A fair way to pick GPF finalists?

[blancanieves]

And well, for me, if they take just the SP scores for this event only, its unfair to the TEB skaters, and to everybody else in the GP. They then should, instead, make the senior GPF an exibition only event this year and donate prize money to charity or whatever like that.

I like this idea a lot. I'd written elsewhere that with TEB free program scores missing, no alternative GPF-qualifying process could be truly fair to all skaters. Instead of canceling the final, turning it into a non-competitive charity event would avoid slighting the fans already scheduled to attend, as well as the skaters that didn't qualify due to circumstances resulting from the TEB cancellation.

 

[HanDomi]

Turning competition to exhibition event...

Sorry but, this is wrong.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

Turning competition to exhibition event...

Sorry but, this is wrong.

It won't happen. GPF is a relatively important event; many countries use the results when considering international assignments and it factors in to world rankings.

 

[Lys]

I like this idea a lot. I'd written elsewhere that with TEB free program scores missing, no alternative GPF-qualifying process could be truly fair to all skaters. Instead of canceling the final, turning it into a non-competitive charity event would avoid slighting the fans already scheduled to attend, as well as the skaters that didn't qualify due to circumstances resulting from the TEB cancellation.

Who would be invited to the exhibition? Based on which criteria? Who would cover the costs? Would be mandatory or not? What gain would the skaters have?
Not to mention that not all fans would be okay to see an exhibition instead of a competition (nor, I think, all media and sponsors).

I think that GPF should go ahead, the main issues are a) standings and b) number of the skaters in the final field.
My opinion is that, since there's no way to have a perfect solution regarding TEB Event, the best thing would be pick a way to determinate the standings (sp only for TEB, best sp+best fp scored during all GP events for all, whatever) and mitigate the "unfairness" of that method by having a 8 skaters/pairs final. Of course it's not ideal, but I think adding 12 skaters total won't make sky-rocket the costs for isu/spanish federation and logistic wise (practice/training time) a solution can be found.
That said, if isu will decide to go ahead with sp scores alone for TEB (maybe changing something on the Tiebreak rule), it will still better than having no TEB results counted or not to run senior finals, imo.

 

[TheGrandSophy]

Whoa, hold on. You just said the ISU should use the rules in place from the beginning of the season, not go around changing rules because of the TEB cancellation -- now you're saying there's no rule in place to handle this, so they should make one on the spot to count only SP scores in final standings?

Seems the only way to handle this without changing rules would be to hold the event to completion in some capacity, or disqualify the event entirely due to the forced cancellation.

So, you'd rather all skaters at TEB not be able to go to the GPF rather than some?

 

[Layback11]

Turning competition to exhibition event...

Sorry but, this is wrong.

It won't happen. GPF is a relatively important event; many countries use the results when considering international assignments and it factors in to world rankings.

Yeah...GPF needs to stay. It's like a little worlds preview!

 

[el henry]

Is there an entries list for Golden Spin?

What Tulosai said, that we know some US entries.

And I am hoping against hope that Canada assigns Orford/Hill.....

 

[tulosai]

What Tulosai said, that we know some US entries.

And I am hoping against hope that Canada assigns Orford/Hill.....

And for me that Russia will assign Tiffany Z and Jonathan G...

 

[Mathman]

On the NBC TV telecast just now the network announcer said that it was likely that the ISU would just go with short program placements. I don't remember the exact words, but he gave the impression that he had some communication from the ISU that this is what they are looking at.

On a lighter note, when they announced the commentating team of Johnny Weir, Tara Lipinski and Tanith White, I was like, who? Tanith White…who? Tanisth White…Oh!!!!!

 

[Pamigena]

Seems the only way to handle this without changing rules would be to hold the event to completion in some capacity, or disqualify the event entirely due to the forced cancellation.

I actually think that both scenarios are something they might take into account. Just spitballing here.....
If the current rules say "you complete 2 programs or you're out", then they technically have a basis to disqualify the whole event. There have been all kinds of incidents where skaters were not able to complete the competition and had to withdraw after the SP. Is that always fair? No, certainly not. But **** happens, and those skaters also didn't get any bonus points for at least skating their SP.
So I guess they would basically see 4 options:
- repeat the whole event. Given the amount of money this would take, does anybody really expect this to happen?
- cancel the whole GP series because out of 6 qualifying events, one got messed up. I'm sure it will take them at least a whole nanosecond to decide against this
- give all TEB skaters 0 points since the competition didn't finish
- make an exception and give them GP points based on their SP scores

Again: not fair at all. But looking at the current rules I guess this is how it will play out

 

[shyne]

The more I read through this thread full of convoluted, complicated and unfair ideas about how to pick the finalist, the more I feel that by far the best solution is to cancel the Golden Spin of Zagreb event as it would have taken place and re-work it as a TEB free-skate make-up event. The venue is already booked. The only change that would need to take place is to allow the TEB participants to take the place of whichever skaters would have competed at The Golden Spin of Zagreb.

This is so unfair to the skaters at Golden Spin of Zagreb. They trained hard for this event, why should they have their events cancelled to make room for the skaters at GP? Yes, they are not as good as the skaters at TEB, but this event is as important to them as TEB is to skaters at TEB.
Many need a good score there to qualify or have a better draw for the World 2016, why should their chance be ruined?

 

[ice coverage]

On the NBC TV telecast just now the network announcer said that it was likely that the ISU would just go with short program placements. I don't remember the exact words, but he gave the impression that he had some communication from the ISU that this is what they are looking at. ...

What Jimmy Roberts of NBC said seemed to be nothing new, IMO.

Same thing that Peter Krick of the ISU had said yesterday at the time of the announcement re the cancellation of TEB : that he would propose to the ISU that the SP/SD results be used, and that he believes that his proposal will be accepted.

 

[Anni234]

I think using the SP results would be okay. And extending the GPF entries. But let's see what happens.

 

[lauravvv]

Instead of canceling the final, turning it into a non-competitive charity event would avoid slighting the fans already scheduled to attend, as well as the skaters that didn't qualify due to circumstances resulting from the TEB cancellation.

Not to mention that not all fans would be okay to see an exhibition instead of a competition (nor, I think, all media and sponsors).

Yes, I am going there to see a competition (first competition of such caliber in my life), not a gala. I don't even have tickets for the gala session. I sometimes watch competition galas on TV, other times I just watch videos of separate skaters whom I am interested in, as I find much of those galas quite boring compared to some shows where professional skaters are invited who do special exhibition programs and where also competitive skaters tend to perform better for some reason (or maybe it's the atmosphere at some of those shows, as I have liked many programs at All That Skate much better than at competition galas). And even to an exhibition show I would go only if Stephane Lambiel was skating in it (I traveled to Stockholm to see Art on Ice first of all because of Stephane). So no, I would not save all year long to attend a gala show only with competitive skaters - in Barcelona in winter at that. I would just rather go to Barcelona in summer or autumn (when it's warm but not too hot there). The only reason why I would probably still go to Barcelona and attend the gala if the competitions were cancelled could be because I already bought plane tickets that can't be given back, but I could still decide to give my competition tickets back (because they would definitely have to offer people such an option if the competition was cancelled and just a gala was held instead), stay at home, and spend the money on something more useful/important.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

As long as Patrick, Liza, and maybe Max make it I would be happy (and whatever pairs/dance teams were on the bubble). If that means expanding the field of the GPF then they should.

 

[sabinfire]

So, you'd rather all skaters at TEB not be able to go to the GPF rather than some?

Well, just so my comment isn't read out of context, I was replying directly to a poster who asked:

why would the ISU go around and change a bunch of rules after TEB had to be canceled? I am commenting on the principle that rules are there and in place before the season... changing them midway is unfair to everybody...

So, I was trying to think of scenarios that wouldn't involve changing or modifying the existing rules, due to the TEB cancellation. Those were the only options that came to my mind, but if you have other ideas that would fall within the existing ISU rules, I'd love to hear them.

 

[4everchan]

ermmmm…. accepting SP as the final result is a compromise that involves way less 'modifications" to the rules… anything else is open to much interpretation and requires a lot of planning. I agree with TGS here… why is there a need to penalize everyone who skated at TEB… they have been through enough already… a bit humanity goes a long way

 

[qwerty]

I believe that given the extraordinary circumstances surrounding TEB and its cancellation, the ISU rules should be bent/interpreted/redefined to allow the SP results to count as the final results for GPF qualification. I also think if the major players (Patrick, Elizaveta, Max, etc.) had done well enough in the SP to qualify the general consternation would be considerably less, perhaps nonexistent.

It's a tough break for the few who lost their shot at the GPF, but in the grand scheme of things, or even just the season as a whole, the GPF '15 won't be the pinnacle of skatedom.

Holding a whole new event, or tabulating fantasy scores is really silly, in my view. Ignoring the SP and giving everyone at TEB 0pts is unduly harsh.

 

[HanDomi]

ermmmm…. accepting SP as the final result is a compromise that involves way less 'modifications" to the rules… anything else is open to much interpretation and requires a lot of planning. I agree with TGS here… why is there a need to penalize everyone who skated at TEB… they have been through enough already… a bit humanity goes a long way

taking SP as final is the only reasonable and acceptable, because everyone had equal chance , equal judging. , it should end with it. Skaters were there, they skated program. It's only one good way.

 

[TheGrandSophy]

Well, just so my comment isn't read out of context, I was replying directly to a poster who asked:



So, I was trying to think of scenarios that wouldn't involve changing or modifying the existing rules, due to the TEB cancellation. Those were the only options that came to my mind, but if you have other ideas that would fall within the existing ISU rules, I'd love to hear them.

Haven't got a clue what is in the ISU rule book about this if anything! okay, I wasn't sure whether you thought that was best or what. That's why I asked.