2017 Worlds Pairs SP | Page 69 | Golden Skate

2017 Worlds Pairs SP

3T3T

Final Flight
Joined
Jan 1, 2007
Country
Ireland
That was an amazing competition, real high quality, I would be hard pushed to think of a better quality pairs short. However I do think scoring, especially on the GOE, was generous. I wouldn't have 11 of the couples over 70, or the top 16 scoring 62+. I think S/H were marked fairly but the gap to 2nd should be bigger.

S/M get a 2 point SB with a two footed 3ATh and a scrappy 3S from her? That is just crazy marking and she looked disappointed in the K&C? I still think he is their to prop her up and at times he looks awkward compared to her but they are still very much in touch. Also their PCS should not be so close to S/H. I had read that T/M were injured, so was expecting them to pull out but looking at their performance I wouldn't have thought so. Well done to Evgenia for fighting through the pain barrier. The performance wasn't as good as Euro's, I thought it lost a bit towards the end. I hope they can hold it together in the long and stay on the podium.

It would be interesting to see what Y/Z would have got if they skated in one of the later groups. This partnership really works, I like them a lot, it's hard to believe he is the same skater was one half of the Zhangs. His level is a long way above that now. It wouldn't be beyond possible for them to get a spot on the podium. A great skate by Z/E to grab 5th, I think the short really suits them but I think they will drop in the free, I don't think they can get a 135+ to feature. Surprising that the highest rank Canadians are I/M, they skated after Z/E and M/H but in my mind their programme did not compare favourably, it lacked the pizzazz of the Italians and precision of the Russians. I like them but this score was generous.

I think one of the problems for D/R is that when everyone else skates well they weaknesses become much more evident. Once their tech is not at it's best they are vulnerable. They will find it tough to move up, Eric is unlucky that he got injured at the wrong time. For both the Italians, the French and the Americans I would have them all under 70. That was a horrible fall for Vanessa, she did well to land the salchow and throw. I thought the Americans were boring.

I had high hopes for S/K so I was shocked at their performance, Fedor's interview before the champs was extremely positive and optimistic. It was a terrible first minute. I was surprised the twist was called a triple, it was barely a 2.5 twist, followed by the mistakes on the throw and jump. I was worried for the lift but he got through it. The positive was the steps, death spiral and spins all got Lv4. I like the fact that they are doing something different. You can see from their very first movements they are a top quality team. It was relief to see them smiling afterwards, hopefully they bounce back tomorrow.

The North Koreans were fantastic and got a fantastic reaction from the crowd, hard to believe the it was only the 14th best performance. I wonder if they secure Olympic qualification will they actually to go Pyeongchang? Delighted that the Czechs and Aussies made the free. I think my favourite performance was that of the Austrians so I am very disappointed to see them back in 18th place and not making the free. I also liked the Japanese and 2nd Germans.

All in all a very well skated event. Roll on the free, I hope everyone skates wel..
 

QuadThrow

Medalist
Joined
Oct 1, 2014
I was part of the audience this night. The competition was amazing and had everthing you could have wished. I enjoyed it so much.

All in all I think judging was fair. S/H smashed it first. But the miissed 1.50 points with the lift and the spin. The lead could have been higher.

S/M saved everything with their monstrous BV. They were the only pair with level 4 on everything. They changed the twist entry and it worked! The audience really supported S/M. And to be honest. This program is sensational. It was better then ever before.Some judges failed with the GOE at the 3S. But these things are only some tenth of a mark...

T/M did not perform as good as Euros. But with her bad knee this was some work!. Some judges missed the GOE too.

Feel so sad for D/R. I would have loved to watch them fight.

I am very upset for tomorrow. S/H ' s lead should have been a bit higher. But I think it is Ok the way it is. The GOE were super. All three programs are something special. I know there are not many European or German fans here;)
 
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NoNameFace

GS given name - Beatrice
Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2012
okay, calmed down and with hair washed I can now do some reflection..

a truly quality and entertaning competition, so many interesting things seen, so many great experiences shared with skaters by their skating. At the end of the day, for me it's what matters the most - to see that joy despite all mistakes made on ice.

amazing feel of Ekaterina/Harley and Anna/Martin - seeing them, I see a bright and broad perspective of development and growing as a pair. Of course, they do need a lot of polish, gelling in their partnership and presentation work, but they were able to put great performances at their first senior Worlds debut, with stable tech and some good spark overall. General thought is that I'm beyond happy that Australia or Czech Republic can have such talent in their hands in discipline with no much tradition.

over the moon for Forza Italia - both teams did fabulous job and getting into 70 pts SP club :cheer:. I so much appreciate maturity, control, focus and solid feel around both duos, it is visible that hard work and persistence pay off. And really great thing is that both teams have SPs so much suiting them: Della Monica/Guarise that big, drama piece, suiting their athletic style, skated with magnitude and focus and Valentina/Ondrej that jazzy, smooth piece, highlighting their showmanship quality and chemistry. I want to phrase Matteo for being such a great partner,solid, strong and carrying the performance, presenting both of them, these are the real beauties of his skating. And Valentina - like wine, the older, the better she gets - her enthusiasm, character, charisma presented in each program, determination in each performance are a revelation. With her, it doesn't look like a chore, a planned tech content skated to some music - she gives it a personal flavour, a colour to all that common stuff. And her emotions, 'raw', authentic reactions, smile are infectious!

I am glad that some issues did not ruin the beauty and uniqueness of Vanessa and Morgan's masterpiece of SP. Because at the end of the day,this program is a masterpiece for me, with or without that fall. The amount of innovation, true resemblance of sultry vibe of music in their movement, gestures, being sharp, but also seductive - this is really one of a kind program for me, in reception more like an exhibition or some tour gala. There is that distinct edge into their chemistry, that music and choreography, t's a bit dark, but sparkling at the same time. The thing I'm proud of the most and 'built' by it is their ability to re-focus themselves after the fall and not losing this tide/momentum, because they were known from losing their heads after some botching during their programs. For me, this fall was like fall from lost concentration than a fall because lack of preparation. Glad they receive thier scores and in all honesty - there was no chance few months ago to get such marks I think with a fall. Judges really dig them now and it's really good to see.

Big, BIG kudos for Meagan and Eric and Evgenia and Vladimir for not giving up. Maybe there were no top-notch engaging performances (especially from Canadians), maybe there was to much caution, but they stepped up and did their best, considering circumstances. For me personally, they proved their worth and spirits of top competitors by skating at all more than ever - I think that is easy to go out and compete when you're in shape, healthy, with focus zeroed on top prize, but it's more admirable to present such spirit and determination when you're in pain, fighting not with competitors, but with your own body. I salute both Eric and Evgenia for that fight and not giving up on that chance, regardless of the end results :bow:

I'm also glad that I still was able to see that overall quality of movement from Ksenia and Fedor, despite those falls and botching. I saw the struggle, but also the fight and determination. I think that they realize where they are now and from what state they're coming from, it won't be easy to take such experiences, but at the end I think they'll get stronger and more motivated by them, more poised to prove themselves. All the best for FS.

I was really spellbound by seductive, sensual vibe of Liubov and Dylan's skate. Their development is really remarkable for me and they are the best surprise of this very season for me on par with Vanessa/Morgan. There is such amazing understanding between them, despite beig quite opposites on ice - Dylan so masculine, a bit rugged, with powerful frame and Liubov - delicate woman. A very exquisite match, very vivid and distinct in reception for me. And this year's programs are quite complimentary to that 'harmony in opposites' - there is a bit of drama, a lot of emotion, an edge in SP, a romantic feel in FS. And again like with French - judges seem to be all over it if they execute their stuff cleanly. Glad Liubov hit her jumps today and made that picture spectacular!

Now, one of 2 performances of the evening for me - Wenjing and Han. This was the only performance (and it's even too little word now to use for me to describe what I saw) that made me speechless for a while - not oly was there quality, crispness and sharpness of execution, not only was there charisma oozing from every move, but foremost - there was some kind of unique confidence, an aura created around them and between them I did not see watcing any other pair. The thing setting them apart from other teams I feel is that they make a separate event, a feast for eyes from every little transition in-between technical content, adding so much sass and character into it - that transistion between twist and spiral, just poetry in motion, going into sbs jumps - EVERY single musical accord was accentuated by movement...And what makes the performance even more fabulous that they're both so into it - you can learn a lot of things, elements, tricks, work on quality,have great programs, but to incorporate all those elements and make skating your own form of art, expression is just another level shown today by Wenjing and Han. Insane musicality, the feel of music, tempo was breathtaking from the very start when Sui got up from that lean position with fierce,sultry look in her eyes. Another amazing thing is that they seem so effortless, lost into their own bubble while on ice, creating magic with their bodies, so seamlessly, with fluid, attack and control even too good to envy sometimes. It seems like they are back even stronger than before, more 'together' and rejuvenated, creating a league of their own little by little. Their skating is just one big source of different sort of inspiration, so many dimentions in it, so easy on eyes being so controlled and sharp. True masters of skill so hard to accomplish and true artists (so young!) of stuff so limited, restricted by rules.

And while Wenjing/Han's performance really moved my imagination and left me lost for words, Alexa and Chris spoke to my heart and emotions once again after returning at 4CC. The only performance after which I cried - and I cried because of the raw affection, love conveyed by that skate, by their connection, by being with each other, sharing same passion. In time with all sorts of division, it feels just plain great to see and cherish such skate - simple yet so effective. They may not have the toughest technical elements, but they do have polish worked out and an ability to make the most simple things a big thing to watch. It can be cheesy for some, but what I love the most of that program is that every move represents their mutual affection, emotion, there's always a feeling of skating for each other, by each other's side, a feeling of support and caring. After what Alexa's been through, the joy of being o ice together with Chris is so infectious. And that's the prettiest thing of it all, not their looks or costumes - their joy giving joy to other people.
 

4everchan

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Country
Martinique
there are other pairs who didn't skate clean who have much higher scores

and actually, not withdrawing and hoping that the pain is less intruding for the FP is commendable.

The skaters know what's at stake... and often skate with injuries in the big events... they should be praised for their dedication.

Now, I don't care what TAT thinks... that's one person.... Sometimes I agree with her opinions, sometimes I don't but she is not there to decide what pair skating is.

Meagan and Eric are promoting a different style. I am sure TAT loves I/M, who are doing the same old same old romantic pair skating. I can appreciate different styles. Too bad some people cannot.
 

brens78

Medalist
Joined
Jun 15, 2016
Country
Australia
When you look at the results and you see a Q next to Harley and Katia YAY! If they come last, so what, it'll be a great learning experience and nothing will ever take away their junior win :)
 

4everchan

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Country
Martinique
When you look at the results and you see a Q next to Harley and Katia YAY! If they come last, so what, it'll be a great learning experience and nothing will ever take away their junior win :)

well they qualified last but it's far from being last... the field was so strong and deep!!! they did very well!!! very proud of them!
 

Tolstoj

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
there are other pairs who didn't skate clean who have much higher scores

and actually, not withdrawing and hoping that the pain is less intruding for the FP is commendable.

The skaters know what's at stake... and often skate with injuries in the big events... they should be praised for their dedication.

Now, I don't care what TAT thinks... that's one person.... Sometimes I agree with her opinions, sometimes I don't but she is not there to decide what pair skating is.

Meagan and Eric are promoting a different style. I am sure TAT loves I/M, who are doing the same old same old romantic pair skating. I can appreciate different styles. Too bad some people cannot.

First of all TAT is a former pair skater, she works in this sport for more than 50 years and coached many successfull skaters even in pair skating (Ekaterina Gordeeva and Sergei Grinkov the one that immediately comes to mind), she is more qualified than anyone else here to speak about pair skating.

Then the complain here is not about the choice of the music but more on the unison (or lack of), the skating skills, the lines,... and even the quality of those elements.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
I know it's wrong to say this, but D/R's retirement is one that I eagerly look forward to. I feel like I've needed to watch them enough...

I am not sure why there is such hatred towards this team. Not liking their style is one thing but consistently there is hatred. Unlike Moore Towers or Savchenko they didn't dump their partners or end the relationship under precarious facts. It is not like they have been around foreverr as a team and even if they have that doesn't mean they should retire or Savchenko should have and should not have such fans. This is horrible and Canada will lose three spots now too. It is clear he is injured. Poor Canada Seguin and Bilodeau struggling to come back, Duhamel and Radford clearly injured that they modify spins and downgrade jumps. Why do we so welcome Savchenko and Kostner to carry on and not Duhamel and RAdford. Yay for the Americans Knerims. Shocking their teammates didn't make it. I guess China and Canada are reversing. Exciting looks like our predictions are coming true - Sui and Han versus Savchenko and Massot. I am fairly impressed that despite Russia affected by injury and pregnancies etc. They still look fairly respectable.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
good job eric and meagan.... cannot believe they managed to do this well with eric's injury...

same with T/M kudos to our damaged birds
I know people talk about comebacks from injury of Sui and Han, Savchenko and Massot and the Knerims but really to see T/M and D/R even try to skate is amazing.
 

4everchan

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Country
Martinique
First of all TAT is a former pair skater, she works in this sport for more than 50 years and coached many successfull skaters even in pair skating (Ekaterina Gordeeva and Sergei Grinkov the one that immediately comes to mind), she is more qualified than anyone else here to speak about pair skating.

Then the complain here is not about the choice of the music but more on the unison (or lack of), the skating skills, the lines,... and even the quality of those elements.

hehe i know who Tarasova is ;) i have great respect for what she has done/still does...

However, in every field, there are various school of thoughts and people express themselves differently. Today, Meagan and Eric were not at their best. However, when they are, I appreciate their style, and I am not the only one, as they are twice world champions.... Richard Gauthier, their coach, has trained champions as well, for decades... and he has had pairs with different styles. Bringing skaters to reach their own style is what he does... rather than bringing skaters to skate into a tradition. The tradition I am referring to is fabulous and I don't want it gone. However, it's great to have variety. So, that's why I say, sure Tarasova has her own preferences and she is entitled to her opinion but that doesn't mean there is only one way to skate pairs.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
So proud of S/K after all they have gone through. Something tells me after what Alexa went through this year keeping that 2nd spot for the Olympics wasn't going to faze them at all. :bow:

okay let's get real. S/k are a good team the US is not in fear of losing a second spot. Add to that the Canadians (two pairs are injured or coming back) really it would be an upset if the Americans didn't do well.
 

andromache

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 23, 2014
hehe i know who Tarasova is ;) i have great respect for what she has done/still does...

However, in every field, there are various school of thoughts and people express themselves differently. Today, Meagan and Eric were not at their best. However, when they are, I appreciate their style, and I am not the only one, as they are twice world champions.... Richard Gauthier, their coach, has trained champions as well, for decades... and he has had pairs with different styles. Bringing skaters to reach their own style is what he does... rather than bringing skaters to skate into a tradition. The tradition I am referring to is fabulous and I don't want it gone. However, it's great to have variety. So, that's why I say, sure Tarasova has her own preferences and she is entitled to her opinion but that doesn't mean there is only one way to skate pairs.

I love D/R's style (though their programs this season are meh, tbh, but their programs last season were great). I love seeing a platonic, yet passionate, relationship/friendship portrayed so well on the ice. And it feels so real to me. I feel that connection between them, their partnership, in a way I do not feel the actually-romantic connection between Tarasova and Morosov.

That said, watching them skate after T/M, S/K, S/H, S/M, it was more evident to me than ever that the skating skills and overall precision/smoothness and fluidity of movement was lacking. (This is something J/C also need to work on). Granted, I am sure the smoothness/fluidity is somewhat better when Eric is not injured. My criticisms have nothing to do with their style or Meagan's (wonderful!) body type.
 

4everchan

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Country
Martinique
I love D/R's style (though their programs this season are meh, tbh, but their programs last season were great). I love seeing a platonic, yet passionate, relationship/friendship portrayed so well on the ice. And it feels so real to me. I feel that connection between them, their partnership, in a way I do not feel the actually-romantic connection between Tarasova and Morosov.

That said, watching them skate after T/M, S/K, S/H, S/M, it was more evident to me than ever that the skating skills and overall precision/smoothness and fluidity of movement was lacking. (This is something J/C also need to work on). Granted, I am sure the smoothness/fluidity is somewhat better when Eric is not injured. My criticisms have nothing to do with their style or Meagan's (wonderful!) body type.

but that's also what I am saying... it's cheap IMHO to evaluate their skating when Eric is so hindered. I mean, he can't even spin. They lost levels ON EVERYTHING and they normally don't... so of course, their quality is not there today. I believe that it's not fair to now say that they so far below the other top teams and that the few users who have shown relentless hatred towards them are going after them when they are already on the ground. Bullying at its best IMHO
 

bobbob

Medalist
Joined
Feb 7, 2014
but that's also what I am saying... it's cheap IMHO to evaluate their skating when Eric is so hindered. I mean, he can't even spin. They lost levels ON EVERYTHING and they normally don't... so of course, their quality is not there today. I believe that it's not fair to now say that they so far below the other top teams and that the few users who have shown relentless hatred towards them are going after them when they are already on the ground. Bullying at its best IMHO

Totally agree that the quality wasn't up to what they are capable of today, and it was amazing of them to continue fighting...many teams would just WD, but they are fighters and knew what was on the line.

But at the same time...given how everyone agrees that they were not sharp today, their 34.55 PCS was borderline insane...I'm sorry, but their skating today was not even close to as good as Yu/Zhang, or Z/E, or Lubov/Dylan...who all got 32.something PCS. Take Yu and Zhang, who skated with such great flow and precision..and D/R get half a point to a full point higher on skating skills, transitions, performance/execution, composition, and interpretation?? I think it's pretty funny that their PCS was only 2 points lower than Sui/Han. Again that is not their fault and all the love to Eric for fighting through the injury.

So bullying of them as people is unfair but certainly again critiques of their skating (even though they are injured) are okay because they are (commendably) putting themselves out there to be scored just like everyone else.
 

karne

in Emergency Backup Mode
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Country
Australia
I am not sure why there is such hatred towards this team. Not liking their style is one thing but consistently there is hatred.

Because their style is different to "traditional", and therefore that makes them "wrong" and "different". And skaters who skate "different" are to be feared and hated.

Bupkis, of course.
 

TontoK

Hot Tonto
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Country
United-States
okay let's get real. S/k are a good team the US is not in fear of losing a second spot. Add to that the Canadians (two pairs are injured or coming back) really it would be an upset if the Americans didn't do well.

I'm not so sure. They need to finish Top 10, right, to get two spots?

They are in 8th, with some decent teams right on their heels. And, from what I hear, they skated pretty danged well to place even that high.

Considering lingering concern over the comeback from injury, dropping three more places is not impossible.

We've let this discipline flounder for far too long. Why should USA get a second spot if it means a team like the Aussies, for example, get shut out of the Olympics? Or a comparable team from a smaller federation?

I'm a proud American, but I also want fair shakes all around.
 

Skater Boy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 24, 2012
That was an amazing competition, real high quality, I would be hard pushed to think of a better quality pairs short. However I do think scoring, especially on the GOE, was generous. I wouldn't have 11 of the couples over 70, or the top 16 scoring 62+. I think S/H were marked fairly but the gap to 2nd should be bigger.

S/M get a 2 point SB with a two footed 3ATh and a scrappy 3S from her? That is just crazy marking and she looked disappointed in the K&C? I still think he is their to prop her up and at times he looks awkward compared to her but they are still very much in touch. Also their PCS should not be so close to S/H. I had read that T/M were injured, so was expecting them to pull out but looking at their performance I wouldn't have thought so. Well done to Evgenia for fighting through the pain barrier. The performance wasn't as good as Euro's, I thought it lost a bit towards the end. I hope they can hold it together in the long and stay on the podium.

It would be interesting to see what Y/Z would have got if they skated in one of the later groups. This partnership really works, I like them a lot, it's hard to believe he is the same skater was one half of the Zhangs. His level is a long way above that now. It wouldn't be beyond possible for them to get a spot on the podium. A great skate by Z/E to grab 5th, I think the short really suits them but I think they will drop in the free, I don't think they can get a 135+ to feature. Surprising that the highest rank Canadians are I/M, they skated after Z/E and M/H but in my mind their programme did not compare favourably, it lacked the pizzazz of the Italians and precision of the Russians. I like them but this score was generous.

I think one of the problems for D/R is that when everyone else skates well they weaknesses become much more evident. Once their tech is not at it's best they are vulnerable. They will find it tough to move up, Eric is unlucky that he got injured at the wrong time. For both the Italians, the French and the Americans I would have them all under 70. That was a horrible fall for Vanessa, she did well to land the salchow and throw. I thought the Americans were boring.

I had high hopes for S/K so I was shocked at their performance, Fedor's interview before the champs was extremely positive and optimistic. It was a terrible first minute. I was surprised the twist was called a triple, it was barely a 2.5 twist, followed by the mistakes on the throw and jump. I was worried for the lift but he got through it. The positive was the steps, death spiral and spins all got Lv4. I like the fact that they are doing something different. You can see from their very first movements they are a top quality team. It was relief to see them smiling afterwards, hopefully they bounce back tomorrow.

The North Koreans were fantastic and got a fantastic reaction from the crowd, hard to believe the it was only the 14th best performance. I wonder if they secure Olympic qualification will they actually to go Pyeongchang? Delighted that the Czechs and Aussies made the free. I think my favourite performance was that of the Austrians so I am very disappointed to see them back in 18th place and not making the free. I also liked the Japanese and 2nd Germans.

All in all a very well skated event. Roll on the free, I hope everyone skates wel..

I don't understand how anyone can say this is a well skated event. Sure if you are a German or Chinese fan but not on a whole. Not only are the top Russians not competing, injured or coming back, but oh my D and R haters it is obvious D and R are injured. They switched out jumps and they couldn't even do spins - how cna you compare. I do think SK K were awesome.
 
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