Entries

[Tammi]

^ But it would be easy to modify the age limit rule by saying that anyone who is old enough to skate in ISU championships (16) and has participated in senior ISU events, can't then go back to juniors.

Would that punish the countries that don't have the depth of skaters though?

 

[PolymerBob]

I do, however, think we will get a clue as to which three horses the USFSA is betting on by who they choose to showcase at Skate America.

I'm not sure. I am still in the camp that thinks you don't send your 3 best to the same Grand Prix event. They will only eliminate each other. It's better to spread your 3 best over the 6 events so they don't face each other until the final.

 

[Mathman]

Would that punish the countries that don't have the depth of skaters though?

Yes, I guess it would.

(I was trying to respond to the discussion between Joesitz and Medusa, not specifically to your excellent point in post #39

I'm not sure. I am still in the camp that thinks you don't send your 3 best to the same Grand Prix event. They will only eliminate each other. It's better to spread your 3 best over the 6 events so they don't face each other until the final.

Yes, I can see that point. However, I think that consideration is more important when you actually have several skaters with a legitimate chance at making the finals (you wouldn't want Kristi, Nancy and Tonya knocking each other out, or Michelle, Tara and Nicole Bobek.)

In the present situation, I don't think the American ladies will be eliminated by each other, but rather by all of the international talent that is ahead of them.

The other factor is this. I think the USFSA has a lot of respect for the traditions and history of the sport. Skate America pre-dates the johnny-come-lately Grand Prix by almost 20 years and is a prestigious competition in it's own right, never mind the ISU. Skate America started in 1979 after the collapse of the North American Championships due to lack of mutual trust between the U.S. and Canada over judging. Wikipedia:

The (North American) competition was discontinued when the Canadian federation abruptly cancelled its participation in the 1973 event, which was to have been held in Rochester, New York. The CFSA cited problems with the judging (which tended to favor the skaters of whichever country had a majority of judges on the panel) and the reluctance of top skaters from both countries to participate in an event immediately before the World Figure Skating Championships. In fact, the CFSA was at that time already planning to hold its own international competition, the first Skate Canada International, in the fall of 1973. This event would be open to skaters from all ISU member countries and use international judges. The USFSA established its own international competition, Skate America, in the fall of 1979.

The point of Skate America was to kick off the United States figure skating season with a parade of U.S. champions, with a sprinkling of invited international stars. (The U.S. champion almost always won. Scott Hamilton won the first three, followed by Brian Boitano. Todd Eldredge won five in a row and Michelle Kwan won seven in all. )

I think the USFSA still likes the idea of a Skate America that showcases the best U.S. skaters. This is the only event, except for U.S. Nationals, that attracts major television network coverage. Never mind the Grand Prix Final, not even the World Championship attracts that kind of interest, historically, in the U.S.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I'm not sure. I am still in the camp that thinks you don't send your 3 best to the same Grand Prix event. They will only eliminate each other. It's better to spread your 3 best over the 6 events so they don't face each other until the final.

That's exactly what I was preaching, and worse, they could come out 4,5 and 6th. However, who are the 3 best ladies in the US? For SA, an event where many non American skaters train, there is convenience to skate there. I think the USFS should have a little pow wow with a few knowlegeable officials as to whom they would pick as the 3 for SA. If it were up to me I would suggest, Mirai, Kimmie, and Alissa, and spread Rachael, Ashley,and Caroline around the events. If any of the the three get a medal in SA, place them in an easier event.

Back to Juniors. It's difficult for me to say that someone won Juniors and is now back to defend his win. I don't think Juniors is meant to be that kind of competition. So skaters who already have Junior medal, move on!! And those skaters who have reached the tender at of 17, move on!! The ultimate goal is to win as a Senior, and Juniors is just one of several stepping stones.

 

[Mathman]

If it were up to me I would suggest, Mirai, Kimmie, and Alissa, and spread Rachael, Ashley,and Caroline around the events. If any of the the three get a medal in SA, place them in an easier event.

The problem is that in the coming season the ISU switched around the order of the events. Skate America and Skate Canada are now the last two events instead of the first two.

What the USFSA could do, though, is hold one place in Skate America "to be announced" and see what happens in France, Russia, China and Japan first.

But again, it is up to the other event organizers to choose which American girl they want to invite. I think there is a lot of give and take behind the scenes before the rosters are finalized.

Back to Juniors. It's difficult for me to say that someone won Juniors and is now back to defend his win. I don't think Juniors is meant to be that kind of competition.

I agree.

 

[chuckm]

There's always the hope that Alissa or Rachael will make top 6 at Worlds, which will allow an American lady to be one of the seeds for Skate America. Then the USFS should employ a "lay the bottom layer" strategy the way some of the other hosts do: select one or two skaters who are sure to finish in the bottom 3--such as Tugba Karademir, Yueren Wang, Gwendolin Didier or Gimazetdinova.

 

[Mathman]

^ I don't get it. So an American lady finishes ninth ahead of Karademir and Didier. How does that help?

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I don't get the 'tradition' that is being put forward to use the top skaters at SA as being all that important. Regardless of when the SA is held, the three I suggested are all former and current Gold US Nats medalists, if that is so important. Nagasu, Meissner, Czisny.

The TBA could be announced but do not expect a win from her. Maybe a place. At that late time, some competitors will be going to there own Nats

Skate Canada could have Nagasu and Zhang to face Rochette.
Cup of China could have Czisny and Flatt to face Kim or Mao
TEB could have Meissner and Wagner to face one of the three
Cup of Russia could have Zhang and Wagner to face one of the three
NHK could have Flatt and Hacker to face Mau
Skate Amercia could have Nagasu, Meissner and TBA to face probably Kim.

With all the above where can we expect Meier and Kostner?

 

[Mathman]

Well, I might be all wrong. But the signs I am seeing lead me to believe that the USFSA is thinking like this.

The main thing, in terms of promoting figure skating in the U.S., is to generate buzz going into the Olympics. According to the contract with NBC, we've got two chances to do it, Skate America and U.S. Nationals. A one-line note at the bottom of page 8 of the sports section that someone made the Grand Prix final by getting second in some event in China and third in Russia -- that's not going to do it.

So I wouldn't be surprised if the USFSA feels that they need to use Skate America to get someone's face out there as the great American hope in Vancouver.

The problem is, whose face?

 

[Tonichelle]

The problem is, whose face?

well, considering all of the sightings on other NBC broadcasts I vote for Dorothy Hamill

 

[chuckm]

^ I don't get it. So an American lady finishes ninth ahead of Karademir and Didier. How does that help?[/QUOTE

It helps keeping any American lady from finishing last.

Emily Hughes ought to send Gwendolin Didier a huge bouquet in gratitude for Gwendolin's taking the anchor spot in Emily's place at TEB.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

So I wouldn't be surprised if the USFSA feels that they need to use Skate America to get someone's face out there as the great American hope in Vancouver.

The problem is, whose face?

I think it is more NBC wanting a Face to get the public interested in the Olys.

I think it is the USFS that is looking to 'sell the event' in Lake Placid.

There are six equally talented skaters in one way or another skating in Senior Ladies. What plan of action would you take?

 

[Tonichelle]

There are six equally talented skaters in one way or another skating in Senior Ladies. What plan of action would you take?

Dump the ladies and continue focus on the men and dance events... we're more successful in those events now anyway.

 

[Mathman]

There are six equally talented skaters in one way or another skating in Senior Ladies. What plan of action would you take?

I would close my eyes, grit my teeth, rub my lucky rabbit's foot and go with U.S. Champion Alissa Czisny, best Olympic shot Caroline Zhang, and my personal favorite Laney Diggs for Skate America.

Dump the ladies and continue to focus on the men and dance events... we're more successful in those events now anyway.

Seriously, I think that's worth a shot. The conventional wisdom is that people only care about ladies. But Scott Hamilton and Brian Boitano are just as much household names in the U.S. as Peggy Fleming and Dorothy Hamill.

Ice Dance is a hard sell as a "real sport," but if Kristi and Mark can draw millions of viewers, why not Meryl and Charlie?

 

[flying camel]

I would love to see Laney Diggs at Skate America. But I fear she will be stuck in the junior GP events.

 

[Tonichelle]

Seriously, I think that's worth a shot. The conventional wisdom is that people only care about ladies. But Scott Hamilton and Brian Boitano are just as much household names in the U.S. as Peggy Fleming and Dorothy Hamill.

and in Scott's case his face is just as recognizable... not sure if people could easily figure out who Boitano was (at my church in 2006 a lady thought Paul Wylie, who was speaking, was Boitano... I was all um.. no. but she wouldn't believe me *facepalm* it's like LOOK IN THE BULLETIN if you don't believe Pastor Prevo's introduction! )

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Skate America even in its new date slot, will have a strong Asian team to lessen the Finals chances of Zhang, and others. JMO.

 

[Nirti]

The men's entries list is update and... Kevin Reynolds will replace Andrei Rogozine
Anyone knows why he wasn't on first list?

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

^^^
Great to bring this back to Junior Worlds.

Is Kevin Reynolds a Senior Skater? The competition entries read like a Senior event.

 

[Snowgirl]

All events but the Dance look like Senior B Worlds.