Nathan Chen

[yyyskate]

yes!! Those leaps to “nemesis is, nemesis is” - and the whole step sequence
this is quite a mature song which I realized when my 10 yr old cousin (who is a Nathan fan!) wanted to listen to it.
I guess it must be allowed since it’s been happening - but um the b-word is allowed in music for a program?
I usually don’t like music with lyrics to programs - especially when they use those weird covers vs the original.

not only the "nemesis is" leaps, but also "so you turn a round" is matched to Nathan's spin change position. and "march on" is also matched to Nathan's "march" on ice. All these arrangement I think originally are all intentional. However the specific execution varied between outings.

I just watched Nemesis COI show version again, perhaps is the one that kept the most original choreo/transition.

I don't know will figure skating songs be PG rated ,but this board is certainly PG rated

 

[sheetz]

here’s the video:
https://instagram.com/p/BhMTksmhUkE/

ahhh I’m so excited for black shirt Nemesis

Those Japanese and Korean fans are so fast now!

 

[sheetz]

COR is my favorite performance of nemesis

yeah I would think all of this is supposed to be family friendly ...
but umm ... am I the only one who hears a questionable word before the “nemesis is, nemesis is” ...

I was surprised when I first read the lyrics, but I don't mind it. And it's not like Nathan is the first to use the song.

 

[yyyskate]

yyyskate - agree with you - the choreo in the beginning of Back from the Edge is brilliant (love the nemesis-like stilted lunge walks) - the choreo overall kinda seems like a “Nathan’s greatest hits” - isn’t he way too young for that yet though lol

that lunge walk and the choreographic timing of it is sooooo brilliant, (How genius is Nathan:luv17:) and I think it is also inspired by "No Good" (the upperbody drop) besides Nemesis.

and :yes: about the bold part

 

[yyyskate]

COR is my favorite performance of nemesis

yeah I would think all of this is supposed to be family friendly ...
but umm ... am I the only one who hears a questionable word before the “nemesis is, nemesis is” ...

no you are not alone, i ALSO heard that word:hopelessness:

yes I also like COR nemesis a lot, because, he is the hottest in COR nemesis, that ending pose is everything I will vote it at the "hottest" ending pose of this season

 

[sheetz]

oh ok. I’ve never read the lyrics - but I have heard it
I don’t care at all but I don’t really want a 10 yr old listening to this song on its own lol

But if you tell kids they can't watch the program it'll make it that much more enticing for them! LOL

Imagine PG-13 rated figure skating programs. Ratings will skyrocket!

Of course grandma will be outraged.

 

[yyyskate]

confession - I don’t like No Good at all and have probably only seen it a few times total and hardly remember it at all - other than he looked pretty hot in it at Nationals, but the completely extinguished at worlds gala.
but now that you mention it, I vaguely remember the upperbody drop from it
I agree - choreographic timing of lunge walks is amazing

the "drop" is here https://youtu.be/uUCI0Cxtge4?t=118

I also did not like "no good" that much (I like it, because it is Nathan but not that much). I think it wants to show-off Nathan's hotness, but it felt a little bit too showy thus contrived a bit. Also the music IMO is a little jaded for Nathan Boi.
but I like "no good" for another reason that is it indeed broadened Nathan's figure skating vocabulary a bit.

 

[shine]

i just checked Broadmoor Open(new system testing event) is at June 19 – 23. So he has time to do that, and test out his FS, if Nathan choose to do a Summer event.

Nathan is with J-butt rn learning SOI choreo and tour together, he could arrange a Short from J-butt on the road. Nathan maybe is selecting music recently, cos that "back from the edge"

GlacierFalls_Announcement. Event Dates: July 26th –– July 29th, 2018

I hope not. Not that big of a fan of Buttle’s programs for Hanyu or Zhou...

 

[yyyskate]

I hope not. Not that big of a fan of Buttle’s programs for Hanyu or Zhou...

I think J-butt's Chopin for Yuzuru is a brilliant program and his "chasing cars" for Vincent is also a great attempt which is also the one (out of 2) Vincent kept this season.

Choreographic wise, I think j-Butt did great in terms of these 2 programs.

 

[shine]

I agree - I think Vincent's programs in particular really did not suit him ... I really wanted to like them though.

eta: oops just realized that he did the choreo for Yuzu's Chopin program. I can't even pretend I don't love that program !!

also, Chasing Cars certainly suited Vincent better than Moulin Rouge - but just can't get over the vocals (I like the original Snow Patrol).

I actually thought that program was average. The music cuts were horrible with non related phrases being broken right in the middle and patched together to accommodate spins and footwork. Also none of the most memorable sections which make Ballade No.1 iconic was used. The editing for Nathan’s Chopin Concerto No 1, for example, is much better. I kind of lost a bit of respect for Buttle after that program, actually I think it's one of those programs that looks awesome on the surface mostly thanks to Hanyu's smooth skating and tip top quality on his elements, but the program itself is not all that IMO.

 

[classicalfan]

shine - thank you for your response and you have some valid points. Honestly the only time I've seen Yuzuru's Chopin program was at the Olympics, and perhaps I was just floored by his performance at that moment in time.
I agree - the editing for Nathan's Chopin Concerto was much better - I would go as far to say it was a genius music edit. Love that program so much

Yes, I am fan of SHINE haha. Sometimes the editing of music could make me love or not love a program. The editing for Nathan's Chopin Concerto was respectful to the original music, and kept all the 'sentences' complete. We always say that music has its own motivation and breath, and the best skater would be gifted to visualize the music with skating. I think Nathan has already achieved part of that even at the age of 15.

 

[yyyskate]

shine - thank you for your response and you have some valid points. Honestly the only time I've seen Yuzuru's Chopin program was at the Olympics, and perhaps I was just floored by his performance at that moment in time.
I agree - the editing for Nathan's Chopin Concerto was much better - I would go as far to say it was a genius music edit. Love that program so much

Yuzuru's chopin choreography has been changed quite a bit from its debut (it has been skated for 3 seasons). I think every version, choreographically is great.

To my untrained ears (not a classical music Connoisseur), I think its music editing is seamless. the secondary creation(music editing) on top of Chopin's original score does not sounded odd to me.

to mention a small thing that showcase J-butt's choreo genius: the diversity of his choreo in terms of how music is used to match spins. the idea is completely different in Yuzuru's Chopin program from Vincent's "chasing cars" program.
Another thing J-butt pushed Vincent a bit artistry wise is the choreo of its stsq. the pattern of which is really impressive and also forced Vincent to skate on more planes.

 

[classicalfan]

I agree - I think Vincent's programs in particular really did not suit him ... I really wanted to like them though.

eta: oops just realized that he did the choreo for Yuzu's Chopin program. I can't even pretend I don't love that program !!

also, Chasing Cars certainly suited Vincent better than Moulin Rouge - but just can't get over the vocals (I like the original Snow Patrol).

For Vincent, I dont think it's time to talk about whether one program is suit or not because he has not been mature enough to feel the music (it is a little harsh to say that i apologize). I always feel that he skates with his own passion for something but not with music.

 

[yyyskate]

The secondary creation on top of source music is different from irresponsible, weird music editing just to catering for tech elements (like in Boyang's FS, sorry Lori).
But Lori's job for Nathan's FS "last dancer" is absolutely one of her best music editing job.
the rite of spring cut in, kept its original phrasing intact. that is the intact phrasing of brush dance, the rite of spring and the village dance, the interaction parts between all 3 parts are perfectly phrased. she also did some sophisticated music cut/editing during the rite of spring and the village dance. both brilliantly done.

 

[classicalfan]

The secondary creation on top of source music is different from irresponsible, weird music editing just to catering for tech elements (like in Boyang's FS, sorry Lori).
But Lori's job for Nathan's FS "last dancer" is absolutely one of her best music editing job.
the rite of spring cut in, kept its original phrasing intact. that is the intact phrasing of brush dance, the rite of spring and the village, the interaction parts between all 3 parts are perfectly phrased. she also did some sophisticated music cut/editing during the rite of spring and the village dance. both brilliantly done.

Ya, we would not call it irresponsible if the music is edited for some compromise with tech elements. But it is always better to be respectful to the motivation, to the phrasing, and to the subtle things in music. That's something that not only makes one a great choreographer or skater, but distinguishes you among the great ones.

 

[yyyskate]

I feel bad about saying that about Vincent's programs - I want to Vincent to do well! And I see skates with passion - certainly shows more outwards passion than Nathan and I am sure there is a music/program that can better suit where he is, at this point in time. Hoping for some great programs next season from him.

Mao's Last Dancer/Sacre du Printemps ... the music edit was so genius! The Mao's Last Dancer music is #23 Village Dance from the soundtrack and I think only one small section was cut ... the Rite of Spring section seemed like it was inserted quite seamlessly. love love love

I love Vincent as much as I love Nathan. but musicality and dance sensitivity wise. Vincent is not particularly gifted as Nathan.
Vincent is particularly weaker in dance sensitivity than Nathan.

There is only so much a choreographer can do. But Vincent's performance is very passionate, he gives it 100% every time. that trait could be cleverly utilized to Vincent's advantage.

 

[yyyskate]

Ya, we would not call it irresponsible if the music is edited for some compromise with tech elements. But it is always better to be respectful to the motivation, to the phrasing, and to the subtle things in music. That's something that not only makes one a great choreographer or skater, but distinguishes you among the great ones.

most figure skating fans are not classical music connoisseur. As long as the music editing sounded seamless to them that is comply to basic rules of music. it will be fine. but sometimes, in order to accommodating tech element, the music editing is so wrong and so lazy, even untrained ears can detect the broken phrasing etc. those are the type of music editing job I was referring to as irresponsible.

 

[yyyskate]

I play piano but I certainly am not an expert ... it just seems that his program has too many disparate musical pieces - that section from The Planets, too many Star Wars pieces from different movies (I think) and the cantina band music ... ok I don't want to say any more.

yeah, Lori is not particularly inspired when she was doing Boyang's FS. sorry Lori.

 

[yyyskate]

just a case of what I mean by secondary creation (music editing wise).
Yuna's Giselle SP. (before I did a very detailed analysis of its music editing)I thought the music itself is so integral, seamless, as if the composer wrote it just for Yuna's SP. Then I figured out its music editing details (including what sounds tracks they used, how they cut and splice, the specifics). then I realized, it is a overwhelmingly sophisticated job. there are many unusual cuts and mix-match. Almost like a music engineering project. Respect!

 

[classicalfan]

just a case of what I mean by secondary creation (music editing wise).
Yuna's Giselle SP. (before I did a very detailed analysis of its music editing)I thought the music itself is so integral, seamless, as if the composer wrote it just for Yuna's SP. Then I figured out its music editing details (including what sounds tracks they used, how they cut and splice, the specifics). then I realized, it is a overwhelmingly sophisticated job. there are many unusual cuts and mix-match. Almost like a music engineering project. Respect!

I like the way you say music engineering. It seems to capture the essence of editing music and playing music as well. I am an engineering major; but when I play music, I feel it really hard to achieve 100% of what I imagine in my mind. Music is a combination of scientific, artistic, and physical things. And skating just lines up with it