2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[silveruskate]

I wonder why Daria's components were so low then

What you say as a "revelation" is actually repeated here ad nauseam, despite people like nussnacker who reasonably and politely show the gaps in the logic.

Because Kamila needed to be 2nd.

 

[lariko]

After seeing Samodelkina this year, I can’t wait to see her again. The changes were incredible.

 

[lopsilceci]

I do agree that skaters who smile a lot through all their programs are more likely to be perceived as artistic

 

[kirauza343]

Technology makes mistakes too and can be manipulated easily

Not to mention the algorithms can have unintended biases if the people writing them aren’t actively trying to avoid them

 

[Flying Feijoa]

When it comes to Polina though, overall you can clearly see that her overall skating had regressed a bit after she left Eteri. I don't know if she was just not fit or if it was those natural body changes girls are going through. But she had a terrible season (even worse than Sotskova and that says a lot), lots of falls, URs, popped jumps - it wasn't surprising she got fed up and quit, although it broke my heart. I loved Polina!!

Polina had a back injury in her last season. Not sure when she sustained it (summer 2018 maybe? Or a chronic injury from earlier than that?). Anyway by test skates 2018 her layback was badly affected (no Biellman, could barely catch foot)

 

[Jontor]

It seems to me that the situation is very clear. If you have a well-known coach, then you are forgiven for your shortcomings in technique. The more famous a coach is, the more the shortcomings of his students are forgiven. This also includes the size of GOE and PCS. Who is the most famous coach in the women's singles FS? Eteri Tutberidze. Accordingly, it is most pronounced in her. The athlete leaves the famous coach - he loses the bonus of this coach. Nothing complicated. Why didn't anyone say this directly here? Are you shy?) This is not an attack on Eteri, it is just a summary of the discourse on the last pages here.

I disagree. All we can say is that Eteri is the best coach when it comes to young girls. She has no Tuktamysheva or Leonova in her team.
And why is that? Why are the girls leaving her when they grow up? That is the question we should ask ourselves.

The simple explanation can be that they do worse when they leave just because of that - they are growing up. We all know how difficult it is for women to keep their technique when they get older.

It is a pity that Medvedeva is injured now. It would have been VERY interesting to see how she would have done now when she is back with Eteri. It's the first grown up woman to come back (if we don't count Tursynbaeva).

 

[Jontor]

I agree that it's super annoying that people seem to think that only Russian ladies or more specifically Eteri girls have flutzes and don't get called, because let's be real, everyone has flutzes that don't get called, but still: Zhenya magically getting ! calls when she usually flies by with +3 GOE? Pretty strange isn't it? I think most people are always criticizing Eteri skaters because they get the highest GOEs, but still that doesn't take away the fact that everyone gets a free pass a lot of the time. But then again, Mariah, Eunsoo, Satoko and co aren't getting world records with flawed jumps are they?

And again, I don't understand your argument about 100-200% increase. JUST BECAUSE YOU DO LESS LUTZES DOESN'T MEAN YOU DON'T FLUTZ. The flutz was well known since 2017 and again, why should judges be reliant on how fans know about the flutz instead of well, doing their job and calling out wrong edges when they see it on the ice?

Since 2017? Well, let's take a look at the champion of Flutzes - Nicole Bobek - from 1995.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgfcohSFIOE&t=336s

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

Not everyone, obviously, but particular people here can't be called impartial to the team's "production" in any case and all of what was written here e.g. on Kamila's program was predictable like day and night. That doesn't differ from what could have been read about Anna/Sasha/Aliona's programs last season, Alina's programs season before etc. Attitude forms an opinion with particular people and they will be always supercritical beyond any reasonable limit. Sometimes people should deserve the trust before asking particular questions, that it is honest interest and not just kind of screening or scrutinizing people with other opinion.

I should say there is some sad historical experience with such attitude for us. Like "what's your art about, where did you get this idea, who or what made you to think like that, how do you see XY, what would you tell us about him, what did you want to tell by this".

Since I guess you don't find me worthy of a response, let me build up my ethos here:

I actually really love most Eteri programs. Most of my favorite programs of all time ladies FS are Eteri programs. I loved Kami's SP and FS last season, and I enjoy Dasha and Kami's SP this season a lot too. Storm is one of my favorite exhibitions of all time. Tied in first for my favorite SP of all time is Alina's Black Swan, Alena's Adios Nonino and two others not from Eteri. My favorite programs of this season so far are both of Anna Shcherbakova's programs. And this why I often hate it when people say Daniil get make a good program, because he can. But I don't see it in Bolero yet, and I know it's too early to judge, but still... it just feels so disconnected with the music except for the occasional musical accent here or there. I'm not biased against them at all, I actually really like some programs coming from that camp and I don't mind the programs filled with transitions or "pantomime". I just really can't get the Bolero program, except the opening choreography which is super cool, and the beautiful spirals.

So please, don't write someone off as biased or somehow offensive just because they dislike something. I dislike Bolero, but that doesn't mean I don't love Kami, I disliked Nastya Gubanova's FS last season, but I still really like her as a skater. Even beyond the realm of figure skating, it's like I dislike kiwis, but that doesn't mean I dislike fruit. If I were to ask someone why they liked kiwis, I'm not preparing a bunch of arguments in my head for why people who do like kiwi must be insane or something. I just want to understand a different opinion, and then check if mine is reasonable or based off of biased or some other factor. If the fact that I wrote "I like to stay open-minded" didn't show that I was 100% genuine in wondering and not gearing up battle spears and armor for a war then I'm sorry.

 

[TripleAxelQueens3]

Since 2017? Well, let's take a look at the champion of Flutzes - Nicole Bobek - from 1995.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgfcohSFIOE&t=336s

sorry, Zhenya's flutz was well known since 2017. I'm sure there were ones before.

 

[mdl]

For Kamila, they were desperately trying to put her second and several judges broke the rules in judging, which states:

If in the program there is 1 serious mistake, max score are:
-SS, Transitions, Composition – max score 9.75
-Performance, Interpretation – max score 9.50

If in the program there are serous mistakes, max scores are:
-SS, Transitions, Composition – max score 9.25
-Performance, Interpretation – max score 8.75

Serious mistakes are falls, interruptions and another mistakes, that affect the integrity, continuity, fluidity of the composition and / or its conformity to the music.
This should be applies to an athlete of any level, from very low to an outstanding.

Kamila fell definitely in the second score group, but we see something different:

https://s8.hostingkartinok.com/uploads/images/2020/10/3c22c7af0edb99acfd46a837636c0c25.png

 

[flanker]

Because Kamila needed to be 2nd.

This...

 

[Edwin]

After seeing Samodelkina this year, I can’t wait to see her again. The changes were incredible.

If she has progressed like Akat'yeva, Muravyova, Berestovskaya, Zakharova and many the other kids we have seen skating over the last two stages of Russian Cup in the juniors, Samodelkina will be right up with the very best young juniors. Stable and confident ultra-si does make the difference, and Veronika Zhilina has already shown many triksels and quads, and probably jumped lots more.

 

[yume]

"Sambo 70" vs "Plushenko's Angels"

https://www.instagram.com/p/CGSg-2qo6mS/?igshid=14hvb11ax0rbn

I guess this will be my favorite FS-meme

Eteri and Daniil liked that lol.

 

[Jeanie19]

Even if you love a skater, you don't have to like every program. I don't like orange colored sky or the voiceovers in 911 for Evgenia.
I love Kamila's short program, but in general I don't like Bolero and I don't think it's the best program for her.
This mindset that you are not a fan if you don't love every program, is weird to me.
And I don't like Kiwis either.

 

[lesnar001]

I just disagree about Daria’s lack of wow factor. I think she does have it, it’s just that she doesn’t have the “hype” factor from her team, from her school, from the media and from the federation. If Team Tutberidze starts to treat her and sell her image like that of a star (which she deserves), I bet the “wow factor” will be much more visible.
After test skates, I thought there was no coming back for her, but this weekend she showed she can beat Kamila in artistry/consistency and quality. She’s become for sure one of my favorite juniors, alongside Osokina and Muravyova.
And I dare to say she’s better than Alina and Evgenia at this age. This girl, if well packaged and with support from her team, can be a huge star.

For me, she definitely has the "WOW" factor.
But I think she accomplishes it in a more quiet, almost stealthlike manner.
I love it that I when I watched her for the first time last season, I had no preconceived notions (because of the lack of hype).
And I was immediately drawn in by the many stellar qualities within her skating and performance.
And seeing her this past weekend made me realize my original assessment of her was correct.

Ahd yes I agree that she is better than Alina and Evgenia at this age.
She is obviously not the "technical score leader" they were at the same age.
But that is only because of others doing quads and triple axels.
And I think she is much more "refined" than they were at this point.

 

[eliana]

Eteri and Daniil liked that lol.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CGSg2JUK_hy/

I hope that in a few years things will be the other way around. Plushy works for this

 

[lesnar001]

Daria is probably the most artistic out of Eteri's juniors right now. She actually emotes, not always with her face, but often with her movements and arm gestures. I find it really amazing that her skating can be so delicate and light, and then so dramatic and heavy, all in one program. I honestly find her more impressive than Kamila, performance wise.

I agree 100% and then some. And I do not intend this in anyway as a "slight" towards Kamila.
At the risk of sounding pretentious, I would say that Daria's skating is sublime.

 

[yume]

https://www.instagram.com/p/CGSg2JUK_hy/

I hope that in a few years things will be the other way around. Plushy works for this

Good that he uses his money to build rinks and improve training conditions. Eteri can only train skaters.

 

[dunffvanstorn]

For me, she definitely has the "WOW" factor.
But I think she accomplishes it in a more quiet, almost stealthlike manner.
I love it that I when I watched her for the first time last season, I had no preconceived notions (because of the lack of hype).
And I was immediately drawn in by the many stellar qualities within her skating and performance.
And seeing her this past weekend made me realize my original assessment of her was correct.

Ahd yes I agree that she is better than Alina and Evgenia at this age.
She is obviously not the "technical score leader" they were at the same age.
But that is only because of others doing quads and triple axels.
And I think she is much more "refined" than they were at this point.

Absolutely! Refinement is an excellent word to describe it.

 

[flanker]

I agree 100% and then some. And I do not intend this in anyway as a "slight" towards Kamila.
At the risk of sounding pretentious, I would say that Daria's skating is sublime.

It's definitely not your case, though it would be much better if people would not immediately start with "actually I consider Daria better at XY/more refined etc. than Kamila" in the moment when Kamila had not a perfect skate, it sounds purposive. Those who lose are easy targets.