Alysa Liu Ready for Change | Page 3 | Golden Skate

Alysa Liu Ready for Change

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
she's changed a lot, obviously she's growing.
It wouldn't be easy to adjust to sudden growth spurts, it was never easy for anyone aside from a handful of skaters who experienced more gradual changes and had time to adjust little by little.
Everything will come in due time, what matters is Alysa's strong will, determination and character to overcome those difficulties. If she keeps being a tough kid as she always was, she'll manage it.
 

Dogo

On the Ice
Joined
Oct 2, 2020
Alysa's first appearance in this season:
Triples are UR, combo is 3-2, she looks heavy. Looks like she's done.
You said this first. For english speakers, it means you're talking about her as a whole (meaning her "body"). If you didn't mention any other subject (you never mentioned "her skating looks heavy") then we must presume you're commenting on her body.

Let's not contribute to her (or any other child skater of any country) developing future eating disorders or depression. Sure, let's be critical about jumps and techniques. Maybe she needs to strengthen her muscles or add more body conditioning to her training, but the notion that she has to be a "stick" to jump only fuels more negative and toxic comments to a developing child.
 

icybear

Medalist
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
I cant see her holding onto her quads. She already had issues with underrotation and now with this puberty change it would be more impossible. Her body type seems to be heading towards the Wakaba/ Elizaveta kind of body and female quads dont usually work on those. I know Elizaveta has a quad somewhere but she has a strong jumping technique foundation. Also that La Strada choregraphy is just bland. I know people keep commenting on her smile, but its beginning to get too artificial now.
 

drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
With the amount of training time the skaters lost, and seeing how even the very talented Russians are struggling to regain their form from a year ago, I don't think we can get a good idea of where her skating will be in January when she needs to peak for Nationals. For me, there are visible URs but her jumps never looked "crisp" to me so I don't understand the criticism of the heaviness of her skating now. Given how fast she rotated her jumps, she obviously will need to rework her technique to adapt to her growing body.
 

kolyadafan2002

Fan of Kolyada
Final Flight
Joined
Jun 6, 2019
I cant see her holding onto her quads. She already had issues with underrotation and now with this puberty change it would be more impossible. Her body type seems to be heading towards the Wakaba/ Elizaveta kind of body and female quads dont usually work on those. I know Elizaveta has a quad somewhere but she has a strong jumping technique foundation. Also that La Strada choregraphy is just bland. I know people keep commenting on her smile, but its beginning to get too artificial now.
I feel if everybody taught technique foundation like Elizebeta then quads may take longer but they would be more sustainable with age. Right now you need to jump quad by 15 (or 3A) otherwise you're nothing, and can't make it.

This is why people teach unsustainable quads at such a young age. If senior age limit was hypothetically 17-18, then people would slow the process of teaching quads and start similar teachnique to Elizebeta. They can teach quads like this, but they won't as otherwise their skaters won't succeed.

Alysa Liu is talented enough to land quads at an older age, but her technqiue is not suited for this. If her coach taught her differently she'd be in a great position to learn quads properly and keep them for longer. Even like Rika Kihira or Wakaba (I feel both have potential to learn a quad).
 

nussnacker

one and only
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 16, 2019
I feel if everybody taught technique foundation like Elizebeta then quads may take longer but they would be more sustainable with age. Right now you need to jump quad by 15 (or 3A) otherwise you're nothing, and can't make it.

This is why people teach unsustainable quads at such a young age. If senior age limit was hypothetically 17-18, then people would slow the process of teaching quads and start similar teachnique to Elizebeta. They can teach quads like this, but they won't as otherwise their skaters won't succeed.

Alysa Liu is talented enough to land quads at an older age, but her technqiue is not suited for this. If her coach taught her differently she'd be in a great position to learn quads properly and keep them for longer. Even like Rika Kihira or Wakaba (I feel both have potential to learn a quad).
When people say things like that, I feel like they slept over 2 periods, few years each, when Liza lost her 3A and couldn’t land/underrotated 3-3s.

She first landed her 3A at 12, and looking at a video of that, it’s like Midori Ito 3A, so much room, height, length. The ones she’s landing now are amazing too, but that video of her at 12 was simply mind blowing to me.

Rika didn’t grow all too much compared to her teenage self, Sasha last year was already taller and bigger than Rika, now she’s even taller and still landing her quads.

Ultimately, Liza’s periods of losing her shape/jumps to puberty changes twice(!) and missing on Olympics twice, should be a sign that her technique didn’t survive the puberty as good as people like to think. She adjusted again, but no one can say it was a walk in the park and that her technique made any of those body changes completely seamless for her. She struggled and quite a lot.
 

mrrice

Record Breaker
Joined
Jul 9, 2014
This is such a touchy issue. As a dancer, I had beautiful turns and leaps until the summer between my 9th and 10th grade year of High School. It was a nightmare. I couldn't turn the way I used to and when I saw myself on video, I just didn't look like myself. It took more than a year for me to feel like "Myself" on the dance floor but, it did happen. If Alysa is going through a growth spurt, her muscles may not feel like they used to for a while. Hopefully this is temporary and I wish fans would just cheer for their champion as she deals with whatever is going on.
 

sailormoon

On the Ice
Joined
Aug 9, 2016
Country
Japan
Alysa's first appearance in this season:
Triples are UR, combo is 3-2, she looks heavy. Looks like she's done.

In the TV broadcast, three American skaters did their exhibition programs, joining the ice show remotely from the United States. Alysa and Chen performed their short programs. Chen landed a backflip at the end of his performance. Bell's Britney Spears medley was exciting to watch. They looked great overall compared to Japanese skaters on the ice show. I guess Alysa will have another good season before she experiences some issues in few years.
 
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drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
Ultimately, Liza’s periods of losing her shape/jumps to puberty changes twice(!) and missing on Olympics twice, should be a sign that her technique didn’t survive the puberty as good as people like to think. She adjusted again, but no one can say it was a walk in the park and that her technique made any of those body changes completely seamless for her. She struggled and quite a lot.

I think when people say she has good technique, it means that it is solid enough that she can regain her peak level when she's healthy and confident. A lot of skaters lose their jumps and aren't able to ever get them back, and Liza hasn't really had that problem. While she has had ups and downs, she has also long outlasted her peers from 2013 and 2014.
 

readernick

Medalist
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
I think when people say she has good technique, it means that it is solid enough that she can regain her peak level when she's healthy and confident. A lot of skaters lose their jumps and aren't able to ever get them back, and Liza hasn't really had that problem. While she has had ups and downs, she has also long outlasted her peers from 2013 and 2014.
Yes, but while she did have good technique what has really set her apart was that her coach was willing to continue working with her through the difficult periods and give her the time she needed to get back get technical skills. She is also able (obviously) to continue to push /work when she is down. Many other girls do not have that same personality, or the same type of patient coach. What Alysa has in her favor is 18 months to the Olympics, and a ladies field that isn't crowded like the one in Russia. Honestly, she is still tiny. She just needs some additional muscle to get her jumps higher and an in- person jump coach.
 

readernick

Medalist
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
Rika didn’t grow all too much compared to her teenage self, Sasha last year was already taller and bigger than Rika, now she’s even taller and still landing her quads.
Rika actually did grow a significant amount between her first and second junior season. It caused a lot if inconsistency during her second junior season, but she didn't lose her jumps. Having good technique does help, but it isn't the only factor

What Rika and Sasha have in common though is that they both seem incredibly gifted at developing muscle compared to most girls. So as they grew, they both added height to their jumps ( especially Rika compare the height of her jumps from 2016/2017 to her jumps now, they are so much higher) which helped them to deal with difficulties that loss of rotation speed brings. Alysa needs muscle. I am sure she is working on it.
 

ali0125

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 3, 2019
Country
Australia
I'm not saying Alysa should eat less but probably more healthier? I noticed with visible weight growth, her muscular strength is not improving at all, which imo might associates to overconsumption of calorie rich food. It's total understandable that she's a teen came back from lockdown - but it's just bad to an athlete.
 

readernick

Medalist
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
I'm not saying Alysa should eat less but probably more healthier? I noticed with visible weight growth, her muscular strength is not improving at all, which imo might associate overconsumption of calorie rich food. It's total understandable that she's a teen came back from lockdown - but it's just bad to an athlete.
It is just what naturally happens to a girl going through puberty. You gain some fat, you don't gain muscle. She can gain muscle, but it take time and not everyone has the same genetic ability to develop muscle. Rika and Sasha are gifted in this regard, many girls aren't.
 

ali0125

On the Ice
Joined
Nov 3, 2019
Country
Australia
It is just what naturally happens to a girl going through puberty. You gain some fat, you don't gain muscle. She can gain muscle, but it take time and not everyone has the same genetic ability to develop muscle. Rika and Sasha are gifted in this regard, many girls aren't.
I'm not sure about Sasha but Rika - I saw from some Japanese TV documentary, she calculated calories of each meal. I think self discipline plays a large part of one's fitness.
 

readernick

Medalist
Joined
Dec 5, 2015
I'm not sure about Sasha but Rika - I saw from some Japanese TV documentary, she calculated calories of each meal. I think self discipline plays a large part of one's fitness.
Genetic ability strongly influences muscle mass. It is proven by science. Two people eating the same amount/same type of food will not develop the same amount of muscle mass. Rika counts everything because she wants to make sure she gets enough protein and vitamins. It is smart, but we don't know anything about Alysa's diet so your comments about her assumed diet aren't helpful or constructive to Alysa in any way.
 
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drivingmissdaisy

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 17, 2010
What Alysa has in her favor is 18 months to the Olympics, and a ladies field that isn't crowded like the one in Russia. Honestly, she is still tiny. She just needs some additional muscle to get her jumps higher and an in- person jump coach.

At the end of the day, all that matters is that she has the 3A. She probably needs that to make the Olympic team because she's weaker than the top two Americans in almost every aspect except jump difficulty. Watching that SP made me realize how reliant she is on difficult jumps to bring excitement to her programs.
 

sheetz

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 10, 2015
What Alysa has in her favor is 18 months to the Olympics,

The start of the Olympics are only 16 months away, with US Nats a month before that. So realistically she doesn't have nearly that much time. If the US only has 2 spots those could easily go to Mariah and Bradie.

After we see her ISP programs we'll have a better idea of where she stands.
 
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