Can Takahashi Close The Gap On Patrick Chan?

[pangtongfan]

Bumping this thread up for a couple of reasons, we can discuss did Dai close the gap on Patrick, or maybe it should read did Hanyu close the gap on both Patrick and Dai?

Also isn't there supposed to be a prize for the person who writes the last post in this thread?

Hanyu has already passed Dai. With a fall and lower PCS he beat a clean Dai in the LP. At next years Worlds he will probably place higher. Hanyu is the only possible threat to Chan in Sochi, if he keeps improving Chan might be allowed only 4 falls to still win if Hanyu goes clean.

 

[demarinis5]

Hanyu has already passed Dai. With a fall and lower PCS he beat a clean Dai in the LP. At next years Worlds he will probably place higher. Hanyu is the only possible threat to Chan in Sochi, if he keeps improving Chan might be allowed only 4 falls to still win if Hanyu goes clean.

Hanyu passed everyone in this competition in TES not just Dai.

The slim margin that Hanyu beat Dai is minuscule Hanyu 173.99 Dai 173.94. There is no denying that Hanyu is a talent, but I am not ready to anoint him
the next Olympic Champion just yet. I look forward to seeing how he progresses next season.

 

[pangtongfan]

Hanyu passed everyone in this competition in TES not just Dai.

The slim margin that Hanyu beat Dai is minuscule Hanyu 173.99 Dai 173.94. There is no denying that Hanyu is a talent, but I am not ready to anoint him
the next Olympic Champion just yet. I look forward to seeing how he progresses next season.

Chan is the next Olympic Champion. Everyone sane knows that. Hanyu is now the frontrunner to be the Sochi silver medalist though (or gold in the unlikely event Chan has one of his worst outing evers).

 

[demarinis5]

Everyone sane said the same thing about Michelle Kwan. Just saying that the ice is slippery but not so much under COP.

 

[romanoff81]

Chan will keep improving as well if his new ex is any indication, he will probably add another triple axel next year or a different quad right now for me he is the big favorite for olympic gold but alot of things can happen in two years i am not completely sold on Hanyu yet and i think Dai has peaked.

 

[Bluebonnet]

^^^Well said, romanoff81!:yes:

 

[pangtongfan]

Everyone sane said the same thing about Michelle Kwan. Just saying that the ice is slippery but not so much under COP.

Kwan was never even close to as far ahead of the field (in the judges eyes) as Chan. Nor was Kwan anywhere near as overwhelming a favorite for Olympic Gold as Chan already is for Sochi. In 1998 she was the favorite, but not that big of one. She had lost to Tara Lipinski 3 times in the last 12 months, and Tara was reigning World and GP final Champion. In 2002 she might not have even been the favorite, Irina had won all their meetings that season, and while she hadnt won a Worlds yet she was the reigning 3 time GP final Champion and was always ahead of Kwan after the short program at major events. In the 95-98 and 99-2002 quads leading to the Olympics Kwan had probably lost atleast 10 events in both quads. Chan will probably enter Sochi with only one loss this quad (the fluke loss to Verner where he had the equivalent of 7 falls worth of mistakes).

There is no comparision between the two as far as their position (it just shows how overrated Chan is by the judges that we are saying that, but that is another topic).

Anyway I dont know why you are even disagreeing with me when in the tiny chance anyone beats Chan in Sochi it is Hanyu, and you are the one saying not to build up Hanyu. So who are you proposing beats Chan in Sochi, Abbott or Lysacek, ROTFL!

 

[deedee1]

Chan will keep improving as well if his new ex is any indication, he will probably add another triple axel next year or a different quad right now for me he is the big favorite for olympic gold but alot of things can happen in two years i am not completely sold on Hanyu yet and i think Dai has peaked.

Yes, it's true Patrick is the frontrunner leading up to Sochi. As Patrick being the only multiple (=repeated, is that the word in English?) champion, among the current eligible skaters except Evgeni, no one denies that.

And yes, it's true Patrick will keep improving even further in two years.

So do other skaters. Patrick is not the only one in the world, who want, and thus try to be a better skater each season. They will definately kick their own butt to improve further. After Mens competition was over, a lot of skaters announced they would include 2quads in LP next season to catch up with the champion.

By the way, I loved Patrick's EX program, too. Patrick completely drew me into his performance for the first time. Patrick literally took my breath away. I would like to see that side of Patrick's skating more. As skilled and musical as he is now, he simply does not need the same old warhorse music. I would like to see his competitive programs, one of them at least, to be choreographed by other than Lori next season.

My point is, you do not necessarily have to look down on other skaters in order to praise how great the champion is. I would appreciate if you could show a little bit of respect to other skaters and its fans, or at least leave them alone, please?

I am not a Canadian, but I love Kevin Reynolds by the way. He was just a jumping bean when he first came onto the scene. I can see how hard he has tried to improve to be a better skater each season, in his own way and on his own pace. I appreciate for his efforts and respect him as an athlete who never gives up. I look forward to seeing a new Kevin every season. But how many times di the judges get him buried in PCS? We know he is not the same level of Patrick yet, or he never will be, but why does 'an improving Kevin' have to get the same low PCS season after season? I do not understand at all...(Please do not tell me it's simply becasue of the lack of Skate Canada's politiking to promote Kevin.)

Sorry if I sounded a little harsh on you.
A rainy morning in Tokyo now, might be the reason...Sorry again.

 

[Olympia]

By the way, I loved Patrick's EX program, too. Patrick completely drew me into his performance for the first time. Patrick literally took my breath away. I would like to see that side of Patrick's skating more. As skilled and musical as he is now, he simply does not need the same old warhorse music. I would like to see his competitive programs, one of them at least, to be choreographed by other than Lori next season.

My point is, you do not necessarily have to look down on other skaters in order to praise how great the champion is. I would appreciate if you could show a little bit of respect to other skaters and its fans, or at least leave them alone, please?

I agree. Both of these skaters are amazing, and they probably spur each other on to become better, so if you like one skater, you also need to be grateful to the other one for keeping "your" skater in prime shape.

In years to come, we'll realize how lucky we were to have lived in an era when the top two skaters were so extraordinary. This is a golden age of men's skating.

Aside from the sharper words, the actual analysis you have all been offering has been very enlightening. I confess I don't know how to look at all the aspects of skating, and many of you have called attention to details that sailed right by me when I first saw the programs. It makes me see how good these two guys really are.

 

[ciocio]

Unless something totally unexpected happens, Chan will be OGM in Sochi. Takahashi can't beat him because no mater how great his programs are, he willl never get Patrick's PCS. Maybe skating a clean program with two quads could help him to close the gap, but I doubt it. Hanyu can't challenge Chan either, because he is too young and unpolished. Abbott lacks consistency. Plushenko is old, etc, etc.

 

[gkelly]

Well, Hanyu has two years to become less young (inevitable) and more polished (he'll have to work at it). It wouldn't be unexpected if he should succeed.

Still, a lot could happen for any of these guys in two years.

 

[Bluebonnet]

Deedee, to be fair that was a little over-reacting and harsh on romanoff81's post you responded, even though I agree with you largely. romanoff used the word "as well" in the first sentence because many simply ignored the fact that while other skaters are working hard to improve themselves, Patrick is doing the same.

As of turning more threads into Patrick against Daisuke, you could see that they were all started by a few Takahashi fans, non-stopping and unfair.

 

[deedee1]

Blue, you are right; a little over-reacting on my part...

It is just easy to misread the meaning in a foreign language, especially when I get a little tired, am in a rush and/or have other things in my mind...A lesson learned.
Sorry again, romanoff81, for my harsh expression.

 

[Dragonlady]

In years to come, we'll realize how lucky we were to have lived in an era when the top two skaters were so extraordinary. This is a golden age of men's skating.

Absolutely. It was such a treat to see Dai and Patrick on the same ice at Skate Canada. I get more excited about seeing Dai, because he is my favourite skater, and I get lots of opportunities to see Patrick, albeit fewer than when he was training in Toronto. I don't understand the necessity to tear one down to build up the other.

But as for Patrick's musicality, or lack thereof, I would question just how musical you are if you cannot see the musicality in Patrick's skating. Although I can also recall people saying that Michelle Kwan wasn't musical either.

 

[Bluebonnet]

Deedee, all is well! I often misread posts too. You are still the best!:yes::thumbsup:

Yes, we are lucky to have so many exciting skaters like Chan, Takahashi, Hanyu, Kozuka, Joubert, Abbott, Fernandez, Song, Brezina, ... endless, endless talents at present time and they are all planning to continue. Also, Plushenko - the king of figure skating is coming back.arty:

 

[Violet Bliss]

We are indeed in an era of very exciting Men figure skating and it's just beginning, with so many young phenoms to still join the Senior rank. I really think Patrick set the bar and show how a program could combine quads and intricate choreography and there is no going back. It is just a normal standard now for the young ones.

The competition is exciting. What is the point if an excellent skater just gives up because there is someone seemingly unbeatable just in front of him? What is the fun if someone really is unbeatable and stop striving to improve? The skaters themselves know one another and never underestimate the best ones. Last season, despite Patrick's multiple falls in the first two competitions, all the contenders considered him the one to beat. Patrick, on his part, despite Daisuke's having one of his bad seasons, considered him the main competitor and used him to push himself for the World Championships. These champions are skaters' skaters and earned their respect.

Vive the competition and all the rivalries!

 

[pangtongfan]

The mens event is far and away the most boring and predictable event for years now. Currently it is nothing more than a Chan coronation (or bore-o-nation). Scary thing is it reached an even lower low with Evan Lysacek being crowned as World and Olympic Champion the two years prior to that. Thank goodness the pairs and dance are stronger than ever, and ladies is coming around again after hitting its all time high in Vancouver. I am glad for the mens event, it gives me and my friends a chance to go for meals or catch up on other things at events we attend, before the real skating resumes with the other 3 disciplines. For the glory days of mens skating there are wonderful videos of Boitano, Browning, Petrenko, Kulik, Yagudin, Plushenko, Takahashi (2007-2008 version), Lambiel, Fadeev, Hamilton, Urmanov, Stojko, Orser, Curry, Cranston, Cousins, always easily assessible.

 

[demarinis5]

I definitely don't find the current Men's skating boring at all, I think it is great. Different strokes for different folks.

 

[Becki]

I definitely don't find the current Men's skating boring at all, I think it is great. Different strokes for different folks.

I find it super exciting!! My friends wonder why I am more interested in Men figure skating than the Ladies. There's more than 10 guys I would watch at the World Championships this year, compared to at most 6 from the Ladies.

 

[periperi]

Yeah, I agree, there are so many male skaters that I truly enjoy watching and following right now. I can't be bothered to follow the ladies - only my select few favorites - these days. I'm nowhere near as excited about certain junior ladies coming up next season as some people are, but maybe the higher technical content that we are expecting to see will liven things up.