Ladies Free Skate

[demarinis5]

I think the arguments are rapidly coming to an end. I will not try to decide if the judging was fair. Since I am not a judge, I can not determine that. But regardless of regardless, one fact was amply demonstrated...........

............ Caroline is the TOP American lady ...... junior OR senior.

Opposing viewpoints are welcome.

You won't get an argument from me. Watch her gala exhibition performance to Lullaby (now up on IN) simply the best.

 

[Mathman]

............ Caroline is the TOP American lady ...... junior OR senior.

Opposing viewpoints are welcome.

For next year I am not counting out Mirai. :agree:

 

[antmanb]

Well, I was just playing around with the double/triple terminology. Call it hat you like, you get the same number of points for it (1.9).

But now that I think about it, the ISU must have a reason for designating the jump as 3Lz< in the protocols instead of 2Lz.

If it is a 2Lz, why not call it a 2Lz?

My memory (which may be very faulty!) was that it was decided to mark the jump as the intended jump with "<" next to it because it more accurately recorded what was done. If a triple was downgraded to a double then you couldn't tell from the protocol whether it was an intended double or downgraded triple.

Also from a Zayak perspective men who were under-rotating quads needed them marked down as downgraded quads rather than triples otherwise they might get hit with a no marks for a jump or combination including a "third" triple toe, something that I thing generally did happen for at least one year under COP.

Ant

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I've fallen in love with intended jumps. I pesume they are the same as attempted jumps. He should get the base score for a triple which is what he intended despite the fact he only did a double. Yeah.

Figure Skating is such a gracious sport.

 

[Mathman]

Also from a Zayak perspective men who were under-rotating quads needed them marked down as downgraded quads rather than triples otherwise they might get hit with a no marks for a jump or combination including a "third" triple toe, something that I thing generally did happen for at least one year under COP.

Hmm. So a 3Lz< would count as a triple, not a double, for Zayak purposes.

Curiouser and curiouser. I guess we can say that, according to the ISU rules, there is an aura of two-ness to the element itself, yet it casts an umbra of three-ness over rest of the program.

 

[Mathman]

He should get the base score for a triple which is what he intended despite the fact he only did a double. Yeah.

No, he only gets the base score for a double. But it counts as a triple against his Zayak count.

That is the strange thing. (But it kind of makes sense when applied to quads, as Antman explains.)

Figure Skating is such a gracious sport.

In some ways, perhaps, but not when it comes to underrotations on triples. If you miss that quarter turn cut-off you lose most of the base value AND you get a mandatory negative GOE AND you risk a Zayak violation if you try to make up for it later in the progam.

 

[Blades of Passion]

I've fallen in love with intended jumps. I pesume they are the same as attempted jumps. He should get the base score for a triple which is what he intended despite the fact he only did a double. Yeah.

Where was anything like this stated?

 

[yelyoh]

I've fallen in love with intended jumps. I pesume they are the same as attempted jumps. He should get the base score for a triple which is what he intended despite the fact he only did a double. Yeah.

Figure Skating is such a gracious sport.

Actually they are considering giving a skater partial credit for a jump they cite as part of their jump layout and decide to leave out when they actually skate the program.

 

[GiuliaPlum]

Just saw Leonova's LP. Her reaction was priceless! She was so excited she didn't have an ending pose and literally jumped off the ice.

have you got a link?

 

[Lucky Star]

have you got a link?

Look at the page 19, I posted it

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

No, he only gets the base score for a double. But it counts as a triple against his Zayak count.

That is the strange thing. (But it kind of makes sense when applied to quads, as Antman explains.)

Then please explain the words, attempted and intended especially when there is an attempt at a triple but misses the landing by 46 degrees which ensues an UR and all its miseries, but it doesn't get the miseries of an intended take-off but switched edges for the easier take-off of a lesser jump.

Ya gotta believe triple air turns are more difficult from a counter rotation take-off. No?

 

[Mathman]

Then please explain the words, attempted and intended especially when there is an attempt at a triple but misses the landing by 46 degrees which ensues an UR and all its miseries, but it doesn't get the miseries of an intended take-off but switched edges for the easier take-off of a lesser jump.

Ya gotta believe triple air turns are more difficult from a counter rotation take-off. No?

I hope you are not asking me to explain what goes on in Speedy's brain. This whole system seems quite a hodge-podge to me.

That's a good point, though. If you cheat in such a way as to make it easier to rotate the jump, should you get a gold star (relatively speaking) because at least you didn't underrotate?

 

[AwesomeIce]

Seems like Caroline is everyone's favorite wuzrobbed girl this year.

Not mine...

 

[Eurofan]

Not mine...

Yes, it seems like you want to make that clear on every possible thread.

 

[Particle Man]

Caroline is the TOP American lady ...... junior OR senior. Opposing viewpoints are welcome.

We don't have a top lady. All we have are a bunch of girls floating around in a statistical haze, dazzling one minute then on their butt the next. You are saying our top senior lady can't even win junior worlds? If so, we are beyond screwed.

 

[Eurofan]

We don't have a top lady.

I think we do. She just hasn't pulled it all together yet, so we're not sure who it is and some people are freaking out about it.

 

[berrycute]

Yes, it seems like you want to make that clear on every possible thread.

oooooooh you're sassy!

My favorite of the American girls right now is Ashley, although I think Mirai will end up the top lady in a few years time, pound for pound she is the most talented IMO.

 

[antmanb]

I've fallen in love with intended jumps. I pesume they are the same as attempted jumps. He should get the base score for a triple which is what he intended despite the fact he only did a double. Yeah.

Figure Skating is such a gracious sport.

No it doesn't get a base score of a triple if it is under-rotated - have you been so obsessed with the WET that you missed the other outcry du jour - the double penalty for under-rotations?

Do you actually have any suggestions for how to fix the system rather than simply crying foul?

If you do what's your suggestion then for a toe-loop jump that rotates two and half times in the air? What do you do with base mark and what do you do with GOE?

Ant

 

[PolymerBob]

You are saying our top senior lady can't even win junior worlds? If so, we are beyond screwed.

Yes, our top lady can't win Junior Worlds while visibly ill ….. but can top the reigning world champion in the short while healthy.

 

[feraina]

Yes, our top lady can't win Junior Worlds while visibly ill ….. but can top the reigning world champion in the short while healthy.

Twice! (GPF 07, 4CC 09)