2021-2022 US Women's Figure Skating

[skatingiscool]

I feel like Amber is Amber's biggest obstacle to getting on the olympic team. Unlike Mariah and Karen, she doesn't have underrotation problems on her triple-triples, and she has the potential for much higher TES with the triple axel. Unfortunately, Amber has been a nervy competitor her whole career, and the jumps that go so well in practice just aren't able to manifest themselves in competition. She's improved in the past year (which is why she's even in the conversation) on her nerves, finally delivering a few clean free skates at US Nationals and Skate America. Now it's all about showing she can do it consistently.

Besides the nerves, Amber skating quality is not at as great as other US top contenders (Bradie, Karen, Mariah, Alysa). Somehow, Amber music choice is also questionable. If you compare Amber's artistry, spins and step sequence side by side with others (Bradie, Karen, Alysa), it's very obvious that Amber is not a complete package. Amber has jumps but figure skating is not "jumping " and "speed skating" competitions. Amber's spin is super SLOOOOWWW. Clean Bradie is much better than Clean Amber. There are so many reasons why Amber has lower PCS than others (Bradie and Karen). Being said, Amber is still having a great shot to be on Olympics team because Bradie is injured.

 

[mrrice]

Besides the nerves, Amber skating quality is not at as great as other US top contenders (Bradie, Karen, Mariah, Alysa). Somehow, Amber music choice is also questionable. If you compare Amber's artistry, spins and step sequence side by side with others (Bradie, Karen, Alysa), it's very obvious that Amber is not a complete package. Amber has jumps but figure skating is not "jumping " and "speed skating" competitions. Amber's spin is super SLOOOOWWW. Clean Bradie is much better than Clean Amber. There are so many reasons why Amber has lower PCS than others (Bradie and Karen). Being said, Amber is still having a great shot to be on Olympics team because Bradie is injured.

In Amber's defense, she DID beat both Mariah and Karen at Nationals last year. The committee went with Karen which turned out to be the right decision. However, with 3 spots, if Amber makes the podium again, it would be criminal to leave her off the team. I am way more worried about Mariah than Amber. Her programs have not been getting a good response and if she loses Amber again at Nationals, I wouldn't put her on the team ahead of Amber.

 

[moonvine]

Besides the nerves, Amber skating quality is not at as great as other US top contenders (Bradie, Karen, Mariah, Alysa). Somehow, Amber music choice is also questionable. If you compare Amber's artistry, spins and step sequence side by side with others (Bradie, Karen, Alysa), it's very obvious that Amber is not a complete package. Amber has jumps but figure skating is not "jumping " and "speed skating" competitions. Amber's spin is super SLOOOOWWW. Clean Bradie is much better than Clean Amber. There are so many reasons why Amber has lower PCS than others (Bradie and Karen). Being said, Amber is still having a great shot to be on Olympics team because Bradie is injured.

Figure skating most certainly is “jumping” competition. Let Amber go land 3-4 clean quads and she will not need any spins, artistry or step sequences. I’ve been complaining about this for years now. I think this used to be true - that a “complete package” was needed, but now anything but jumps is extraneous. Go look at last Worlds medalists with falls and wobbly spins traveling all over the place.

And I’ve seen all 4 of these ladies skate in person and I like Ambers step sequence the best. I like powerful skaters. Karen by far has the most artistry (my opinion) and is discounted a lot in her own country even after finishing 4th in the world.

I don’t know where you’re going with “questionable music choices.” The most questionable music choice I recall Is a lady (not a US lady) who was going to skate to “Strange Fruit.” I can’t recall if she did or not. Personally I cringe at young pair/dance teams who perform to “Hey Big Spender” but it doesn’t seem to bother others. Then we had “My Heart Belongs to Daddy,” but that was a dance team. Can you explain why you view Amber’s music choices as questionable?

 

[moonvine]

In Amber's defense, she DID beat both Mariah and Karen at Nationals last year. The committee went with Karen which turned out to be the right decision. However, with 3 spots, if Amber makes the podium again, it would be criminal to leave her off the team. I am way more worried about Mariah than Amber. Her programs have not been getting a good response and if she loses Amber again at Nationals, I wouldn't put her on the team ahead of Amber.

I’ve barely seen Mariah this season.

 

[beepboop]

In Amber's defense, she DID beat both Mariah and Karen at Nationals last year. The committee went with Karen which turned out to be the right decision. However, with 3 spots, if Amber makes the podium again, it would be criminal to leave her off the team. I am way more worried about Mariah than Amber. Her programs have not been getting a good response and if she loses Amber again at Nationals, I wouldn't put her on the team ahead of Amber.

I wonder how much not having a live audience during COVID helped Amber? Last season was her best ever and I can't help but wonder whether that played a role in calming her nerves.

 

[mrrice]

I wonder how much not having a live audience during COVID helped Amber? Last season was her best ever and I can't help but wonder whether that played a role in calming her nerves.

This is a really good question. This is why I think NHK will be a huge test for Amber. If she wants to make her case, this a golden opportunity for her to do so. I'm sure she knows that she's vulnerable with the US Judges and her best defense, is to skate better than she ever has. It's the Olympics and it's now or never!

 

[skatingiscool]

In Amber's defense, she DID beat both Mariah and Karen at Nationals last year. The committee went with Karen which turned out to be the right decision. However, with 3 spots, if Amber makes the podium again, it would be criminal to leave her off the team. I am way more worried about Mariah than Amber. Her programs have not been getting a good response and if she loses Amber again at Nationals, I wouldn't put her on the team ahead of Amber.

I agree that Mariah doesn't look great this season. Both Mariah and Karen need to earn their spot by making to the "podium" at nats. Unless Amber can prove herself by placing ahead of Alysa at NHK. Otherwise, I think the committee should consider to leave Amber off the team again if Amber wins "bronze" AND Alysa/Bradie place below her at Nats.

 

[readernick]

Agree about Amber's music choices not being the best fit although thankfully they aren't as horrible or objectionable as the ones @moonvine mentioned. I don't know why she uses Misha Ge who is really a third rate choreographer. She could really sell a Shae-Lynn Borne program ala Wakaba. But, having great SS and edges isn't "speed skating" it's the foundation of figure skating. Amber can be messy on spins and StepSeqs ( but agree with @moonvine ..when she's on her StepSeqs are the best) but that is usually completely dependent on how nervous she is.. So the real issue again is her nerves.

Bradie still is top of US women for spinning though... Just so fast and centered! Love her unique spins!

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I think this used to be true - that a “complete package” was needed, but now anything but jumps is extraneous.

Sort of. The judging system has no ceiling on TES, so you can make up for lack of PCS with more difficulty. However, even in the past there was still a base level of technical merit required. After 1991 when all the top women were doing the lutz, a great artist doing only a 3T and 3S would not have been able to beat a skater like Surya Bonay. If skating was still judged under 6.0, I don't think skaters would be getting marks over 5.7 without a 3A because the technical bar is so much higher now.

 

[skatingiscool]

Figure skating most certainly is “jumping” competition. Let Amber go land 3-4 clean quads and she will not need any spins, artistry or step sequences. I’ve been complaining about this for years now. I think this used to be true - that a “complete package” was needed, but now anything but jumps is extraneous. Go look at last Worlds medalists with falls and wobbly spins traveling all over the place.

And I’ve seen all 4 of these ladies skate in person and I like Ambers step sequence the best. I like powerful skaters. Karen by far has the most artistry (my opinion) and is discounted a lot in her own country even after finishing 4th in the world.

I don’t know where you’re going with “questionable music choices.” The most questionable music choice I recall Is a lady (not a US lady) who was going to skate to “Strange Fruit.” I can’t recall if she did or not. Personally I cringe at young pair/dance teams who perform to “Hey Big Spender” but it doesn’t seem to bother others. Then we had “My Heart Belongs to Daddy,” but that was a dance team. Can you explain why you view Amber’s music choices as questionable?

Here is another thing, Amber doesn't has the "jumps" in competitions for so many years. I'm sure Amber does better in practice, but so do other skaters too. Alysa also did so much better in practice than real competitions (According to Jonathan from this and that program).

 

[loopy1217]

Hello all, newbie here so I’m going to ask a dumb question. I don’t get why some people think Bradie is in if she beat Karen in National when Bradie hasn’t participated GPS (and likely CS too) and she already lost to Karen in world 2021.

If Bradie wins National, sure, but that is less likely now after she withdraw the remaining GP and CS. If Bradie with bronze and Karen is 4th, wouldn’t Karen BOW will still be over Bradie? And has Bradie ever win National without participating any competition before in her career? I can’t imagine it to be flawless when the judges hasn’t really seen the programs?

 

[mrrice]

I agree that Mariah doesn't look great this season. Both Mariah and Karen need to earn their spot by making to the "podium" at nats. Unless Amber can prove herself by placing ahead of Alysa at NHK. Otherwise, I think the committee should consider to leave Amber off the team again if Amber wins "bronze" AND Alysa/Bradie place below her at Nats.

This, I can agree with. Alysa and Bradie are both National Champions and Bradie has been to the Olympics. As we know, Bradie's problem is her health. The way Alysa has looked this season, I'd put her on the team, even if she's the Pewter Medalist.

 

[TontoK]

One of the things we have to be cautious about is practice videos, especially those released from the skater's home rink.

We might see a skater land a WOW! combination on their Instagram page, for instance, and those are always fun to see. The problem is that we don't know how consistent that combination might be... is it a 1 in 10 success rate? Or an 8 in 10? We don't know.

I enjoy those videos, because they're fun and they show what the skater might be capable of achieving... or what they're seriously working on... or what they do when they're just having fun...

But I count nothing until it's landed on competition ice and subjected to evaluation.

 

[TontoK]

Hello all, newbie here so I’m going to ask a dumb question. I don’t get why some people think Bradie is in if she beat Karen in National when Bradie hasn’t participated GPS (and likely CS too) and she already lost to Karen in world 2021.

If Bradie wins National, sure, but that is less likely now after she withdraw the remaining GP and CS. If Bradie with bronze and Karen is 4th, wouldn’t Karen BOW will still be over Bradie? And has Bradie ever win National without participating any competition before in her career? I can’t imagine it to be flawless when the judges hasn’t really seen the programs?

Hi! Always good to hear new voices.

I think many people think Bradie has the edge because she's pretty consistently beaten Karen over the years, and has been the consistently highest scoring American woman. Recent Worlds was an exception as you note... but taking into account Bradie's boot issues during that event, it might not matter as much.

I'm in the camp that doesn't care one way or the other. I assume one, or both, will be selected, and it's fine. Nothing to get worked up about either way. The pickings are pretty slim.

 

[katymay]

Besides the nerves, Amber skating quality is not at as great as other US top contenders (Bradie, Karen, Mariah, Alysa). Somehow, Amber music choice is also questionable. If you compare Amber's artistry, spins and step sequence side by side with others (Bradie, Karen, Alysa), it's very obvious that Amber is not a complete package. Amber has jumps but figure skating is not "jumping " and "speed skating" competitions. Amber's spin is super SLOOOOWWW. Clean Bradie is much better than Clean Amber. There are so many reasons why Amber has lower PCS than others (Bradie and Karen). Being said, Amber is still having a great shot to be on Olympics team because Bradie is injured.

Completely disagree. In person Amber is speedy and powerful, edges are outstanding. It may be that she hasn't scored as highly PCS, but IMO her skating skills are just as good as Karen and better than a stiff Bradie. Are her spins as good as Karen or Bradie? No, but that should come out as GOE on the spins. The only issue is Amber needs a higher base value, and that does come out on PCS scores-no risk no reward. Safe programs do not get rewarded.

 

[AlysaLiuStan]

Alysa’s main competition at NHK will be Daria and Young. She already beat Young You this year, by some 30 points at cranberry? She has also beaten Daria before. So in my book, yes, she can win gold.

 

[AlysaLiuStan]

Do you really think a win is likely? I mean it is possible but I wouldn't say likely. In this competition, Alysa will be competing against Kaori PB 228, Young You PB 223, and Daria PB 217. Based on the way these skaters have been scored up to this point, I don't see Alysa as a favorite for gold. She definitely has a chance to medal now!

You conveniently left out how Alysa PB 219 is higher than what all have them have scored this year. None of them have passed that as of yet.

 

[mrrice]

I agree that Mariah doesn't look great this season. Both Mariah and Karen need to earn their spot by making to the "podium" at nats. Unless Amber can prove herself by placing ahead of Alysa at NHK. Otherwise, I think the committee should consider to leave Amber off the team again if Amber wins "bronze" AND Alysa/Bradie place below her at Nats.

Alysa is the ONLY US Lady who deserves a committee Bye, onto the team. None of the US ladies have wowed me except for Alysa, Lindsay and Isabeau. Isabeau is not age eligible but, I think Lindsay has a great shot at making the team.

 

[Mathman]

Hello all, newbie here so I’m going to ask a dumb question. I don’t get why some people think Bradie is in if she beat Karen in National when Bradie hasn’t participated GPS (and likely CS too) and she already lost to Karen in world 2021.

If Bradie wins National, sure, but that is less likely now after she withdraw the remaining GP and CS. If Bradie with bronze and Karen is 4th, wouldn’t Karen BOW will still be over Bradie? And has Bradie ever win National without participating any competition before in her career? I can’t imagine it to be flawless when the judges hasn’t really seen the programs?

I think it could go either way. Karen has competed more this season, but has not really established a case for herself yet (4th at Autumn Classic, 6th at Finlandia and 10th at Skate Canada). Both skaters have their strengths but both have a ceiling in terms of scoring potential.

 

[Sjs5572]

Do you really think a win is likely? I mean it is possible but I wouldn't say likely. In this competition, Alysa will be competing against Kaori PB 228, Young You PB 223, and Daria PB 217. Based on the way these skaters have been scored up to this point, I don't see Alysa as a favorite for gold. She definitely has a chance to medal now!

However, Alysa has the highest PB this season of the four. Alysa: 219. Usacheva: 217. Young: 216. Sakamoto: 215.
It all depends on who brings it next weekend.