2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[NAOTMAA]

Yes Adelina suffers from back problems (her spins were insane!) and that's the reason why her multiple comeback attempts have failed and she disappeared. I wish more people knew that because I really hate the general view many seem to hold that once she got the OGM she got lazy when it came to competitive skating and cared more about money and shows instead. She didn't just take the OGM and run, she really had no choice

 

[TallyT]

Kamila is very talented, yes. And many predict she will win Olympic gold.

I do wish they wouldn't. Fans keep predicting this years in advance, for every junior phenom or national favourite that comes along, and it is so often almost a jinx on the skater. The vast majority end up overpressured, overwhelmed and underwhelming as they grow older.

 

[SkateSkates]

I think that if a competition junior and senior were to be held right now and things were to be scored fairly, Kamila would emerge the winner. There is no more complete skater. Spins, jumps, "emotion", skating skills.

I’m not sure about this, although she would be up there for sure. Without a 3A and with her “only” having a 4T for now, she is limited to 2 ultra-c elements. Her BV between the 2 programs would be below Aliona with 3 3As and Anna with 3 quads in the LP. Her advantage of spin GOE over Aliona is offset by Aliona’s advantage on jump GOE. Even if she’s able to score 162 in the LP with higher PCS and a Choreo sequence and 80 in the SP, it will be hard to catch up with Aliona who is also capable of 162 with 85 in the SP. The BV of Anna doing 3 high value quads plus 3 lutz-3 loop is hard for Kamila to overcome, even with higher GOEs. Sasha would also have her beat on BV, depending on layout, which would make her hard to beat (if clean) even with higher GOEs and PCS. But, of course, any time a skater is attempting multiple difficult elements in a program, there is risk and we haven’t seen all the top ladies go clean on their big elements in the same event. So it’s hard to say for sure, but I don’t think it’s a sure thing she would win with her current content.

 

[macy]

The little Kamila Valieva. When I noticed her, and I fell in love with her immediately . It was 5 years ago ! Unbeliveable!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKR5cdPAdh0

she was so expressive with her upper body and her spins were divine even back then

i just hope and pray so hard she stays healthy. she is the next one in line to make a huge splash in seniors and she has such a bright future ahead of her.

 

[Shayuki]

The little Kamila Valieva. When I noticed her, and I fell in love with her immediately . It was 5 years ago ! Unbeliveable!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKR5cdPAdh0

For sure, though I had already seen her for the first time in late 2013. Nevertheless, watching this performance right now still shows us that even today's younger age groups have moved quite far ahead. Sometimes you wonder just how far this sport's going to be advancing in the near future. I'm honestly really interested in seeing just how much of an impact Rozanov will have, since my impression's been that he's the reason Eteri's younger girls(pre-junior) become such steady jumpers. Sofia Titova for instance is a very talented skater who could end up reaching entirely new heights as well.

I was new to figure skating in 2018 and could not stand Zhenya’s miming at first. It felt so over the top. It doesn’t bother me as much any more and now I sometimes can appreciate it after greater exposure to the sport.

But to me this is why I prefer Alena’s performance to Anna’s. A lot of Anna’s moves to me feel like posing. They are beautiful poses but there is something slightly exaggerated in the movements that sometimes to me makes it less sophisticated and fluid. Like she’s moving into the next pose. Alena here criticism for not being expressive in her face but I disagree entirely. She communicates with her eyes and very subtle expressions on her face. I mean, watch the end to her free skate. That performance could easily become corny or inappropriately sexual for someone her age but she manages to sell it and keep it just the right mix of subtle flirtations and elegance. Her subtly is what makes it truly artistic and sophisticated. She is absolutely communicating emotions but more subtly with her eyes and body. And she flows, it never feels like posing rather one fluid, graceful performance. Both girls are extremely talented but I think the miming and over expression actually detracts from the performance. Sorry for the rant! Extremely bored these days lol.

Anna of course has been my most-followed skater in recent years. I agree that Anna shows signs of what you're talking about, though to me what prevents Alena from being truly enjoyable to me is the fact that she in my opinion lacks the natural musicality, though she's graceful and very well-coordinated. When it comes to Anna, I think she has the musicality but she indeed hasn't been performing as well lately. It feels like she over-performs or does awkward movements that are quite unnecessary, and isn't as coordinated. In my opinion, she lost some of her performing magic when she got injured in 2017, it's not felt as genuine ever since. For example, this one from late 2016: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u1J1XL9uHI I think she performed much better than anything in the past few years, which is an unfortunate development.

 

[brakes]

For sure, though I had already seen her for the first time in late 2013.

Really? May I ask where? (you're always step ahead!) :agree:

Anna of course has been my most-followed skater in recent years. I agree that Anna shows signs of what you're talking about, though to me what prevents Alena from being truly enjoyable to me is the fact that she in my opinion lacks the natural musicality, though she's graceful and very well-coordinated. When it comes to Anna, I think she has the musicality but she indeed hasn't been performing as well lately. It feels like she over-performs or does awkward movements that are quite unnecessary, and isn't as coordinated. In my opinion, she lost some of her performing magic when she got injured in 2017, it's not felt as genuine ever since. For example, this one from late 2016: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u1J1XL9uHI I think she performed much better than anything in the past few years, which is an unfortunate development.

I agree on everything you say about Alyona and Anna, I find some stretches of "Firebird" too smiley and over the top indeed, but "Perfumer" seems like a good balance of acting and restraint, the choreo has time to breathe, even the amazing dress is perfect mesh of red sensual rose petals and navy blue darkeness of the portrayed story. I think the performance is close to perfect there.
Also, we got to take into account the quads burden, when comparing her 2016 skate with present ones.

 

[flanker]

I’m not sure about this, although she would be up there for sure. Without a 3A and with her “only” having a 4T for now, she is limited to 2 ultra-c elements. Her BV between the 2 programs would be below Aliona with 3 3As and Anna with 3 quads in the LP. Her advantage of spin GOE over Aliona is offset by Aliona’s advantage on jump GOE. Even if she’s able to score 162 in the LP with higher PCS and a Choreo sequence and 80 in the SP, it will be hard to catch up with Aliona who is also capable of 162 with 85 in the SP. The BV of Anna doing 3 high value quads plus 3 lutz-3 loop is hard for Kamila to overcome, even with higher GOEs. Sasha would also have her beat on BV, depending on layout, which would make her hard to beat (if clean) even with higher GOEs and PCS. But, of course, any time a skater is attempting multiple difficult elements in a program, there is risk and we haven’t seen all the top ladies go clean on their big elements in the same event. So it’s hard to say for sure, but I don’t think it’s a sure thing she would win with her current content.

Remember that two seasons ago Anna was beginning the season with one unstable 4Lz and before 2019/2020 there were people who were sending her back to juniors. Before the same season Aliona was only beginning with 3A and the predictions weren't good for her as well. Kamila has one more junior season ahead, but with her 2 4Ts she has already defeated Alysa, who in her two programs did 3 3As and one 4Lz. I'm aware she wasn't clean and that 3A in junior SP is not that big advantage if you put it instead of 3Lz, but still, it is very hard to predict the development of the season. I think that two 4Ts are not Kamila's maximum, though the first thing I wish for her is to stay healthy and perform clean.

 

[Azikin]

In my opinion, she lost some of her performing magic when she got injured in 2017, it's not felt as genuine ever since. For example, this one from late 2016: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u1J1XL9uHI I think she performed much better than anything in the past few years, which is an unfortunate development.

Well I think it's also the program..

 

[Shayuki]

Well I think it's also the program..

I don't think that'd be the case, because to my eyes the way she performed that same program after her injury was in my opinion not nearly on the same level.

Really? May I ask where? (you're always step ahead!) :agree:

Well that was on this forum, there was some Russian competition thread if I recall correctly where some people were specifically tracking her so I was wondering why. At the time, though, I didn't really follow anything below juniors.

 

[SkateSkates]

Remember that two seasons ago Anna was beginning the season with one unstable 4Lz and before 2019/2020 there were people who were sending her back to juniors. Before the same season Aliona was only beginning with 3A and the predictions weren't good for her as well. Kamila has one more junior season ahead, but with her 2 4Ts she has already defeated Alysa, who in her two programs did 3 3As and one 4Lz. I'm aware she wasn't clean and that 3A in junior SP is not that big advantage if you put it instead of 3Lz, but still, it is very hard to predict the development of the season. I think that two 4Ts are not Kamila's maximum, though the first thing I wish for her is to stay healthy and perform clean.

Well yes, of course, in 2 years everything can change! But I was talking about right now with everyone’s current content, in response to another poster. Definitely agree that it’s impossible to predict where these skaters will be at in 2 years, my point is right now I don’t think it’s so clear cut that Kamila would win over everyone else. It’s just my opinion though, of course

 

[starlight97]

With the very likely prospect of one of Eteri's now juniors beating out the current 3A(lynch me) for the Olympic gold I can suddenly understand how Medvedeva fans felt when Alina came "out of nowhere" and beat her. Back then I was thrilled cause I never cared for Evgenia's skating and Alina was stronger that season and that night and she deserved the win.

But now that I'm becoming really engaged with a skater (Alena in my case) and you follow them for several years and really develop affection and then suddenly a little junior that you have not really had time to get to know as a person and therefore have not become infatuated, comes "out of nowhere" and takes it

 

[katymay]

Interview with Anna's parents: https://www.sport-express.ru/figure...yarnosti-figurnogo-kataniya-intervyu-1675705/

Anna's mother is so tiny and young looking. (looks more like a sister than a mother). Very honest and interesting interview.

 

[flanker]

With the very likely prospect of one of Eteri's now juniors beating out the current 3A(lynch me) for the Olympic gold I can suddenly understand how Medvedeva fans felt when Alina came "out of nowhere" and beat her. Back then I was thrilled cause I never cared for Evgenia's skating and Alina was stronger that season and that night and she deserved the win.

But now that I'm becoming really engaged with a skater (Alena in my case) and you follow them for several years and really develop affection and then suddenly a little junior that you have not really had time to get to know as a person and therefore have not become infatuated, comes "out of nowhere" and takes it

People tend to be bothered with particular possibilities years before they can even happen :noshake:

There is simply too much that can (and will) happen. Aliona herself said she lives in the present, of course, she can't bother herself by what might or might not happen a year or two later. It's wise, otherwise it would be hard to even start your day

It can happen than Kamila can overcome her competitors in the olympic season, it can happen than she won't. yes, the qualification will be hard when there are so many strong skaters and it is sad that there always will be someone who will not qualify, but just like it was pointed out by anna's parents in their latest interview, people should not live only with an olympic cycle.

 

[Shayuki]

With the very likely prospect of one of Eteri's now juniors beating out the current 3A(lynch me) for the Olympic gold I can suddenly understand how Medvedeva fans felt when Alina came "out of nowhere" and beat her. Back then I was thrilled cause I never cared for Evgenia's skating and Alina was stronger that season and that night and she deserved the win.

But now that I'm becoming really engaged with a skater (Alena in my case) and you follow them for several years and really develop affection and then suddenly a little junior that you have not really had time to get to know as a person and therefore have not become infatuated, comes "out of nowhere" and takes it

I believe that "very likely prospect" is going a little too far. Especially in case of skaters such as Usacheva or Kromykh, they in my opinion just don't have what it takes. Hence, the only serious possibility would be Kamila Valieva. She might well become the favorite for Olympic gold if everything goes well, but she still has a difficult journey ahead of her.

On the other hand, I'm confident that Valieva will actually have a very positive reception when she enters seniors. She essentially combines the best parts of Anna and Alena and also adds some serious wow factor that just doesn't exist anywhere in seniors at the moment. And that's at 13 years of age, who knows what she'll be like at 15.

 

[Fried]

Maybe the Olympics will be canceled due to a pandemic four weeks before the start and we will have to make do with a promising training video.

 

[starlight97]

People tend to be bothered with particular possibilities years before they can even happen :noshake:

I didn't say that I am or will be bothered by it or that it will be Kamila specifically. I'm just making an imo pretty realistic guess that the current favorites will probably be outscored by some current junior in 2 years that will jump even more quads, spin even better, do even more transitions etc.... we (or rather Eteri shall I say) don't seem to have reached the ceiling yet.

When you thought Yulia was a phenomenon with her insane flexibility and wow factor- here goes Medvedeva clean at every competition, gold at everything. Medvedeva is good? Along came Zagitova with her 3Lz3Lo, winning the Olympics. You thought Zagitova was her greatest product? Take some Sasha with 4 quads. Not enough artistry for you? Might I delight you with Shcherbakova's quads+musicality?
Oh now you're tired of "jumping beans"? I present you Alena with sophistication and throw in a little 3A.
Now you want 4s, flexibility, artistry and everything combined? Well I have that little girl called Kamila.. let's see if we can make her do 3A as well.
... and so it goes

 

[Fried]

I'm just making an imo pretty realistic guess that the current favorites will probably be outscored by some current junior in 2 years that will jump even more quads, spin even better, do even more transitions etc.... we (or rather Eteri shall I say) don't seem to have reached the ceiling yet.

You forgot the most important thing! The STILL more often and STILL higher leg.

 

[Scott512]

With the very likely prospect of one of Eteri's now juniors beating out the current 3A(lynch me) for the Olympic gold I can suddenly understand how Medvedeva fans felt when Alina came "out of nowhere" and beat her. Back then I was thrilled cause I never cared for Evgenia's skating and Alina was stronger that season and that night and she deserved the win.

But now that I'm becoming really engaged with a skater (Alena in my case) and you follow them for several years and really develop affection and then suddenly a little junior that you have not really had time to get to know as a person and therefore have not become infatuated, comes "out of nowhere" and takes it

There's only one Junior and we know who she is who can knock off one of 3A for Olympic gold. KV. No one else is a realistic possibility at this point from EGs group.

 

[Shayuki]

I didn't say that I am or will be bothered by it or that it will be Kamila specifically. I'm just making an imo pretty realistic guess that the current favorites will probably be outscored by some current junior in 2 years that will jump even more quads, spin even better, do even more transitions etc.... we (or rather Eteri shall I say) don't seem to have reached the ceiling yet.

When you thought Yulia was a phenomenon with her insane flexibility and wow factor- here goes Medvedeva clean at every competition, gold at everything. Medvedeva is good? Along came Zagitova with her 3Lz3Lo, winning the Olympics. You thought Zagitova was her greatest product? Take some Sasha with 4 quads. Not enough artistry for you? Might I delight you with Shcherbakova's quads+musicality?
Oh now you're tired of "jumping beans"? I present you Alena with sophistication and throw in a little 3A.
Now you want 4s, flexibility, artistry and everything combined? Well I have that little girl called Kamila.. let's see if we can make her do 3A as well.
... and so it goes

Indeed, but that's progress. I think it's important to have an open mind and not get too attached to anyone in particular.

It's truly stunning just how much the overall level of these skaters keeps improving. Even when skaters such as Lipnitskaya Radionova, Sotskova, even Medvedeva emerged, the basics were visibly all over the place, but right now you can see so much overall quality in these young skaters. For example almost none of the top skaters for the younger novice age groups have awkward jump technique like these, and even the skating's getting better and better. I think it's quite unfortunate how people pretend the only thing the Russian ladies seem to care about is jumps.

 

[JazzUp]

First batch of TeamTut skaters (Anya, Alyona, Kamila, Maya, etc) have arrived in Novogorsk, and are doing the required med tests now.