2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[flanker]

I have Polish origins with some Russian, just saying.

So what. I have a small wart on my eyelid (well, only till tomorrow, I hope, that's why I think of it). That doesn't mean it's typical for eastern Europeans, as I am definitely not typical eastern European with my sympathy for the russian figure skaters.

 

[el henry]

So what. I have a small wart on my eyelid (well, only till tomorrow, I hope, that's why I think of it). That doesn't mean it's typical for eastern Europeans, as I am definitely not typical eastern European with my sympathy for the russian figure skaters.

Can you please explain what someone telling you their origins has to do with this?

Of course, for those of us who don’t root for countries period, much of this is :yawn:. But the connection to me makes no sense?

 

[Mishaminion]

But she gets the medals only because the judges always neglect her underroratons and gift her with high PCS, she does not deserve.

UR and slowmotion speed are 2 constructive points, not insults.
When you look at FS history, there were always questionable calls in favor of some athletes, so "corruption" and bad scoring is a thing.

She is regularly punished for her URs, at least more recently that is. Still wins medals.
Generally she's considered to be worthy of high PCS, she is a very artistic and beautiful skater. She's not my cup of tea but I won't go around saying she doesn't deserve her PCS.

Some of the athletics who have benefitted from not getting calls are Russian, some are not.

Bad judging does not necessarily mean corrupt judging

 

[Nord Stream 2]

I think if Zagitova and Medvedeva skate clean they could beat Anna. Anna is the weakest of the Russian senior ladies, and not even a costume change can hide those weaknesses. She might be the one left off the World team. Coaches really need to help her improve her overall skating. If she doesn’t hit those quads she might not even be top 5

I agree with you. The weakest... champion of Russia... 4Lz+3Lo... Maybe Chen will show us something new... No, he had to learn.

 

[Mishaminion]

So what. I have a small wart on my eyelid (well, only till tomorrow, I hope, that's why I think of it). That doesn't mean it's typical for eastern Europeans, as I am definitely not typical eastern European with my sympathy for the russian figure skaters.

It only has to do with a number of Eastern Europeans having Russian ancestry. It means nothing to me, but if someone is going to argue an Italian living in America has a bias towards Americans, then isn't it also possible someone who may have Russian ancestry might favour Russians?
The argument works ways

 

[Nord Stream 2]

Can you please explain what someone telling you their origins has to do with this?

Of course, for those of us who don’t root for countries period, much of this is :yawn:. But the connection to me makes no sense?

Misha... Not for long you drank with Sasha Trusova.

 

[flanker]

Can you please explain what someone telling you their origins has to do with this?

Of course, for those of us who don’t root for countries period, much of this is :yawn:. But the connection to me makes no sense?

About the same probability and frequency. It's not typical. Follow the thread of reactions.

 

[Scott512]

The problem with this sport is, if you judge Mijahira or Tenell with the strictness of Sherbakova level, all their jumps are 1 or max 2 rotated.
So if you judge correctly, we get 6 girls from Russia in the FGP and this would be unfair to other countries.

Wow strong words. I have to say there's some truth to what you said.

The domination of one country is against the spirit of international tournaments.
If you get rid of 3 quotes per country like tennis, you will get a TOP10 from Russia every time, when you consider their talent base.
God bless ISU for a "creative" and "selective" judging.

everybody's keep screaming about the spirit of competition and the figure skating community. Funny how the same Spirit of competition does not exist in tennis or golf or hockey or wrestling or women's soccer or women's volleyball.

The Russian ladies are doing great. I only really follow one, but I know enough to know how well they’re doing:agree: so if someone is a fan of Russian Ladies overall, they should be and :hap85:.

Now, when it comes to skating, I am not a fan of countries, or of coaches, so that kind of personal pride doesn’t register with me, but that’s just me. :think: it is certainly not a source of pride to me as an American that Frank Carroll is a great coach. Or that the current World gold and bronze men’s medalists are American. That just doesn’t register. I take pride in individual skaters:yes: so jumping from Point A (don’t like the call) to Point Q (bias) based on fear or jealousy of countries/coaches/whatever will not be persuasive. Again, that’s just me

And although folks have been wuzrobbing for particular skaters based on judge’s nationalities since 1971, (me too, but Toller wuzrobbed) in today’s world, that’s much harder. The summer comp I attend in Philadelphia usually has Natalya Ponomoreva has the tech specialist. She represented Uzbekistan, but she wasn’t born there She coaches at the rink three miles from my house.

I don’t think Natasha has any preconceptions or biases based on her birthplace, her world travels or where she now lives. and I don’t think that about any other judge either.

You only follow one Russina? You are the only one who posts here who is a fan of just one so you're very unique EH.

 

[KRIKIC08]

"artistic skater" = empty stemp you get to explain gifts from judges ?

>>Bad judging does not necessarily mean corrupt judging

You are 100 right with this. Good point, but bad judging=unfair judging.

 

[el henry]

Misha... Not for long you drank with Sasha Trusova.

You quoted me on this post, did you mean to do that?

About the same probability and frequency. It's not typical. Follow the thread of reactions.

I think I understand now seeing @Mishaminion’s post. I agree with what I think is her point: ethnicity is not in and of itself any support for a finding of bias in judging or tech panels, and country of residence is not support either.

As far as fans, all skaters I know have fans from all over the world and from all countries. Good for them :hap85:

 

[Nord Stream 2]

In short.... 1 Anna, 2 Lisa, 3 Sonya, 4 no jumps Satoko. If they want Satoko in the Final - I support. Let her see Italy. I like this country. And Satoko, too, very like.

 

[el henry]

.....

You only follow one Russina? You are the only one who posts here who is a fan of just one so you're very unique EH.

That is true but I think all threads benefit from diverse viewpoints. I enjoy reading the ones here, even if I don’t understand or disagree with them.

 

[Mishaminion]

"artistic skater" = empty stemp you get to explain gifts from judges ?

>>Bad judging does not necessarily mean corrupt judging

You are 100 right with this. Good point, but bad judging=unfair judging.

Is it only unfair if it is Russians getting called and fair if they are not? That would be a very biased opinion to have.

Is the judging only bad if it is against skaters who are someone's personal favourites?

 

[Nord Stream 2]

You quoted me on this post, did you mean to do that?



I think I understand now seeing @Mishaminion’s post. I agree with what I think is her point: ethnicity is not in and of itself any support for a finding of bias in judging or tech panels, and country of residence is not support either.

As far as fans, all skaters I know have fans from all over the world and from all countries. Good for them :hap85:

I don't understand you. I respect you. Name your best skater. Please.....

 

[Seruleane]

You could say that, but that would not be an example of a logical argument.

Here is an example of a logical argument:

All crows are black.
My pet George is a crow.
Therefore George is black.

But ...

(A) The Russian ladies got quite a few adverse calls from technical panels lately.

Therefore, (B) the reason for this is that many people in the ISU want to hold them back.

Statement (B) may be true or it may be false, but it does not follow from (A) by any chain of logical inference. It is just conjecture.

Wow, sorry I didn’t preface my statement with “in my opinion.” As if most statements on Golden Skate are examples of logical statements.

 

[flanker]

It only has to do with a number of Eastern Europeans having Russian ancestry. It means nothing to me, but if someone is going to argue an Italian living in America has a bias towards Americans, then isn't it also possible someone who may have Russian ancestry might favour Russians?
The argument works ways

As for my country, there is not much people of this origin here from many reasons, historical, political, that don't belong here (not that they aren't at all, of course, but it would be very rare). You would follow very strong german influence in DNA, however. As for other countries, if we talk about the number of people having russian ancestry, part of the Poland was part of the Russian empire for more than a century, so you probably can follow stronger influence there, but in genetical level, on on the level of sentiment.

Because even if someone can potentially have russian ancestry, it doesn't make him/her pro-russian. One of our front female politicians has russian ancestry and she is one of the most antirussian politicians in my country.

I truly doubt we would find many pro-russian people in baltic countries and Poland. In my country and Slovakia, Hungary, there it is more complicated (as there are truly many people with extremely high antirussian sentiment and many of those without it), but being prorussian is definitely not something too appreciated officially. It's that a claim that members of the panel of judges or tech panel from eastern Europe could be prorussian (from whatever reason incl. the ancestry) sounds, well, very improbable to say it mildly, for the ears of those who live here.

 

[KRIKIC08]

In my opinion Medvedeva is well overscored with PCS and GOEs, so its not always against Russia, but against some talented athletes who were only 4-5 in their country like Lisa and others.
You cant objective decide, who is "artestic" and who is not. Its a stamp.

 

[Mishaminion]

Fair enough

But I suppose the example i used was only because someone claimed an Italian was American biased just because he lives there

 

[Mishaminion]

In my opinion Medvedeva is well overscored with PCS and GOEs, so its not always against Russia, but against some talented athletes who were only 4-5 in their country like Lisa and others.
You cant objective decide, who is "artestic" and who is not. Its a stamp.

No you are right, artistry is subjective.

I don't agree when some people say Sasha Trusova has no artistry, I think she does, obviously she is more jump focused but has her own style in general and I like it.

A lot of people like Satoko's style, personally she sends me to sleep but I wouldn't say she's not artistic at all though, even if her performances do nothing for me.
She has very polished movements, very solid skating skills and good musicality.

 

[flanker]

Fair enough

But I suppose the example i used was only because someone claimed an Italian was American biased just because he lives there

I don't know that particular person, so I can't say anything about her/him, I would just say that it is different having an ancestry, that's something you don't choose, and choose some country to live in freely. I would expect some sympathy in that case.

But OK, this came too far from the thread topic.