Abbott being ripped and torn to pieces by U.S. Media

[Figure 8's]

I am sure this won't happen; if it does the world is doomed! It's all over.

It happened to Russia. Now all they have is one old skater.

 

[Mrs. P]

There are many good points being made by all sides. If I cut any slack to any skater at the Olympics, it would probably be to the kid with the ponytail (who has always exceeded expectations this year and not needed it). Here, I have no expectations of his placement but, of all the skaters, he is one of four that I am most interested in seeing skate (the other three being Chan, Hanyu and Plushenko) because he has something that transcends the score. Even his free skate (the one that he supposedly tanked) at Skate America showed that. (For me, only Hanyu has the same kind of presence outside of the score as does Brown.) I put Brown in really great company, but for him (and U.S. skating) his placement here matters not so much as his presence and the experience he will gather from it.

But more than that:

What happened here in the short with Jeremy, and it only confirms what pretty well most of us believed before about Abbott's ability to compete internationally, is that the new kids (Aaron, Farris and Brown) are stepping into a vacuum. Basically, the bag is empty. What you write Tonto, ie "the time for the future is now" is bang on, because without these upcoming kids (all three of them are great competitors), there is no present even. Abbott can't say he wasn't give the chance. He was, time and time again, and he blew it. Let the kids run with it. It won't only be better for results in the long run, but actually the short run as well.

Wow, so eloquent phaeljones!

When you think about it the lack of the "present" is exactly why the future is coming at a extremely fast pace. It's why Max, a virtual unknown last season, jumped from 8th one year to win it all last year. And obviously it's why Jason, this year, jumped from 8th a year ago to snag the silver medal and an Olympic spot this year.

However, I say let's not get too eager for the future and look with cautious optimism as we watch them in present. If it sounds like I've been downplaying Jason all season long, I have been. Not because I don't want him to do well, but rather because we've seen other talented skaters crash and burn. When we saw Jeremy Abbott win the Grand Prix Final in the 2008-2009 season, did we imagine then that he would basically be so inconsistent on the international stage in the years to come?

So with Jason (and really any of our young skaters), I've been careful to appreciate his performance this season for what it is, whether it's experience, a hard-lesson learned or a small victory to build on in the future. My hope is that all those experiences -- including the one he has in Sochi -- will all be part of even greater things to come.

But I agree, it's a lot easier not to worry about results and such when you simply just enjoy the performance.

 

[ImaginaryPogue]

Oh no!! Didn't you hear??!!? He said this was "a positive step". This was just the warm up show for Jeremy. He's saving his big stuff til his "important" event, because we all know that he has a better chance to medal in men's singles than he does the Team Event. /sarcasm dripping

Look, I agree the criticism is harsh. But every article that's ripping him is also including his INCREDIBLY self-delusional statement of "it was a positive step". You know, like painting the ice with your butt is somehow positive. If he hadn't of said what he said after, it wouldn't be QUITE as bad. I mean, heck, I even resgistered instead of continued lurking, because I was so ticked at his statement afterward.

On a semi-related note, I think they really screwed up the placement of this event. It should be AFTER all the singles have been completed. It would be GREAT. It would be a chance for REDEMPTION for some, and a chance for the audience to root for people who previously failed. What's happening now is many "A" skaters (V/T, Chan, etc) are not doing the LP because they don't want to be worn out for their singles.

Put it at the end, knock out the Gala, and/or maybe overlap two events to save time. there's always a "dead" day inbetween SP and LP. Do something like Saturday: Pairs Short, Sunday Men's Short, Monday Pair's LP, Tuesday Men's LP. That would get everything done in 4 days rather than 6 days. Everything else you could keep as is. Move the Team Event to the end, and everyone would skate.

No, they really wouldn't. They'd be all spent having gone for the "A" event. Additionally, "everything" excludes two disciplines (ladies, dance). I think the Team Event is a poor idea in general, though.

I'm largely mixed on Jeremy here, though. He didn't skate well. His conference wasn't great. But the delight the Golden Skate Hate Brigade is taking in tearing him down is rather disquieting.

 

[louisa05]

No, they really wouldn't. They'd be all spent having gone for the "A" event. Additionally, "everything" excludes two disciplines (ladies, dance). I think the Team Event is a poor idea in general, though.

I'm largely mixed on Jeremy here, though. He didn't skate well. His conference wasn't great. But the delight the Golden Skate Hate Brigade is taking in tearing him down is rather disquieting.

I hate the way people seem to relish tearing someone apart. It is a really gross aspect of human nature. Apparently, there is something wrong with me because I don't find it enjoyable. I think I may have liked seeing athletes and performers I didn't like do badly as a teenager, but somewhere along the way I grew up and developed sympathy for them instead. I often find myself feeling bad even for athletes I can't stand when they have a very bad event--a response that the existence of gleeful hate brigades on the web intensifies.

As for Jeremy, the personal attacks here are what I find most upsetting. Last year at Nationals, Jeremy chatted with my mother and I for a few minutes during the men's "victory lap"--long enough that he had to catch up with the other medalists. He was friendly and gracious just moments after receiving a disappointing bronze medal. My mom was having the only longer than three hour break from caring for my seriously ill father that she has had for the weekend at Nationals. That chat with Jeremy made her entire weekend. And he didn't have to take that time.

 

[AngelENTL]

I hate the way people seem to relish tearing someone apart. It is a really gross aspect of human nature. Apparently, there is something wrong with me because I don't find it enjoyable. I think I may have liked seeing athletes and performers I didn't like do badly as a teenager, but somewhere along the way I grew up and developed sympathy for them instead. I often find myself feeling bad even for athletes I can't stand when they have a very bad event--a response that the existence of gleeful hate brigades on the web intensifies.

As for Jeremy, the personal attacks here are what I find most upsetting. Last year at Nationals, Jeremy chatted with my mother and I for a few minutes during the men's "victory lap"--long enough that he had to catch up with the other medalists. He was friendly and gracious just moments after receiving a disappointing bronze medal. My mom was having the only longer than three hour break from caring for my seriously ill father that she has had for the weekend at Nationals. That chat with Jeremy made her entire weekend. And he didn't have to take that time.

Thanks for sharing that story. I never got the jerk vibe from Jeremy Abbott; on the contrary, he seems like a very sweet guy. I'm new to this board and have been taken aback by the vitriol toward him, so I'm glad to read your post.

 

[TontoK]

There are many good points being made by all sides. If I cut any slack to any skater at the Olympics, it would probably be to the kid with the ponytail (who has always exceeded expectations this year and not needed it). Here, I have no expectations of his placement but, of all the skaters, he is one of four that I am most interested in seeing skate (the other three being Chan, Hanyu and Plushenko) because he has something that transcends the score. Even his free skate (the one that he supposedly tanked) at Skate America showed that. (For me, only Hanyu has the same kind of presence outside of the score as does Brown.) I put Brown in really great company, but for him (and U.S. skating) his placement here matters not so much as his presence and the experience he will gather from it.

But more than that:

What happened here in the short with Jeremy, and it only confirms what pretty well most of us believed before about Abbott's ability to compete internationally, is that the new kids (Aaron, Farris and Brown) are stepping into a vacuum. Basically, the bag is empty. What you write Tonto, ie "the time for the future is now" is bang on, because without these upcoming kids (all three of them are great competitors), there is no present even. Abbott can't say he wasn't give the chance. He was, time and time again, and he blew it. Let the kids run with it. It won't only be better for results in the long run, but actually the short run as well.

I'm a fan of both Max and Jason... and they are two completely different kinds of skaters. But with each, there is ability and a promising future, and the hint of a backbone. I'm learning to appreciate Josh a bit more. I did like his Nationals programs, although his long is a bit... I don't know the word... "intellectual"... maybe that's the word. I felt I had to study the program to appreciate Josh's skills, while Max's good points hit you right in the kisser, and Jason is so charismatic.

That said, I'd love for a new American man to arise and challenge these three. It's been four years of drought, and I'm ready for a flood of fresh new talent.

 

[qwertyskates]

If Jason scored what he did at Trophee Eric Bompard (84.77), he actually would have placed 5th, ahead of Amodio. I think given that Jeremy got 39 for that hot mess of a program in PCS, Jason's PCS for a clean program would have likely been 39/40, maybe highe. So 45.98 (TES from TEB) + 40= 85.98, which would actually have put him ahead of Han as well for the 4th place spot.

Except for the top 3, the judges at Team have been very strict with PCS, no one scored above 40 even with relatively clean programs, eg Amodio, Liebers, Han, Parr. Amodio isn't a new senior like the others either, and his SP has good CH, his jumps (no quads) were high, he dances as well as Jason Brown if not better. I don't see Brown's SP scoring higher than Amodio in either TES or PCS at this Sochi event, you can't assume that the same scores at TEB will apply here. However, it will definitely be better than Abbott's, but the eventual points earned for Team won't be that different, maybe +1. Brown is a delight to watch, but he really needs to up his jumps to have a go at Olympic podium.

As for Brown vs Han, they had a history of competing at JGP and a cleanish Han beat Brown every time except for occasions like TEB when Han was sick, fell on his jumps and had one of his worst skates. So that is not conclusive that Brown is better than Han. I do think poor Han is saddled with quite awful programs, the SP made him to be an idiot on ice at times, and the boring LP is replete with What the...? moments, what was Lori thinking? In this respect, Fernandez is also on thin ice despite his skating brilliance. If Han had gone back to his best JPG and Senior programs, raising the TES bar, he would have scored even higher.

The other promising US male skaters are Rippon and Dornbush, if Rippon can get his quads right, he is quite spectacular artistically, among the top. Abbott at his best could get onto the podium or 4th. I haven't given up on his individual event yet.

 

[noskates]

Amodio has a problem with consistency. Yes he can dance but he also has to land the jumps. Ricky Dornbush has great promise - much like Jeremy did. BUT - he also gets the yips in big competitions. I prefer his skating style over Max Aaron's any day. Adam Rippon is probably one of the most graceful and smooth men on the ice but again - no consistency. I do think Jason has the most promise of any US male skater currently. I don't see Max beating him in the near future unless he can do more than jump.

I know Jeremy is being vilified but I hope he can redeem himself. I would hate for his last experience as a competitor to be horribly wrong. When he's "on" he's wonderful. When!

 

[Mrs. P]

Except for the top 3, the judges at Team have been very strict with PCS, no one scored above 40 even with relatively clean programs, eg Amodio, Liebers, Han, Parr. Amodio isn't a new senior like the others either, and his SP has good CH, his jumps (no quads) were high, he dances as well as Jason Brown if not better. I don't see Brown's SP scoring higher than Amodio in either TES or PCS at this Sochi event, you can't assume that the same scores at TEB will apply here. However, it will definitely be better than Abbott's, but the eventual points earned for Team won't be that different, maybe +1. Brown is a delight to watch, but he really needs to up his jumps to have a go at Olympic podium.

As for Brown vs Han, they had a history of competing at JGP and a cleanish Han beat Brown every time except for occasions like TEB when Han was sick, fell on his jumps and had one of his worst skates. So that is not conclusive that Brown is better than Han. I do think poor Han is saddled with quite awful programs, the SP made him to be an idiot on ice at times, and the boring LP is replete with What the...? moments, what was Lori thinking? In this respect, Fernandez is also on thin ice despite his skating brilliance. If Han had gone back to his best JPG and Senior programs, raising the TES bar, he would have scored even higher.

The other promising US male skaters are Rippon and Dornbush, if Rippon can get his quads right, he is quite spectacular artistically, among the top. Abbott at his best could get onto the podium or 4th. I haven't given up on his individual event yet.

I actually agree with you half-way -- Jason will need a lot of help to get a medal, but he's shown during the GP that he can score well. He needs the quad to be a medal contender, but I still think top 6 is possible.

Moving on by getting out this thread, Jeremy's had enough ripping if you ask me

 

[hurrah]

Poor Jeremy.

It seems like a limbic brain processing issue, and once his brain's learnt to go into panic mode in competition, there's not much he or anyone else can do about it. Well, maybe after years and years of re-training the brain perhaps.

The best thing would be if he could fully convince himself that he's not competing at all.

 

[karne]

The best thing would be if he could fully convince himself that he's not competing at all.

I thought that was what he just tried in the team event! Just a warmup!

 

[hurrah]

I thought that was what he just tried in the team event! Just a warmup!

Yeah, well...
Maybe there are certain triggers that sets him off, like putting on his competition costume??
Maybe he could go out in the singles event dressed in his warmup clothes? It sounds ridiculous and unlikely, I know.

 

[dorispulaski]

It does cause me to wonder why he keeps competing when clearly it is very distressing and difficult for him.

BTW, other countries' media also rips Olympic athletes:
http://www.vancouversun.com/mobile/...der+Olympic+alpine+failure/4205993/story.html

In 2010, an Austrian paper published pictures of the 4 members of the Austrian ski team who failed to medal with the caption "Failure 1 2 3 4"

They talked about it on tonight's NBC coverage. Negative media comes with the territory.

 

[hyperinflation]

In 2010, an Austrian paper published pictures of the 4 members of the Austrian ski team who failed to medal with the caption "Failure 1 2 3 4"

that's really mean

but also kind of funny lmao

 

[Tonichelle]

They talked about it on tonight's NBC coverage. Negative media comes with the territory.

They all say that to justify bad journalism.

 

[emma]

Although I can see Doris' point and can't help wonder what has pushed Abbot to keep competing, at the same time, I imagine I get it: that chance to prove what he feels he can do. I still hope he can prove that. If he can't, I will take no pleasure in that, but immense pleasure in the memories of what he has done well - he is one of those very special skaters, IMHO.

As much as I tend to love IP's posts, I must disagree with the team event - I think it's great. But I feel so very strongly it should be last. I don't believe they will be spend - in fact, if doing the team event 'spends' them, it is truly unfair to put it first. I think, as first, it can be both a tremendous advantage and tremendous disadvantage to those who skate it - and to me, that is just inherently unfair. ALl those who qualified should start off on as equal footing as possible. Then, let the team event build on that - be a venue to let those who faltered (and qualified for the team) to prove they can do it, or as someone else said, redeem themselves. Let those who did well, prove they can do it (again)....I suspect that when medals, country, and team are at stake, they will all rise to that occasion no matter how tired. And some how, I just feel in my gut they will derive energy from each other for that event despite the energy spent on their individual events.

Anyway, my way of saying, I'm loving extra skating - and frankly, my 4 year only skating fan friends (olympics viewers only), are totally into this - which I think is great - I just wish it were following not preceding the individual events.

 

[Near]

Maybe he likes skating and continued to compete so he coyld dedicate himself to it? And say what you will, but tomorow Abott will be an Olympic medalist. That certaintl seems like a good price for not having quit pre-Sochi.

 

[pitterpatter]

I'm really wondering how all the heat directed at him will affect him going into the individual competitions. I have a bad feeling that it won't help his mindset one bit, instead providing greater distractions, but here's hoping he'll put up a good showing and prove us all wrong.

 

[karne]

I think perhaps the worst part of it all is that Abbott could end up with an Olympic medal for that performance.

 

[Trewyn]

I think perhaps the worst part of it all is that Abbott could end up with an Olympic medal for that performance.

Yes. I mean, I love Jeremy, but it's a bit ridiculous getting an Olympic medal for that.

Not sure how Jeremy will be affected. I think Ashley's been in a far worse situation as far as media are concerned - and she seems okay . This might soon be forgotten (by the time the individual event rolls around).