2015-16 Grand Prix assignments

[MalAssada]

In contrast, yes the Russians have crazy top skaters like Liza, Yulia, Adelina, pogo, evgenia, but who after that is in their second tier (who isn't skating junior?). The only one that comes to mind is leonova.

I would say that right now their crazy top are:
-Elizaveta
-Elena
-Evgenia

Second tier are:
-Yulia
-Adelina
-Pogo

And a still decent, third tier:
-Leonova
-Artemieva

I would gladly see the last tiers in the soon to happen B competitions, but I believe top Russian skaters are going, anyway (I hope at least Yulia and Adelina do), not for points but for experience, so by the end of the season they have six skaters (not counting third tiers!) to choose three from, three that could sweep Worlds in a good day.

 

[aromaticchicken]

I would say that right now their crazy top are:
-Elizaveta
-Elena
-Evgenia

Second tier are:
-Yulia
-Adelina
-Pogo

And a still decent, third tier:
-Leonova
-Artemieva

I would gladly see the last tiers in the soon to happen B competitions, but I believe top Russian skaters are going, anyway (I hope at least Yulia and Adelina do), not for points but for experience, so by the end of the season they have six skaters (not counting third tiers!) to choose three from, three that could sweep Worlds in a good day.

Yeah I guess that's a differing strategy from the US federation, that really doesn't send it's top tier (Polina, Gracie, Ashley, but also on the men's side) to those senior b and instead allocates them as point getters for their lesser known skaters.

I'm just saying people don't quite yet have a reason to complain about GP seeding.... Not when it's based on performance and world standing, and when it's not like we're at the point where the Russians or Americans have maxed out at 18 gp slots or something.

It's a similar scenario in dance as people have mentioned. Yes the US has top teams but doesn't mean we have second tier depth.

I find it similar to people complaining that the Russians only get three spots at worlds. It's like... In my opinion, the only time a country should realistically deserve more is if they continually sweep the podium 1-2-3. I understand if they have many skaters who *could* be podium contenders, but then it's up to their federation to choose their best ones.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

That tiering is pretty correct. I think Alena maybe deserves second tier though, given her silver at NHK and Nebelhorn (where she got a PB of 186 points which is pretty good!) -- I don't think anyone would have thought she could win a GP silver last year, let alone beat Miyahara (the eventual World silver medalist that season).

It's hard to say where Adelina is at this point but she is second-tier in terms of priority (could be 3rd tier skater at this point who knows, but her reputation puts her 2nd tier).

 

[silverfoxes]

If there really are second tier Russian skaters that deserve spots, then the Russian federation should have been sending them to senior B competitions to get points for higher seeding position, in the same way the US federation has done for their second tier skaters like Hannah Miller and Angela Wang.

But they do send them to senior Bs. Artemevia and Leonova both had 2 last season, the same as Miller and Wang.

 

[aromaticchicken]

But they do send them to senior Bs. Artemevia and Leonova both had 2 last season, the same as Miller and Wang.

Great.
Leonova has 2 GPs this year, just like Miller.
Artemevia has 1 GP just like Wang.

So, why are people complaining about Russia not having any more spots to deserving skaters? Something about having more depth but having fewer spots but what other skaters are there to give GP spots to?

 

[Layback11]

It's a similar scenario in dance as people have mentioned. Yes the US has top teams but doesn't mean we have second tier depth.

Not necessarily.

I'd say the first tier was C/B and the Shibs, with them both being in the worlds top 5. Second tier is H/D and H/B. Third tier is C/McM and some junior teams.

By that system, the ladies would be:

NOTE: they're ranked by their "power" within their tiers.

FIRST TIER-top 5 in the 2014-15 season rankings

Gracie
Ashley

SECOND TIER

Polina
Courtney (I put her here because she had the strongest GP showing outside of Gracie and Ashley.)
Karen

THIRD TIER

Mirai
Hannah
Mariah


FOURTH TIER (AKA high-end nonfactors)

Angela
Christina
Ashley (Cain)


Russia's would go, based on last season, like this:

FIRST TIER

Liza
Elena
Evgenia
Yulia

SECOND TIER
Anna
Adelina (from what we saw at the test skates)
Sima (junior)
Alena

THIRD TIER

Maria S. (junior)
Maria A.


So they've got some, and they certainly have the most top skaters. But, on the other hand, the US has a TON of horribly inconsistent 2nd or 3rd tier skaters who could be factors if they got their heads together but aren't.

Now, for more comparison, Japan (the other big factor in ladies):

FIRST TIER

Mao
Satoko

EITHER FIRST OR SECOND, DEPENDING ON THE DAY-BORDERLINE

Rika
Kanako

SECOND TIER

Wakaba (junior)

THIRD TIER

Miyabi Oba
Miyu Nakashio



A lot of these girls-Polina, Anna, Rika, Kanako-could be in either first or second tier, depending on the day. It seems that Russia has the most depth at the top but less in the lower rankings, the US has less at the top but solid backup in the second and third tiers, and Japan has four very good ones, a couple juniors, and then very little in the lower tiers.

 

[aromaticchicken]

Not necessarily.

I'd say the first tier was C/B and the Shibs, with them both being in the worlds top 5. Second tier is H/D and H/B. Third tier is C/McM and some junior teams.

By that system, the ladies would be:

NOTE: they're ranked by their "power" within their tiers.

FIRST TIER-top 5 in the 2014-15 season rankings

Gracie
Ashley

SECOND TIER

Polina
Courtney (I put her here because she had the strongest GP showing outside of Gracie and Ashley.)
Karen

THIRD TIER

Mirai
Hannah
Mariah


FOURTH TIER (AKA high-end nonfactors)

Angela
Christina
Ashley (Cain)


Russia's would go, based on last season, like this:

FIRST TIER

Liza
Elena
Evgenia
Anna (borderline-ranked here for making the GPF)

SECOND TIER

Yulia
Adelina (from what we saw at the test skates)
Sima (junior)
Alena

THIRD TIER

Maria S. (junior)
Maria A.


So they've got some, and they certainly have the most top skaters. But, on the other hand, the US has a TON of horribly inconsistent 2nd or 3rd tier skaters who could be factors if they got their heads together but aren't.

Now, for more comparison, Japan (the other big factor in ladies):

FIRST TIER

Mao
Satoko

EITHER FIRST OR SECOND, DEPENDING ON THE DAY-BORDERLINE

Rika
Kanako

SECOND TIER

Wakaba (junior)

THIRD TIER

Miyabi Oba
Miyu Nakashio



A lot of these girls-Polina, Anna, Rika, Kanako-could be in either first or second tier, depending on the day. It seems that Russia has the most depth at the top but less in the lower rankings, the US has less at the top but solid backup in the second and third tiers, and Japan has four very good ones, a couple juniors, and then very little in the lower tiers.

I agree with your tiering entirely, and it should explain exactly why Russia has fewer ladies Grand Prix allotments this year than the U.S.

By the way... Polina is very borderline Tier 1/2, no? I would think the 4CC deserves a little more cred, at least as much as Anna does after the way they both performed at the end of the season...

 

[hanca]

I agree with your tiering entirely, and it should explain exactly why Russia has fewer ladies Grand Prix allotments this year than the U.S.

By the way... Polina is very borderline Tier 1/2, no? I would think the 4CC deserves a little more cred, at least as much as Anna does after the way they both performed at the end of the season...

Well, unlike Anna, Polina has never managed to qualify to GPF, whereas Anna qualified every season. So I wouldn't compare Anna to Polina.

 

[aromaticchicken]

Well, unlike Anna, Polina has never managed to qualify to GPF, whereas Anna qualified every season. So I wouldn't compare Anna to Polina.

Under that same logic, Yulia should be tier one, since she also qualified for the GPF. And certainly both her and Adelina, for being Olympic gold?

No, I don't think Anna is any higher in favor than Polina, not going into 2015.

 

[hanca]

Under that same logic, Yulia should be tier one, since she also qualified for the GPF. And certainly both her and Adelina, for being Olympic gold?

No, I don't think Anna is any higher in favor than Polina, not going into 2015.

Yes, of course I think that Yulia should be in the top group. I am not sure about Adelina because she hasn't skated for a year, but Yulia despite her difficulties qualified to GPF whereas Polina didn't, so I do believe she should be there. Top six qualify. Being in the group of top six skaters from whole world based on results from Grand Prix events, why on earth should she be in group B?

 

[Snow63]

Sotnikova will skate at Rostelecom cup. At least she said so in her latest interview.

http://www.sport-express.ru/se-velena/reviews/908793/

 

[Tutto]

Sotnikova will skate at Rostelecom cup. At least she said so in her latest interview.

http://www.sport-express.ru/se-velena/reviews/908793/

It is interesting that she says that she chose to participate only in one GP to avoid going to the GPF as she would have then too little time to prepare for the Nationals. First of all I thought she can only get one GP assignment due to the missed last season. Secondly what about other skaters who every year do full GP and Nationals? And lastly isn't rather presumptuous to talk about GPF like she is guaranteed a place there? Otherwise it is a nice interview, good luck to Adelina in the coming season.

 

[lauravvv]

It is interesting that she says that she chose to participate only in one GP to avoid going to the GPF as she would have then too little time to prepare for the Nationals. First of all I thought she can only get one GP assignment due to the missed last season. Secondly what about other skaters who every year do full GP and Nationals? And lastly isn't rather presumptuous to talk about GPF like she is guaranteed getting to the final?

She could have gotten two assignments if she had applied for a change of status as a comeback skater. Apparently she and her coach chose to not do that for the reasons she mentions. Yes, other skaters do full GP (including the Final) and Nationals too, although USA skaters, for instance, don't have their Nationals quite as close to the GPF as Russian and Jpanese skaters (but still close enough). But it's Sotnikova's choice to skip GP in order to be as prepared for Nationals as possible. It's not like other skaters don't have this choice. Also, nothing in Sotnikova's words indicates she thinks she is guaranteed getting into the final. What she is saying is that being successful in both of her GPs (if she were to participate in two) would mean competing in the final. Which is most likely true, if "being successful" in her GPs means winning them, or at least being second. It's not like she is a skater who could miss the podium in a GP if she skated at least close to clean - even in this rich field (as her PCS is bound to be higher than many of her possible rivals, like Radionova, Myahara, Pogorilaya and others). With a close to clean skate, a win is likely if her GP doesn't have Tuktamysheva or Asada in it (which Cup of Russia doesn't have), and if one of them is there, second is very likely. A clean Gold could also beat her, of course. Wagner - perhaps, but less likely. But a win (at CoR, say) and a third place could still very well get Sotnikova in to the final.

 

[aromaticchicken]

Yes, of course I think that Yulia should be in the top group. I am not sure about Adelina because she hasn't skated for a year, but Yulia despite her difficulties qualified to GPF whereas Polina didn't, so I do believe she should be there. Top six qualify. Being in the group of top six skaters from whole world based on results from Grand Prix events, why on earth should she be in group B?

We can agree to disagree. Let's come back to this conversation after a few of the Grand prixs, and we can more definitively say who deserves to be in tier one for this next season.

I'll be surprised if Polina doesn't have the edge though... Especially after I had the chance to see her perform live last month

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

IMO, Sotnikova will be pressed to medal at Rostelecom. A healthy Radionova and Medvedeva will skate consistently, probably. I think Hongo will also be a contender for the bronze, and if Edmunds manages to have a solid GP (which she's yet to show) she could also play spoiler.

The only thing that might save Sotnikova is the inevitable CoR inflation and Olympic champion boost (they might even ignore her flutz). But I don't think she'll be technically up to snuff.

 

[ice coverage]

Added to Skate America:

Ross Miner
Karen Chen
Cannuscio/McManus
Donlan/Bartholomay​

https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/634734514770567169

(Decisions made before Champs Camp :think:, which starts tomorrow.)

 

[sabinfire]

Yay, I get to see Ross Miner!

 

[Tutto]

She could have gotten two assignments if she had applied for a change of status as a comeback skater. Apparently she and her coach chose to not do that for the reasons she mentions. Yes, other skaters do full GP (including the Final) and Nationals too, although USA skaters, for instance, don't have their Nationals quite as close to the GPF as Russian and Jpanese skaters (but still close enough). But it's Sotnikova's choice to skip GP in order to be as prepared for Nationals as possible. It's not like other skaters don't have this choice. Also, nothing in Sotnikova's words indicates she thinks she is guaranteed getting into the final. What she is saying is that being successful in both of her GPs (if she were to participate in two) would mean competing in the final. Which is most likely true, if "being successful" in her GPs means winning them, or at least being second. It's not like she is a skater who could miss the podium in a GP if she skated at least close to clean - even in this rich field (as her PCS is bound to be higher than many of her possible rivals, like Radionova, Myahara, Pogorilaya and others). With a close to clean skate, a win is likely if her GP doesn't have Tuktamysheva or Asada in it (which Cup of Russia doesn't have), and if one of them is there, second is very likely. A clean Gold could also beat her, of course. Wagner - perhaps, but less likely. But a win (at CoR, say) and a third place could still very well get Sotnikova in to the final.

Well no one can say at the moment how Adelina will actually skate after not competing since Sochi, the field is full of strong skaters who haven't missed a season and have no extra pressure to prove the OGM. Maybe it is not Adelina but the Federation is playing it safe, after all the home GP event & Nationals are the easiest starts. Which is as per usual not fair on other Russian girls who will fight for those 3 spots in every way they can, they can not afford to skip GP as getting to GPF though won't guarantee but would bring them just one step closer to the national team. For Adelina though the spot is hers provided she does okay in the Nationals.So we can safely assume that the rest will be fighting for 2 remaining places, regardless of how they do on GP

 

[Mrs. P]

Added to Skate America:

Ross Miner
Karen Chen
Cannuscio/McManus
Donlan/Bartholomay​

https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/634734514770567169

(Decisions made before Champs Camp :think:, which starts tomorrow.)

I'd imagine they were notified well before the public announcement.

Glad that Karen and Ross has two assignments! And that C/M and D/B got one!

 

[ice coverage]

I'd imagine they were notified well before the public announcement. ...

I agree :agree:.

Was just noting that the announcement today means that the theory that Champs Camp monitoring would be a factor in making the Skate America choices is inoperative this year.