch him with Timothy.
---
7.) Ross Miner - He has solid programs and beautiful skating quality, as always. But the jumps just aren't there. He was lucky to medal at SLC (he was actually beaten by Dolensky in the FS).
8.) Grant Hochstein - Very good summer, that included a program with a quad, but he had a so-so performance at Nebelhorn this weekend. He clearly has the goods, but just needs to put it all together when it counts.
9.) Richard Dornbush - As always, he has the good, but also needs to put it all together, which he did not do in SLC. In fact, his SP TES is actually the LOWEST among EVERYONE, including the junior skaters.
10.) Alexander Johnson - OK Summer comp season, two really interesting programs, but again what will it look like come Senior B time?
11.) Jordan Moeller - Like Jason, he had a less than impressive summer season, but he too landed a quad recently.
12.) Joshua Farris - Well, he's injured for now. Not much more to say. :cry:

And now the scores!!

OVERALL SENIOR
Chen 236.76 (JGP USA)
Aaron 222.94 (Nebelhorn)
Miner 209.93 (SLC)
Zhou 211.96 (JGP Austria)
Dolensky 209.06 (SLC)
Hochstein 194.88 (Nebelhorn)
Dornbush 191.02 (SLC)

OVERALL JUNIOR
Alexei Krasnozhon 194.68 (JGP Riga)
Tomoki Hiwatashi 185.66 (JGP USA)
Oleksiy Melnyk 170.39 (JGP Austria)
Anthony Boucher 164.33 (JGP USA)
Kevin Shum 163.54 (JGP Bratslavia)
Paolo Borromeo 159.19 (JGP Riga)
 
Baby P slept at 7:10 p.m. tonight which meant more time... to finish my U.S. men scoring spreadsheet!! The season has begun. :biggrin:

So power rankings (for seniors nationally), then some numbers. I'm going to keep it to Overall since we don't have everyone yet. And I'm going to spilt by Senior/Junior (nationally)

1.) Nathan Chen - He still has the highest score overall and in the free skate among the men and has landed the most quads (2, in case anyone was counting).
2.) Max Aaron - He had a awesome SP with the highest score, TES and PCS and a nice 4-3 combo. He did not do as well in the FS. It appears he is really working on his overall skating and performance, but he needs to make sure not to lose his money jumps.
3.) Vincent Zhou - He landed two quads! A very solid performance on the JGP. Solid performance ability. We'll see if he snags a JGPF berth!
4.) Jason Brown - We haven't seen him yet and some summer struggles (which comes with learning what looks to be tough programs) had me placing him barely in the top five, but then his jump coach went and posted a video of him landing a quad! For reals. Of course, it's not in competition, so I can't put him above the top 3 just yet. However, I felt this was a good compromise since he is coming off a decent season, and there's a quad.
5.) Timothy Dolensky - He had a decent summer and a decent showing at his first senior B (SLC, 4th), which apparently help him get another Senior B and a GP! He's shown to have a quad, but struggles on the triple axel.
6.) Adam Rippon - He's been posting some quad lutz videos that look good, but again hard to say if they would be ratified in competition. We haven't him yet either, but the others ranked below haven't wowed yet, so here he is. I debated whether to switch him with Timothy.
---
7.) Ross Miner - He has solid programs and beautiful skating quality, as always. But the jumps just aren't there. He was lucky to medal at SLC (he was actually beaten by Dolensky in the FS).
8.) Grant Hochstein - Very good summer, that included a program with a quad, but he had a so-so performance at Nebelhorn this weekend. He clearly has the goods, but just needs to put it all together when it counts.
9.) Richard Dornbush - As always, he has the good, but also needs to put it all together, which he did not do in SLC. In fact, his SP TES is actually the LOWEST among EVERYONE, including the junior skaters.
10.) Alexander Johnson - OK Summer comp season, two really interesting programs, but again what will it look like come Senior B time?
11.) Jordan Moeller - Like Jason, he had a less than impressive summer season, but he too landed a quad recently.
12.) Joshua Farris - Well, he's injured for now. Not much more to say. :cry:

And now the scores!!

OVERALL SENIOR
Chen 236.76 (JGP USA)
Aaron 222.94 (Nebelhorn)
Miner 209.93 (SLC)
Zhou 211.96 (JGP Austria)
Dolensky 209.06 (SLC)
Hochstein 194.88 (Nebelhorn)
Dornbush 191.02 (SLC)

OVERALL JUNIOR
Alexei Krasnozhon 194.68 (JGP Riga)
Tomoki Hiwatashi 185.66 (JGP USA)
Oleksiy Melnyk 170.39 (JGP Austria)
Anthony Boucher 164.33 (JGP USA)
Kevin Shum 163.54 (JGP Bratslavia)
Paolo Borromeo 159.19 (JGP Riga)

Our juniors are consistently scoring higher than our seniors? :eek:

That is kind of sad. But at least it shows we have awesome juniors! :agree:
 
Our juniors are consistently scoring higher than our seniors? :eek:

That is kind of sad. But at least it shows we have awesome juniors! :agree:
To be honest i don't see Nathan as a Junior anymore. He's ready to take on the big boys. Same with M/C in Ice Dance.
 
Our juniors are consistently scoring higher than our seniors? :eek:

That is kind of sad. But at least it shows we have awesome juniors! :agree:

The junior season starts earlier, so they've been competition-ready for longer. Most of the senior scores came from summer comps where the skaters are still working on their programs and haven't completely built up their stamina.
 
To be honest i don't see Nathan as a Junior anymore. He's ready to take on the big boys. Same with M/C in Ice Dance.

Like it or no he is still very much a Junior.

The junior season starts earlier, so they've been competition-ready for longer. Most of the senior scores came from summer comps where the skaters are still working on their programs and haven't completely built up their stamina.

THIS, THANKYOU.

I guess it's more convenient for certain people to ignore this fact.
 
The junior season starts earlier, so they've been competition-ready for longer. Most of the senior scores came from summer comps where the skaters are still working on their programs and haven't completely built up their stamina.

Are Nebelhorn Trophy and the USFS Classic considered summer comps? I thought Challenger events were part of the regular season...
 
Are Nebelhorn Trophy and the USFS Classic considered summer comps? I thought Challenger events were part of the regular season...

They are. But for Grand Prix skaters, people like Max and Jason, these competitions are little more than warmups. They don't need to be really ready until Skate America. Which is a long, long, long time after skaters like Chen had to be 100% ready.
 
They are. But for Grand Prix skaters, people like Max and Jason, these competitions are little more than warmups.

It is possible that Max and Jason would not take these events seriously.

However, referring to them as 'summer comps' seems inaccurate, IMO. (Not directed at you, karne, I know those weren't your words.)
 
FWIW, Nathan's scores are just on par with what the highest scoring U.S. Men received as the end of the GP last season. So I think it's reasonable to take notice.
 
It is possible that Max and Jason would not take these events seriously.

However, referring to them as 'summer comps' seems inaccurate, IMO. (Not directed at you, karne, I know those weren't your words.)

I feel the need to make note that Max's SP at Nebelhorn suggests that he did take the comp quite seriously.

(sabinfire, you and I are on the same page that Challenger events are not dismissable.)


Baby P slept at 7:10 p.m. tonight which meant more time... to finish my U.S. men scoring spreadsheet!! The season has begun. :biggrin: ...

Thanks to Mrs. P :) and Baby P :) for the new rankings.

FWIW, Nathan's scores are just on par with what the highest scoring U.S. Men received as the end of the GP last season. So I think it's reasonable to take notice.

And thanks for pointing out this stat-fact, Mrs. P. Notice taken :yes:.
 
I feel the need to make note that Max's SP at Nebelhorn suggests that he did take the comp quite seriously.

(sabinfire, you and I are on the same page that Challenger events are not dismissable.)




Thanks to Mrs. P :) and Baby P :) for the new rankings.



And thanks for pointing out this stat-fact, Mrs. P. Notice taken :yes:.

I was blown away by Max's SP at Nebelhorn and by how much he improved since WTT! I truly respect the amount of work he has been putting in on his line, extension, carriage--and I am thrilled to see the result! His LP isn't there yet, but I think he has a great chance to make that happen as well.
 
It is possible that Max and Jason would not take these events seriously.

However, referring to them as 'summer comps' seems inaccurate, IMO. (Not directed at you, karne, I know those weren't your words.)

SLC qualifies, doesn't it?
 
SLC qualifies, doesn't it?

Qualifies as what?

At the risk of stating the obvious:
The SLC Classic belongs to the ISU Challenger series, along with Nebelhorn, Nepela, and seven other events.
The SLC Classic happens to take place very close to the end of summer. The fact remains that it is an ISU Challenger comp.​

For most U.S. fans, I think "summer comps" is shorthand referring to non-ISU events such as the Broadmoor Open, Skate Detroit, Glacier Falls, and the like.
I don't see anything to be gained from lumping the SLC Classic with non-ISU summer comps.
They are apples, whereas the SLC Classic is an orange.

(I believe the skaters themselves would view the SLC Classic quite differently from Glacier Falls, for example.)


I was blown away by Max's SP at Nebelhorn and by how much he improved since WTT! I truly respect the amount of work he has been putting in on his line, extension, carriage--and I am thrilled to see the result! His LP isn't there yet, but I think he has a great chance to make that happen as well.

:agree: Wholeheartedly agree. Go, Max!
 
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So, to save arguing, they are not summer comps, but they are comps where senior skaters are unlikely to be at a peak of form unlike GPs and Nationals etc because they are early in their season. This being unlike the Juniors at this time who are in their GP season already.
 
So, to save arguing, they are not summer comps, but they are comps where senior skaters are unlikely to be at a peak of form unlike GPs and Nationals etc because they are early in their season. This being unlike the Juniors at this time who are in their GP season already.

If you ask me, perhaps I would liken JGPs to red apples and early Challenger events to green apples ;). But both are apples, IMO.

(Disclaimer: I am not a botanist or apple expert -- just speaking colloquially and off the cuff.)
 
JGP are like late-season Fujis while Challenger Events are like early season Golden Delicious. How'd you like those apples?! Haha couldn't reisist -- I hail from the land of apples...
 
JGP are like late-season Fujis while Challenger Events are like early season Golden Delicious. How'd you like those apples?! Haha couldn't reisist -- I hail from the land of apples...

Love them apples :) :agree:.

And I apologize for garbling my analogies :eek:: earlier I said that the SLC Classic was an orange compared to the apples of the summer comps.

So correcting myself:
I should have said that the summer comps are oranges :yes:. And the SLC Classic is an apple.​

Off-topic P.S.: Fujis are some of my favorite apples.
 
So can we say that the Senior GPs are pumpkins since they're one of the things we really look forward to every fall? :)
 
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