2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Flying Feijoa]

Can we please just open a separate thread? Russian coaches in general are pretty tacky people. Almost all (with a few precious exceptions), say terrible things about their past students. I don't want to discuss them. The Russian ladies are very talented, and so much more mature and better behaved. Let's talk about them!

I think Backoutside has tried to do something like that here: https://www.goldenskate.com/forum/threads/russian-schools-power-rankings-20-21.86803/
I guess people could discuss the coaches over there? Only it sounds like the scope is more general (ladies, men, pairs, dance) so if you're looking for a fight, it might be harder to start one about coaches of pairs and men (ice dance makes its own dramas).

 

[lopsilceci]

Not to say that Kami's FS is just like outright bad or anything, but for everyone who loves it, can you please tell me why? I personally don't like it because I don't like Bolero, the costume or the choreography, but it's always good to hear the opposite side!

I don't like Bolero for skating much. The costume I'm also not sure about but I do love Kamila's skating and she can make me enjoy pretty much any program.
I don't mind Daniil's choreo for her either, I loved both her Girl in a Ball program and her Exogenesis.
The leg kicks don't bother me, nor the high extensions in her landings. Kamila is probably the most flexible skater out there, so why not use that insane flexibility as a defining and unique feature in her skating?

Bolero is a piece of music that suggest slow and repetitive movements, but I like that they're going for a different rhythm and interpretation here, as I don't think a Bolero-a-la-Carolina Kostner would really work or be effective scoring wise in the current era of ladies skating.

So, even though I didn't immediately love this Bolero at first sight, I can see there's potential there for Kamila to grow into it and turn it into an iconic program for her.

 

[Vandevska]

Yes and in 6 other programs last season with ETERI she had Level 3s and in one program a Level 2 on her StSq, but apparently her Level 4 at Euros last season means she now has to have a Level 4 all the time when she and Anna did not even have that the entire season last season. Half of the time both had Level 3s last season.
You claimed her StSq got worse, I provided the statistics which showed that it was common for Sasha and other Eteri students to have Level 3s and therefore her StSq did not get worse, it stayed the same and it is easy to lose a level on StSqs, it happens to even the best skaters. You claimed her 3Lz+3Lo is an issue, I told you her 3Lz+3Lo has been an issue for over 2 seasons now and you could have easily watched her comps from the past two seasons or looked into the protocols to see that Team Tutberidze constantly took her 3Lz+3Lo out and put it back in since Sasha's 3Lz+3Lo often caused an issue, she fell on it etc. So no, it did not get worse. Adapting to a coach takes time and expecting a new coach to fix all the former errors in a few months, especially after a long quarantine, errors that not even the former team did fix in several seasons is laughable.

Furthermore, we all know once you leave Eteri the edge calls start coming despite the edge being an issue for a long time. Daria had an inside edge on her Lutzes this weekend and did not get an edge call on any of the three Lutzes. That Sasha got an edge call has everything to do with the judges who love to punish skaters with calls once someone leaves Eteri. It has happened with many so far. That judges even dared to call edges at IdF and CoC last season was a rare exception and we all know what happened after.

I was getting pretty annoyed, so thank you for showing a calm way for refuting things with facts. You're my MVP for the thread right now.

 

[karina17]

Can someone send an alert when the thread is done rehashing the Zagitova/Medvedeva/Eteri drama from 2018 for about the 2,018th time?

Alarm set for 13 October, 2030.

 

[Vilord]

I have a question about the russian cup and nationals for this season. Normaly skaters would qualify to junior or senior nationals throught the (j)gp but how does it work for skaters like Usasheva, Valieva, Kromych etc who agewise still belong in juniors but are now doing senior russian cap to qualify to senior nationals? Can they later do another two junior events or will we have a junior nationals without the junior stars?

 

[Resa]

I just rewatched Sasha's FP without sound and whoah!! She has so much speed, so much fluidity!!! It's even more spectacular without music and I think its because hearing the (mostly intense) music slows it down a bit somehow?

 

[Edwin]

Memorial Panina with the best skaters from Sankt Peterburg here: https://vk.com/video-78970490_456239245

Schedule: http://fskating.spb.ru/images/Rasp_Panin_20.pdf
Participants: http://fskating.spb.ru/images/Panin_Entries_20.pdf

Today 31 girls in KMC and 16 women in MC will compete their short programs.

Notable names:
Anastasiya Gubanova
Sof'ya Moroz
Yelizaveta Nugumanova
Yekaterina Ryabova (AZE)

Sof'ya Vazhnova (Moscow)
Mariya Dmitriyeva

 

[Resa]

I appreciate Muravyeva more and more. She has lovely movements, skates fast but doesn't rush the elements. Her spins are also great.

Berestovskaya was very nice to watch as well but I find her choreography lacking. Her costume also does nothing for me (but it might just be because I don't like the colour grey)

 

[Resa]

I have a question about the russian cup and nationals for this season. Normaly skaters would qualify to junior or senior nationals throught the (j)gp but how does it work for skaters like Usasheva, Valieva, Kromych etc who agewise still belong in juniors but are now doing senior russian cap to qualify to senior nationals? Can they later do another two junior events or will we have a junior nationals without the junior stars?

I think if they qualify for sr. Nats then they are automatically qualified for Juniors as well. But if they don't qualify to sr. Nats then they won't be able to go to juniors because they didn't participate in Junior Russian Cup

 

[Jontor]

Memorial Panina with the best skaters from Sankt Peterburg here: https://vk.com/video-78970490_456239245

Schedule: http://fskating.spb.ru/images/Rasp_Panin_20.pdf
Participants: http://fskating.spb.ru/images/Panin_Entries_20.pdf

Today 31 girls in KMC and 16 women in MC will compete their short programs.

Notable names:
Anastasiya Gubanova
Sof'ya Moroz
Yelizaveta Nugumanova
Yekaterina Ryabova (AZE)

Sof'ya Vazhnova (Moscow)
Mariya Dmitriyeva

Great to see Gubanova is skating. There has been no news so I was worried...

And has Nugumanova's injury healed already?

Anastasia Kolomiets will also be there. I like her! She doesn't have the highest tech but she is a lovely skater.

 

[Edwin]

many competitions will run in parallel, Moscow, Sankt Peterburg, Budapest, it's going to be a busy day again.

 

[flanker]

Not to say that Kami's FS is just like outright bad or anything, but for everyone who loves it, can you please tell me why? I personally don't like it because I don't like Bolero, the costume or the choreography, but it's always good to hear the opposite side!

I have to say that I consider such question as - unusual, to put in mildly.

 

[Vilord]

I think if they qualify for sr. Nats then they are automatically qualified for Juniors as well. But if they don't qualify to sr. Nats then they won't be able to go to juniors because they didn't participate in Junior Russian Cup

Ok I guess that makes some sense. Some change to the normal system would obviously have to be made for the skaters that would otherwise have participated in the jgp. Another alternative could have been that everyone on the junior national team qualifies to junior Nats automatically. Or allowing two senior or two junior events. I honestly dont know what the best system would be in this case I was just worried we wouldnt seen valieva etc at Junior nats which would make the event much less interesting to watch. If anyone else has any other insight into the matter please inform us!

 

[nussnacker]

You literally just compared them and then you said you can't compare them? Do you see the hypocrisy there?
Some may really love Kamila's FS, and that's totally fine! And then some might love Sasha's FS, and that's also fine! And to talk about aesthetics and beauty... well that's all subjective.

I don’t agree with the poster, but the expression “you can’t compare them” doesn’t look like a call to action to not compare, but rather a statement that one thing is incomparably better than the other in user’s opinion, hence it’s not even worth to engage in comparisons, since everything’s so obvious without them. ETA, it’s not a contradiction or hypocrisy, rather an expression.

 

[Mawwerg]

There are links to the official documents of the FFKR, so it is quite possible to trust. One of the judges at the last competition actually has a place of work in Sambo70. But this is not unusual for Russia. I remember how last year Volkom was a judge at the championship in which S. Titova participated (and won there). So it's okay. (Although I think that such a thing is not normal in principle)

I believe it's how this system works. Afterall in international competitions judges and skaters represent the same federation quite often.

 

[Edwin]

I believe it's how this system works. Afterall in international competitions judges and skaters represent the same federation quite often.

The international protocols aggregator has a Judging National Bias indicator page.
No doubt, FFKKR has the same, and they should have, because we have witnessed very partial judging even, from the same Volkov for instance.

 

[katymay]

I’ve already made my opinion clear on that a few times I believe, namely, that we need more time for Sasha to polish her programs to judge, and wrote nothing about the choreo for the record. But please keep dragging this topic away to the 18 Olympics.

I think Sasha and Kaori have always had this technique on the flip. And I've always liked it. Yes, technically it is flat vs. the inside edge, but only because of the quick entrance which I enjoy. What I wish is that they would drop this as a deduction, and allow it as a difference in technique. I don't think it is any easier than hitting the inside edge. (Unlike a flutz which is easier than hitting the back outside edge).

 

[dunffvanstorn]

I just rewatched Sasha's FP without sound and whoah!! She has so much speed, so much fluidity!!! It's even more spectacular without music and I think its because hearing the (mostly intense) music slows it down a bit somehow?

I've done the same, but not on purpose, I just wanted to check the podium girls's speed and overall steps/edges during a migraine crisis, so I turned the volume down. I've found out it's pretty effective.

 

[dunffvanstorn]

I appreciate Muravyeva more and more. She has lovely movements, skates fast but doesn't rush the elements. Her spins are also great.

Berestovskaya was very nice to watch as well but I find her choreography lacking. Her costume also does nothing for me (but it might just be because I don't like the colour grey)

Muravieva is a very promising skater. That's a pity she'll have to face competition with Kamila, Daria, Samodelkina. She's a lovely skater.

 

[lesnar001]

I've tried doing this, really I have, once I posted to say how much I enjoyed Liza's programs only to be hit with a laundry list of how Mishin can't put together a competent program or my comment was just ignored.

It's like there's certain skaters you can enjoy on this thread and those you can't.

And if you do enjoy these others skaters you should go to their fan fest unless getting a whole bunch of responses about why you're wrong to enjoy this or that skater is your idea of a good time.

So why is your "laundry list" of how much Daniil's choreography stinks and Kamila Valieva's program is the "worst evah!!!!" any different?
Are you telling me I should "go to her fanfest" if I don't like your criticism?

And were your eyes closed all the times any mention of Alina's programs would bring forth cries of "meaningless transitions", "she looks like she hates her programs" and other such things.

Even you here felt it neccessary to drag up old conspiracy theories of how Eteri set up Evgenia to fail at the 2018 Olympics.
Thus whether willingly or not, somehow tarnishing Alina's well earned victory.

So until you start recognizing your own "faults" and acknowledging that it not just your favorites who are "marginalized", I really cannot take much of what you have been posting seriously.

PS - for every Eteri-fan who now harshly critiques every little thing about Sasha's skating, there were Eteri-non-fans who harshly criticized every little thing about her skating last season. Or did you somehow miss the posts (not necessarily always in RLT) how she was "ruining ladies skating"?

Judging by your silence last season on the outright insults hurled at Sasha, I guess you thought that was just fine.
But now overly critical and nitpicky complaints about her hip shaking choreography have you ready to go to war.
Yeah - I find those complaints over the top also, but no where in the league of what was posted about Sasha last season.
Some of which were bordeline to being personal insults.