2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[CrazyKittenLady]

I'm going to sound awfully selfish here, but I am glad that we will have a couple more domestic competitions in Russia this spring. Everyone will be motivated to battle for a place on the worlds team and I for one just can't get enough of watching these amazing skaters. Tbh, if I had to choose between Cup of Russia and Grand Prix every year, I'd go with Cup of Russia, even if the top Russian ladies wouldn't always participate. It is just infinitely more entertaining to watch the likes of Talalaikina, Tarakanova, and Samodurova than some of the snooze fests skating in the GP stages. I hope that they will continue to stream CoR next season as well!

 

[Magill]

The Russian Fed announced BEFORE Russian Nats even started that Russian Nats would NOT determine the World's team and would be merely a "motivational camp" with other competitions being taken into consideration. Or did you miss everyone talking about wanting Anna, Liza, Sasha to withdraw from Rus Nats because it was "motivational"?? They said nothing new here in fact it's EXACTLY what the Fed announced BEFORE the competition event started.

Regarding all other competitions, due to so many withdrawls from the Cup of Russia stages, they announced that that would no longer be the sole requirement for RusNats.

So no, they said all of this BEFORE.

Well, correct me if I am wrong but for all I remember they did announce it just before the competition when everyone was already there and the official practices had already begun. Although technically that's before the competition it was so much last minute that it would be more correct to say it was at the beginning of the competition itself. People arrived there without knowing the rules would change. I think everyone expected the FED would follow the general rule - two spots go to the first and second age eligible winners and the third spot would be up for contest for everyone else, including those absent at the RusNats.

Even last night people here on this very forum were sure both Anna AND Sasha had just secured their Worlds spots.

IMO, the change of RusNats from the "selection" to "motivational" camp was announced so late as otherwise many of those who had come despite their medical condition would not have done it and the RusNats level and meaning would suffer. So, yes, some of them were basically "cheated" into participation. Of course, it would be much more difficult for them to withdraw when already there and they would risk getting punished by RusFed later.

In her interview yesterday night just after FS Sasha was asked why she was there in spite of her injury and not being able to jump any quads apart from the lutzes. She said simply: "Because the selection for Worlds is decided here".

Moreover, the exact way of selection was said to be announced after the RusNats so it really seemed they would decide upon it when knowing how much they like or dislike the final results

 

[chasingneverland]

Aw, that makes me sad. I so want those three as the Olympic team but I realise that the chances for that happening is close to nil.

I was looking forward to watching their rivalry for years to come, every one of them so special in their own way, constantly trading places on the podium, only losing to each other. It could have been a rivalry for the ages! (sort of like the Russian version of the legendary Kim—Asada—Kostner trio) But alas, on comes the new generation... Valieva, Akatieva, Samodelkina. Forgive me for sounding so grim but for me (I know others feel the opposite way and that’s okay) it‘s just a little depressing that, at 15, you’re the best of the best but one to two years later there’s already someone younger and more "special“ than you. I realise it’s been like that for quite some time but after a while, it goes from exciting to tiresome.

It's definitely not new. But it's harder this time because there isn't enough room for all of them even as "backups" to their number 1. Russia only has 3 spots. And because they didn't even get a chance at worlds before they were starting to be beaten. That hasn't been true before. Evgenia won everything twice before she was "overtaken" by Alina, Alina won an OGM before she was "overtaken by Anna, Sasha, and Alena", and it goes on before them. Even Liza who is apparently a grandma is a World champion and has quite the storied career although not the dizzing heights of some of the others. And everyone forgets she, like Evgenia, like Alina, like Alena, like others before them, were the young kids with amazing technical content upsetting the senior skaters. It's just harder now because before there was more room for the veterans to go but not all of them can go now. And they didn't get to go when they all could. And that might happen again this year too. There is no guarantee that world's happens this year and this year they are struggling with injury/sickness so it's not as much of a guarantee like it was last year . And next year Kamila turns senior and she's already beaten all but 1 of them. (Although they themselves did the same to everyone else as juniors.)

 

[melsh]

no matter how much you attack her even on a "moral" level by using a fever (the new favorite sport in Western world this year) Anna Scheherbakova will still be there a year from now ready to repeat her win and possibly win the Olympics. so there's no point in what you are doing. if you are so concerned about health just focus on your favorite skater because pouring out all this acid is bad for your nervous system.

 

[chasingneverland]

I do not get why people are upset over Anna's national title. I mean she can have all the national titles. At the same time she has never won anything important internationally - Alyona is a GPF champion, a JGPF champion and an European champion. Sasha is a two time Junior World champion and a JGPF champion. Anna has zero such titles.

It's important to remember that 1. Aliona and Sasha had 2 international junior years - Anna only had one. 2. I think you can see by their reaction that they would rather be Russian national champion than JGPF or even probably Euro champion. Ask them which they would rather have. I think you might be surprised. 3. Anna didn't just win 1 national title. She won 3 in a row and the first one she won while still a junior internationally. 4. Anna beat Sasha internationally at everything last year.

Don't get me wrong - Aliona and Sasha are incredibly well decorated athletes. It's just wrong to imply that Anna isn't well decorated internationally as well. She is.

But don't let anything get in the way of your anti-Anna sentiment.

 

[Thrashergurl]

no matter how much you attack her even on a "moral" level by using a fever (the new favorite sport in Western world this year) Anna Scheherbakova will still be there a year from now ready to repeat her win and possibly win the Olympics. so there's no point in what you are doing. if you are so concerned about health just focus on your favorite skater because pouring out all this acid is bad for your nervous system.

Um, I think being concerned about a fever is certainly showing concern for Anna AND the other skaters. I understand you’re a huge Anna fan and good for you. But don’t pretend it isn’t irresponsible of the entire federation to allow a girl to compete with a fever. If they’re not following CDC guidelines here, what makes anyone think they will follow proper guidelines if there is a Worlds?
If you don’t understand how serious this could be, then your fandom is taking over your common sense.
I’m glad Anna won. It takes nothing away from her victory, yet it’s still extremely irresponsible to ignore all guidelines because a 16 year old wanted to win a 3rd title.

 

[melsh]

He is the most handsome figure skating coach ever.

pardon me, but this title belongs to Maxim Trankov

 

[Mawwerg]

Even last night people here on this very forum were sure both Anna AND Sasha had just secured their Worlds spots.

I'm still sure.

 

[McBibus]

I know it's probably the "norm" in a lot of sports but with a sport like figure skating, where so many of the top ladies are fifteen or sixteen, I do not want to see it become common for them to push through a competition with a horrible injury or serious symptoms from illnesses. It worked for Anna here, but it won't work for everyone.

the shorter expected top time makes it worst.
If you expect your career to last 12 years you are incline to take a step back looking at the bigger picture.
If you expect it to last 3 years there is no bigger picture: every important competition is life or death, espacially in a minor (thank ISU ) sport like figure skating where you have 3 major events (WC, EU, GPF) + NC and max 2 GP stages to really prove yourself at top level.

 

[Magill]

And they didn't get to go when they all could. And that might happen again this year too. There is no guarantee that world's happens this year and this year they are struggling with injury/sickness so it's not as much of a guarantee like it was last year . And next year Kamila turns senior and she's already beaten all but 1 of them. (Although they themselves did the same to everyone else as juniors.)

Just for the sake of the truth, Kamila has beaten only Sasha only once and when the latter was injured. She herself was beaten both by Sasha AND Anna. She has never beaten Anna and never competed against Alyona (was planned but Alyona withdrew due to COVID).
So her score against 3A is 2:1 For 3A.

 

[Mawwerg]

Regarding COVID I think people for some reasons forget Russian skaters are mostly located in St.Petersburg and Moscow which are HUGE cities. One can catch the virus there anywhere and at any time.

 

[Thrashergurl]

Regarding COVID I think people for some reasons forget Russian skaters are mostly located in St.Petersburg and Moscow which are HUGE cities. One can catch the virus there anywhere and at any time.

This is true anywhere. But there are CDC guidelines that sport teams need to follow. Temperature checks being one and not being allowed to compete with one. Sports are taking place all over the world and athletes are expected to follow these guidelines.

I know too many people that have died from Covid and what Anna did was Wrong. I’m
Very disappointing in her parents, her coaches and the federation at this point.

 

[nussnacker]

This is par for the course that the Russian fed changes the rules midway through, but they have always used the Cup final as a secondary event for team selection especially when the top finishing seniors at Nationals are not the ideal candidates in the Feds mind for worlds.

on my memory they always heavily relied on the results from Nationals for Euros and Worlds.
Cup Final of 18-19 season was rather an exception, than the rule.

It’s just SinKats weren’t here, Aliev/Danielyan weren’t here and Samarin had a poor outing. Considering Russia has 2 spots in men to begin with, and Makar is often dead by the middle of this FS, I doubt they would send him this season. Meaning, they would do anything to avoid that, frankly speaking.
Same with Liza N. Federation wouldn’t send her over Liza T. or Aliona.

I’m more than confident, that SinKats, B/K or Sasha T. won’t have to skate anywhere else, they’ll just go to worlds, if those take place. This further selection is only to decide 3rd spot in ladies and 2nd spot in men. Perhaps they’re also doubting whom to send, P/H vs M/G? But that would be it.

 

[Fried]

Kamila really has some of Sasha and Aliona in her.

What does Kamila have from Sasha in her? That would be interesting.

But I am sure Anna did not want to have KV win Rusnats. She sees KV getting a big push and she saw Sasha get the big push (...)

What the hell are you talking about?

 

[chasingneverland]

Just for the sake of the truth, Kamila has beaten only Sasha only once and when the latter was injured. She herself was beaten both by Sasha AND Anna. She has never beaten Anna and never competed against Alyona (was planned but Alyona withdrew due to COVID).
So her score against 3A is 2:1 For 3A.

That's why she's beaten all but one of them (not Alena because they've never met). Yes, Sasha was injured but Anna's still recovering too. It's not false to say she already has beaten them. It's the same as Alina winning the OGM over an injured Evgenia. Yes, Evgenia was injured - that however doesn't change the outcome. It doesn't change the fact the Kamila (like Alina) before her is capable of winning. Yes, they are obviously capable of beating her two and have. (Just like Evgenia was capable of beating Alina and had). Doesn't change the fact that Kamila has proven capable of beating them which was the only point I was trying to make. Which is this: Anna, Sasha, and Aliona are no longer essentially automatically on the team like they were last year.

 

[Magill]

I'm still sure.

We may believe what we want and may even be right
Yet, officially, no. Sasha did not secure anything and she is expected to go on to compete for the Worlds spot in an unspecified number of subsequent domestic competitions while the rules for the final selection are still undefined.

 

[McBibus]

I can't follow this polemic on Anna allegedly having fever.
It has no place.

If you expect a skater voluntarily renouncing a national title chance because of some line of fever you're in the wrong.
ParentS/coaches could force retirement, but since we talk here about security during a pandemic it's not their work either.
IT was the federation duty to established a rigid protocol with tampons before traveling to the competition and before the competition, and temperature check before entering the common warm up room.

As long as Anna respect whatever requirements the fed imposed she's ok to me and should not be blamed.

 

[chasingneverland]

Well, correct me if I am wrong but for all I remember they did announce it just before the competition when everyone was already there and the official practices had already begun. Although technically that's before the competition it was so much last minute that it would be more correct to say it was at the beginning of the competition itself. People arrived there without knowing the rules would change. I think everyone expected the FED would follow the general rule - two spots go to the first and second age eligible winners and the third spot would be up for contest for everyone else, including those absent at the RusNats.

Even last night people here on this very forum were sure both Anna AND Sasha had just secured their Worlds spots.

IMO, the change of RusNats from the "selection" to "motivational" camp was announced so late as otherwise many of those who had come despite their medical condition would not have done it and the RusNats level and meaning would suffer. So, yes, some of them were basically "cheated" into participation. Of course, it would be much more difficult for them to withdraw when already there and they would risk getting punished by RusFed later.

In her interview yesterday night just after FS Sasha was asked why she was there in spite of her injury and not being able to jump any quads apart from the lutzes. She said simply: "Because the selection for Worlds is decided here".

Moreover, the exact way of selection was said to be announced after the RusNats so it really seemed they would decide upon it when knowing how much they like or dislike the final results

Well considering that Anna was asked repeatedly (during practice skates, before the SP, after the SP, before warm up, after warm for the FS, etc) to withdraw and she didn't because she made the decision a month ago that she would compete and against her coach, doctor, and parent's wishes she did, it clearly wasn't too difficult to withdraw.

After all Russia had already changed the method of qualification to RusNats to not be competition at two Cup of Russia stages due to their gross incompetence because almost none of their national team could fulfill that requirement. Literally their entire world/euros team (and almost all their alternates/B skaters) withdrew from/skated injured/ill from either a Cup of Russia stage, Rostelecom, or Russian Nationals (and in some cases more than one.)

 

[Thrashergurl]

I can't follow this polemic on Anna allegedly having fever.
It has no place.

If you expect a skater voluntarily renouncing a national title chance because of some line of fever you're in the wrong.
ParentS/coaches could force retirement, but since we talk here about security during a pandemic it's not their work either.
IT was the federation duty to established a rigid protocol with tampons before traveling to the competition and before the competition, and temperature check before entering the common warm up room.

As long as Anna respect whatever requirements the fed imposed she's ok to me and should not be blamed.

Nobody says she has to denounce a title.
My posts stated the federation, coaches, parents and athletes should follow CDC guidelines. Why jeopardize your athletes and athletes around the world?

This non compliance is why we are in the predicament we are in to begin with.
Let’s hope the reports are false and they didn’t allow her to skate with a fever.

 

[Magill]

That's why she's beaten all but one of them (not Alena because they've never met). Yes, Sasha was injured but Anna's still recovering too. It's not false to say she already has beaten them. It's the same as Alina winning the OGM over an injured Evgenia. Yes, Evgenia was injured - that however doesn't change the outcome. It doesn't change the fact the Kamila (like Alina) before her is capable of winning. Yes, they are obviously capable of beating her two and have. (Just like Evgenia was capable of beating Alina and had). Doesn't change the fact that Kamila has proven capable of beating them which was the only point I was trying to make. Which is this: Anna, Sasha, and Aliona are no longer essentially automatically on the team like they were last year.

I think then that it would be just more precise to say she's managed to beat one of them (not all but one which is somewhat misleading) .
But essentially I agree with you, of course, that they are not unbeatable any more and their spots for whatever competition are not guaranteed anymore. Still, I'd argue the same goes for Kamila. She might beat them all, but just the same might be beaten by them all (that provided Alyona comes back in her full form, with her 3A at least, which I still hope and wish for).