2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Arbitrary]

The four quads means there will be no 3Ax.
And the dream of having no-doubles free program is still a dream.

Having her got rid of all the double jumps would put her at a par against men. And justify another wikipedia article.

There's more to do...

 

[eterialskating]

Kostornaia's SP is a dud. It's a poor vehicle for her skating style. The cuts are terrible and frankly she lacks the interpretation and projection for this type of emotional/dramatic programs. Her 2 previous SP's were homeruns especially that Adios Nonino that catapulted her to elite status. I feel she does best in contemporary/modern classical music unlike Anna who is more old school classical. This year both of her programs are not her strong suit. That's just not good planning.

 

[renebaebae]

Kostornaia's SP is a dud. It's a poor vehicle for her skating style. The cuts are terrible and frankly she lacks the interpretation and projection for this type of emotional/dramatic programs. Her 2 previous SP's were homeruns especially that Adios Nonino that catapulted her to elite status. I feel she does best in contemporary/modern classical music unlike Anna who is more old school classical. This year both of her programs are not her strong suit. That's just not good planning.

you haven't even seen the FP and you already know it's not her strong suit?

 

[Arbitrary]

The very fact KOS did not attempt 3Ax is SP means she's still not in her best shape. This is perfectly confirms she lost some good time being without practice. We are to see today the Battle Royale - maybe, maybe not, - but it's still "some local competitions"...

The more interesting question: who would be 1st and who 2nd if both did their SPs without step-outs?
Would the judges dare to put TRU ahead of KOS in SP for the first time ever...

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Regarding the step-out, while I dislike positive GOE for an obvious mistake and don't think Kostornaia should have been given the GOE she got; playing a bit of devil's advocate: Kostornaia covered up her step-out and it didn't seem as disruptive to her program vs. Trusova's.

Am I missing something here? People expect her usual PCS with a stepout, a wonky spin, and no 3A?!

The stepout was obvious as was the lean on the 3T and scratchy/shaky edge landing. The positive GOE (esp +2s) was an absolute joke. She also had an issue with her Biellmann. So overall the program didn’t have the impression of a clean program by any means.

I think there is an expectation of a 3A and dumbing down her difficulty might have played against her. After all it is an easier program with a 2A instead of a triple axel. And part of the reason she scored such high PCS at Russian Nats and Euros was because of said 3A.

At the end of the program she clearly looked upset with herself and that also leaves an impression on the judges. I get skaters are human but shaking your head and whatnot doesn’t exactly convince a judge to give you top marks. As they say - sell it from the moment you get on the ice till the moment you get off of it.

 

[opruh]

Plushenko skaters are so underscored that one with only a 2A and multiple errors in sp is still ranked first. Evil Eteri strikes again.

 

[opruh]

Like this if you want Queen Sofia to win!

 

[Arbitrary]

Combo GOE reflects both jumps or only the 1st one?

 

[dhjh811]

Kostornaia's SP is a dud. It's a poor vehicle for her skating style. The cuts are terrible and frankly she lacks the interpretation and projection for this type of emotional/dramatic programs. Her 2 previous SP's were homeruns especially that Adios Nonino that catapulted her to elite status. I feel she does best in contemporary/modern classical music unlike Anna who is more old school classical. This year both of her programs are not her strong suit. That's just not good planning.

Based on the clips that have been released of her free, I'd say it's a contemporary/modern style. It suits her. I'd also say her interpretation of the short is good, but people have different opinions, I guess...

 

[Vilord]

Combo GOE reflects both jumps or only the 1st one?

I think its meant to judge the element as a whole so deffenitely both jumps. But in the criterias a step out gives -3 to -4 So for her to end up on +2 she would need to hit all of the positive bullets
- Good height and length (she probably gets this one)
-Good takeoff and landing (a step out automatically fail this one)
-Effortless throughout (Allso and automatic fail for a step out)
- Transitions in and/or out of the jump (I think its fine to give her this despite the exit ones being a bit jumbled due to the step out)
- Good body position from takeoff to landing (This one is difficult. i probably wouldnt give her this due to the lean on the 3T but the 3F deffenetly gets it)
-Elements match the music (This i think she hits this verry well)

So overall I gave her 3 or maybe 4 bullets and then we need to detrac 3 or 4 so ending up on a 0 is to me most resonable. I think you can argue for anything from +1 to -2. But in general one would expect negative GOE on any jump element where there was no landing since the penalty is so severe.

 

[Jontor]

I think its meant to judge the element as a whole so deffenitely both jumps. But in the criterias a step out gives -3 to -4 So for her to end up on +2 she would need to hit all of the positive bullets
- Good height and length (she probably gets this one)
-Good takeoff and landing (a step out automatically fail this one)
-Effortless throughout (Allso and automatic fail for a step out)
- Transitions in and/or out of the jump (I think its fine to give her this despite the exit ones being a bit jumbled due to the step out)
- Good body position from takeoff to landing (This one is difficult. i probably wouldnt give her this due to the lean on the 3T but the 3F deffenetly gets it)
-Elements match the music (This i think she hits this verry well)

So overall I gave her 3 or maybe 4 bullets and then we need to detrac 3 or 4 so ending up on a 0 is to me most resonable. I think you can argue for anything from +1 to -2. But in general one would expect negative GOE on any jump element where there was no landing since the penalty is so severe.

We mustn't forget that the judges was all over the place with that combo. From -1 to +2.

I simply think that the judges given her +2, was given her +5 for the Flip (and it was gorgeous) and -3 for the 3T and thus landing on +2.

 

[nussnacker]

Kostornaia's SP is a dud. It's a poor vehicle for her skating style. The cuts are terrible and frankly she lacks the interpretation and projection for this type of emotional/dramatic programs. Her 2 previous SP's were homeruns especially that Adios Nonino that catapulted her to elite status. I feel she does best in contemporary/modern classical music unlike Anna who is more old school classical. This year both of her programs are not her strong suit. That's just not good planning.

I might be old or old-fashioned, but I just don’t get Billie Eilish music even with Aliona skating to it, and that says a lot! I don’t think anyone can pull it off better, aside from Anna, so this makes me think Billie’s music isn’t a very good skating music.
The dress also isn’t doing it for me, for neither Sasha or Aliona.

on the other hand, I thought this is a very good season to experiment with music style and dresses, because it won’t affect anything. So if they wanted to try something else, this is the time. Next season everyone will probably go for more classic styles.
I’m excited for the free though.

 

[kolyadafan2002]

Am I missing something here? People expect her usual PCS with a stepout, a wonky spin, and no 3A?!

The stepout was obvious as was the lean on the 3T and scratchy/shaky edge landing. The positive GOE (esp +2s) was an absolute joke. She also had an issue with her Biellmann. So overall the program didn’t have the impression of a clean program by any means.

I think there is an expectation of a 3A and dumbing down her difficulty might have played against her. After all it is an easier program with a 2A instead of a triple axel. And part of the reason she scored such high PCS at Russian Nats and Euros was because of said 3A.

At the end of the program she clearly looked upset with herself and that also leaves an impression on the judges. I get skaters are human but shaking your head and whatnot doesn’t exactly convince a judge to give you top marks. As they say - sell it from the moment you get on the ice till the moment you get off of it.

Agree about step out , but the wonky spin didn't disrupt the program, and neither did the lack of 3A. Neither should affect PCS (to be clear the step out should affect PCS as it disrupts the flow of the program, but the technical difficulty should not affect PCS and same with technical errors which do not disrupt the program)

 

[Arbitrary]

I see it this way.
Judges were perfectly ready to watch Sasha mislanding her 3Ax and punished her accordingly.
But they were absolutely not ready to watch Alena's issues during SP. And forgot to punish her. Negative GOE magnificently became positive.
(Looks like a certain elections issue in some unrelated county, we don't want to talk about)
After such unexpected events same judges didn't bother to reward Maiya for her perfect program as she deserved....

 

[SXTN]

The competition was interesting. Hate Eteri as much as you like but she is best at creating the complete package.

Aliona is of course the best skater at this competition, but the choreo doesn't fit the music always. There is this dramatic music change before the 3F+3T and she does nothing with it. The dress is pretty but it doesn't suit her well. It makes her look small and rather compact. These are just two examples that would never happen under Eteri. I think that Maia stole the show. Everything looked on point with her.

 

[colormyworld240]

I really don't understand the outrage with Alena's preference of pop music over classical/lyrical. It's what she likes, why should she skate to something else? How could it possibly be a mismatch if it's her choice and what she enjoys. Everyone has their preferences and when you're training 8 hours a day, you should be enjoying it. It's also clear that she's way more into this program (and Twilight) than any of the classical/lyrical programs she's had before.

The only thing I will say is that many of the movements are similar enough that the program looks like another version of Twilight, but they're from 2 different choreographers so I'd bet that Alena likes that style of choreography. Like it or hate it, but she's not taking requests from the public and she shouldn't have to. The judges clearly like it too.

 

[Vilord]

I really don't understand the outrage with Alena's preference of pop music over classical/lyrical. It's what she likes, why should she skate to something else? How could it possibly be a mismatch if it's her choice and what she enjoys. Everyone has their preferences and when you're training 8 hours a day, you should be enjoying it. It's also clear that she's way more into this program (and Twilight) than any of the classical/lyrical programs she's had before.

The only thing I will say is that many of the movements are similar enough that the program looks like another version of Twilight, but they're from 2 different choreographers so I'd bet that Alena likes that style of choreography. Like it or hate it, but she's not taking requests from the public and she shouldn't have to. The judges clearly like it too.

I agree with you whole heartedly. I dont like this music and therefore expected to dislike the program but I dont. There where certenly some areas where the choreoraphy could be improved but overall I think it interpreted the music well and shows of Alionas range of movement from the soft and elegant to the more edgy in the end.
In the end I think what sold the program for me was that Aliona really seemed to enjoy skating to it. That genuine joy is something I awllways value more than the "sofistication" that more classical programs may have.

 

[Skatesocs]

Billie’s music isn’t a very good skating music.

I agree.

 

[McBibus]

You think she deserved higher PCS even with the mistakes?

So, I guess the so called "Eteri bonus" is just a myth.

honestly it's speculation and looking at past years won't help as there was simply no competition for TT so there was no need to push somebody.
IF (again IF) there is a TT bonus it's apparently reserved for Sasha, Kamila and partially Daria.
Looking at their PCS now compared to last year are over the roof.
SS for Anna (9.30, 9.40) and Kamila (9.20) are superlative.

As for you first observation it's a bad habit to tie PCS with TSS but we all saw it historically.
Should be noted tough that Anna scored better PCS on round 3 where she made errors compare to round 1 (37.44 vs 37.20)
I did not expect same PCS as rusnat (that was a perfect execution of a magnificient program while this one is still a work in progress and can be considered "experimental" both for music and choreography) but so low on a domestic competition was not expected either.

 

[McBibus]

Skating skills are judged, like every other judged element, in a moment of the skating performance. Judges are not judging your inherent skating ability, only what you are able to show in one skating programme. The last ISU seminar about Skating Skills is starting with the quote 'all skaters have some worse and some better days', which means that Skating Skills as a score, like everything else skaters are judged on, can fluctuate from the competition to the competition. Otherwise, there is no point of competitions to exist.

I expected harsh critics, but not a "political" response