2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[nussnacker]

But puberty never starts when you're 19

I meant season 19-20. And I didn’t mean it as an example of puberty, but as an example of someone having a struggle season in general. That can be due to a variety of factors, puberty included.
Though, based on what Stanislava said, she had second puberty at 20

 

[chasingneverland]

But puberty never starts when you're 19

The year 2019-2020.

 

[Scott512]

Anna has already changed a lot physically over the course of the last year, and so far, dealing with puberty AND pneumonia, not only was she one of the most consistent skaters with quads this season, but she actually has shown significant improvements in her abilities. Alina also showed an improvement in her technique post 17, probably she had the best jumps she ever had in her life. Whereas, as an example, the girl who was competing at the same time as her and not with Eteri, I.e. Gubanova Nastia, was struggling a lot more dealing with puberty.

This statement is a generalization, which is far from reality. All of the ladies have different technique, they don’t jump similarly, and for that matter - outside of Eteri’s camp rare case that a Russian lady managed to stay in top shape past 18.

For all I know Sofia Samodurova has been training under tech wizard Mishin since a very young age - her technique is nothing similar to Liza and Sofia is struggling to land triples and doubles at this point. She’s also only 18. What happened in this case? Did Eteri look at her and that got Sofia to struggle with jumps?
or perhaps, there’s actually a thing called puberty that can mess with EVERY female skater?

That’s not an isolated case, there’s a whole list of non-Eteri Russian ladies, who weren’t competitive post-18, including Nastia T., Nastia G., Stasya K, Lena R., Anna P., Vika V. and so on and so forthbut people want and desire to see a certain picture of the world, and in that case they try and ignore all facts that don’t fit that picture.

I agree with you about Alina jumping at age 17. She pretty much survived puberty as well and she grew a lot from age 15 to 17 in my opinion.

I've never seen a skater hurt more by puberty than Nastya was. It was like a 3 year puberty to 15 to 18. She's over it now but there may be nothing left of her competitive career. Anna's puberty is alot more subtle. But it's still affecting her and adding just a few pounds can change jumps and technique.

Sasha? She is powering right through puberty.

I don't know what happened to Sofia after she won Europeans 2 years ago. She never got heavy or anything and has very stable coaching.

 

[Scott512]

Sorry hun, misunderstood your post.
Indeed 2018 a splash fest lead by Zagitova. However 2016 and 2017 clean again




Alyona had edge issues at TT as well, also she would prerotate the Lutz a lot sometimes.
Anyway still the most consistent and well rounded senior skater we have seen so far.

I hope she can get back to being that well rounded again. The Olympic season is huge for Aliona. I think she's in play for the 3rd spot. Definitely on the outside looking in at this point but if she gets her form back watch out. Judges love her and she's less likely to bomb than any other high level Russian lady. She will find her game again back at TT.

 

[Ziotic]

Elite athletes absolutely experience puberty different than others. It’s often delayed due to intense physical exercise. So at 18/19 you can still experience changes.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

I'm talking about alyona from TT years.

This season aliona struggled with delayed rotation and underrotations but her toe picks were cleaner than ever, and she was getting pretty consistent outside edges. With Eteri, aliona had great rotation and stamina but had an unclear lutz and some toepick issues (though to be fair by 19/20 she had already improved a lot). so in no season would i say alyona has the best technique. she also has a leg wrap which doesn’t appear to effect her but it’s still not “textbook” technique. The skater with the best technique is ladies is probably Rika. Liza too, but she does suffer a bit from UR issues. Kseniia Sinitsyna has potential to be on that list too.

 

[silveruskate]

I meant season 19-20. And I didn’t mean it as an example of puberty, but as an example of someone having a struggle season in general. That can be due to a variety of factors, puberty included.
Though, based on what Stanislava said, she had second puberty at 20

The year 2019-2020.

Oh my bad, sorry. I thought you were talking about struggling with puberty with Kaori, but just generally!

Stanislava, wow. I hope she wasn't cursing too much when it happened again. She's a fighter.

 

[lopsilceci]

This season aliona struggled with delayed rotation and underrotations but her toe picks were cleaner than ever, and she was getting pretty consistent outside edges. With Eteri, aliona had great rotation and stamina but had an unclear lutz and some toepick issues (though to be fair by 19/20 she had already improved a lot). so in no season would i say alyona has the best technique. she also has a leg wrap which doesn’t appear to effect her but it’s still not “textbook” technique. The skater with the best technique is ladies is probably Rika. Liza too, but she does suffer a bit from UR issues. Kseniia Sinitsyna has potential to be on that list too.

Whaat? This season (from the little we saw her) Aliona also had unclear edge or even flutz.

 

[chasingneverland]

I don't know what happened to Sofia after she won Europeans 2 years ago. She never got heavy or anything and has very stable coaching.

Please don't call people "heavy". Even when you're saying they're not, it perpetuates unhealthy habits and expectations and disordered eating.

 

[Scott512]

Please don't call people "heavy". Even when you're saying they're not, it perpetuates unhealthy habits and expectations and disordered eating.

Relax not everything is an argument.

I didn't say that word accusing Sofia. I made a point how she wasn't and wondered how she lost her game that took her to the euro title.

 

[Scott512]

This season aliona struggled with delayed rotation and underrotations but her toe picks were cleaner than ever, and she was getting pretty consistent outside edges. With Eteri, aliona had great rotation and stamina but had an unclear lutz and some toepick issues (though to be fair by 19/20 she had already improved a lot). so in no season would i say alyona has the best technique. she also has a leg wrap which doesn’t appear to effect her but it’s still not “textbook” technique. The skater with the best technique is ladies is probably Rika. Liza too, but she does suffer a bit from UR issues. Kseniia Sinitsyna has potential to be on that list too.

I think is alyona can find her form again and be happy back at TT she can become one of the best in the world again. No one has perfect technique but in are TD years hers was good such a beautiful scene. The trick is how is TT gonna come up with great programs for 7 or 8 great lady skaters?

Rika never got to Orser. I wonder if she will at some point.

 

[chasingneverland]

Relax not everything is an argument.

I didn't say that word accusing Sofia. I made a point how she wasn't and wondered how she lost her game that took her to the euro title.

Wasn't an argument.

And I said you're saying they're not but it's a negative implication and connotation. It's an incredibly dangerous mindset in figure skating (and other sports) that has lead to disordered eating, etc. and shouldn't be perpetuated.

And also, in many ways Sofia looks like the exact same as she looked then. The difference is that Russian ladies is deeper. And even when she won Euros, it certainly wasn't expected. At the beginning of the season, it was thought to be Alina, Evgenia, and probably Liza as the frontrunners.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

Whaat? This season (from the little we saw her) Aliona also had unclear edge or even flutz.

Okay, I went back and watched the RCF videos and you're right that she didn't have an outside edge necessarily. It's weird because it looks like it's a flutz if you look at the tilt, but then the boot is kind of curved towards the outside, which created the illusion of an outside edge since it created that signature "flick" movement that skaters with good lutz edges do when they take off. I'd say it's still ! but improved. If I took a protractor and measured it, I feel like it would be technically on an outside, which is improvement I guess.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

I think is alyona can find her form again and be happy back at TT she can become one of the best in the world again. No one has perfect technique but in are TD years hers was good such a beautiful scene. The trick is how is TT gonna come up with great programs for 7 or 8 great lady skaters?

Rika never got to Orser. I wonder if she will at some point.

Not this thread but while I think Rika would do good with Brian, Stephane seems to be a good coach for her too. This event kind of felt like a fluke to me (IMO).

But back on topic, I am really worried for the Tutberidze girls next season. Not because of their tech or whatever, but because of the programs! Again Danny G can be a good choreographer with some genius ideas (Alina's Olympic SP) but with so many programs to do I'm not the most optimistic about it. With how many Olympic contenders are at Eteri's, they will need to make Olympic champion worthy programs for Kami, Anya, Aliona, and even Daria and Maiia! I would be content with them keeping Kami, Daria and Maiia's short programs, though I feel all three need a new free skate. Anya's FS is lovely too, and while I would be okay with them keeping it, I think there is a better program for her that can capture the hearts of audience members in the same style Zhenya did in 2018. I personally want to see Aliona keep her new FS and really work on the transitions because it has soooo much potential but the chance of that happening is almost 0.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

Now that Anna, Liza and Sasha can't compete against each other in the GP, I have a feeling we'll see something similar to what Russia did last year, when they paired together a new junior-senior with a more experienced competitor. I am pretty confident in predicting that Kamila/Liza will be the ones to be paired together in that case, and the others depend on whether or not Daria and Aliona have 3As or quads.

 

[lopsilceci]

Okay, I went back and watched the RCF videos and you're right that she didn't have an outside edge necessarily. It's weird because it looks like it's a flutz if you look at the tilt, but then the boot is kind of curved towards the outside, which created the illusion of an outside edge since it created that signature "flick" movement that skaters with good lutz edges do when they take off. I'd say it's still ! but improved. If I took a protractor and measured it, I feel like it would be technically on an outside, which is improvement I guess.

Haha, I was actually going to delete my post because I didn't want to accidentally start another discussion about lutz edges
I was just surprised that you said that because I didn't think Aliona changed her technique at AoP.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

Haha, I was actually going to delete my post because I didn't want to accidentally start another discussion about lutz edges
I was just surprised that you said that because I didn't think Aliona changed her technique at AoP.

yeah i don’t think aliona’s technique changed much either - most likely due to lack of training time due to covid. i guess it is better than her debut junior lutz edges though so maybe next year we’ll see some consistent outside edges from her!

 

[bouncy]

Now that Anna, Liza and Sasha can't compete against each other in the GP, I have a feeling we'll see something similar to what Russia did last year, when they paired together a new junior-senior with a more experienced competitor. I am pretty confident in predicting that Kamila/Liza will be the ones to be paired together in that case, and the others depend on whether or not Daria and Aliona have 3As or quads.

I would expect this strategy from the federation as well, except for I think Kamila is more likely to be paired up with Aliona, as they tend to 1) secure their favorite junior with "guaranteed" wins by assigning her an easy competitor (Zhenya-Sasha as of 19/20); 2) continue to promote the senior with international reputation with the least favorite junior with no killer jumps (Alina-Aliona as of 19/20). If the fed is going to stick with the observations and results this season, Aliona (so far not in her top forms, with little sign of getting her 3A back) is more likely the one to be paired up with Kamila.

 

[chasingneverland]

Not this thread but while I think Rika would do good with Brian, Stephane seems to be a good coach for her too. This event kind of felt like a fluke to me (IMO).

But back on topic, I am really worried for the Tutberidze girls next season. Not because of their tech or whatever, but because of the programs! Again Danny G can be a good choreographer with some genius ideas (Alina's Olympic SP) but with so many programs to do I'm not the most optimistic about it. With how many Olympic contenders are at Eteri's, they will need to make Olympic champion worthy programs for Kami, Anya, Aliona, and even Daria and Maiia! I would be content with them keeping Kami, Daria and Maiia's short programs, though I feel all three need a new free skate. Anya's FS is lovely too, and while I would be okay with them keeping it, I think there is a better program for her that can capture the hearts of audience members in the same style Zhenya did in 2018. I personally want to see Aliona keep her new FS and really work on the transitions because it has soooo much potential but the chance of that happening is almost 0.

I think they already said they were keeping Kamila's FS. Also, I really really don't think there is any chance of them keeping Aliona's FS especially after Plushy's comments about Daniil's choreography..In fact, I think Aliona is already back to her old programs at least for exhibition reasons..

 

[chasingneverland]

I would expect this strategy from the federation as well, except for I think Kamila is more likely to be paired up with Aliona, as they tend to 1) secure their favorite junior with "guaranteed" wins by assigning her an easy competitor (Zhenya-Sasha as of 19/20); 2) continue to promote the senior with international reputation with the least favorite junior with no killer jumps (Alina-Aliona as of 19/20). If the fed is going to stick with the observations and results this season, Aliona (so far not in her top forms, with little sign of getting her 3A back) is more likely the one to be paired up with Kamila.

Yeah, I think they'll pair Kamila with whichever one of Aliona and Liza they think is less likely (or even someone like Sofia if they give her a spot.) I actually think they hope Aliona makes it back more though. I mean Kamila has already beaten Liza at every competition they've entered..

They'll also try to "protect" Anna (and to some extent Sasha as well) by pairing them with "easier" new seniors and ones with less technical content.