another Yagudin article

[emma]

Germanice...it might be true that Americans want to see Americans in general or as some kind of average....I've certainly met many people like that; but like any society, there is all kind of variation and differences among Americans; I for one don't even consider/care where a skater is from...if that skater is great/entertaining/fabulous whaterver, then I would like to see that person skate.

How SOI or other tours determine what will make money for them, who they hire as a result, and what they pay them is something I know nothing at all about.

 

[Doggygirl]

ITA with all who have said SOI is a business, and has to be run financially as a business.

I think more serious skating fans buy a ticket to see skaters they enjoy regardless of nationality. But for very casual fans who only watch winter sports during the Olympics, I think the "Olympic Spirit" drives things, which is athletes winning medals for their country. So for someone who is a casual fan in the spirit of the Olympics is probably more apt to buy a ticket to see a home country "hero."

It would be interesting to know the trends through each 4-year cycle for SOI. I would guess ticket sales trend upwards in the first post Oly season (and significantly upwards depending on US medal winners - especially Gold) and then start to taper off slightly in year two, and more significantly in in years 3/4.

But as usual, I could be totally wrong - this is just a guess.

 

[brad640]

“I wait for Zhenya to stop competing and get more free time. Now, he is tied up with his coach Alexei Nikolaevich Mishin, as well as the Russian Figure Skating Federation that doesn’t like me much. I am not suggesting we all become one happy family.
...
Sure, we were opponents, but I’ve never had anything against Zhenya. I’ve never said anything bad about him, and I never offended anyone either.”

It sounds like Alexei is not ready to bury the hatchet with Mishin. That may stand in the way of any partnership, because Plushenko has been steadfast in his devotion to Mishin and considers him to be the genius of Russian skating. If Alexei really wants to work with Plushenko he should be prepared to mend his relationship with Mishin, which might be difficult after he completely disavowed Mishin when he won his OGM. At least he should not issue an ultimatum that Plushenko has to sever all ties with Mishin to work with him, because that will likely not happen.

 

[nicole_l]

the US-Americans only want to see US-American skaters matter.

I think this is true only for non-fans or casual fans. I think many people who know who the top ten or so in figure skating are and are familiar with their skating have their own favorites, not based on nationality. It's really just what you're presented with. If you aren't a fan, you'll think that Johnny Weir is the best in skating, but if you are a fan, your favorite might be Plushenko, Lambiel, Li, Klimkin, or really anyone in the world who you're familiar with!

 

[Mathman]

.It would be interesting to know the trends through each 4-year cycle for SOI. I would guess ticket sales trend upwards in the first post Oly season (and significantly upwards depending on US medal winners - especially Gold) and then start to taper off slightly in year two, and more significantly in in years 3/4.

That is certainly true. For Champions on Ice, there were 82 shows in their 2002 tour, and only 23 this year.

In 2002, Sarah Hughes skated last, although it was rumored that Michelle was the highest paid at $20,000 per show. (I don't know whether that is true on not.)

Sarah did not want to skate the whole tour -- too gruelling, plus she had other responsibilities, such as school. After Sarah left the show, Michelle skated last. This ticked off Alexei Y, who thought he deserved the spot and was not shy about saying so. I believe that this might have been the nail in the coffin of the relationship between Alexei and Tom Collins -- a relation that had been strained anyway ever since Alexei was kicked off the 1998 COI tour for excessive drinking and overall juvenile behavior. (He was 18 at the time.)

Mathman

 

[Doggygirl]

After Sarah left the show, Michelle skated last. This ticked off Alexei Y, who thought he deserved the spot and was not shy about saying so. I believe that this might have been the nail in the coffin of the relationship between Alexei and Tom Collins -- a relation that had been strained anyway ever since Alexei was kicked off the 1998 COI tour for excessive drinking and overall juvenile behavior. (He was 18 at the time.)

Mathman

Wow. That paragraph really made me think about the weight of the financial and career decisions that rest on the young shoulders of these skaters. Heck, I've made career / financial decisions that I would love to go back and "re-do" well into my 30's and 40's. This has to be particularly difficult for young non-American skaters who may not have the "wisdom" of family, etc. behind them on the business and cultural side of things. I know Alexei is close to his Mom, but I doubt this strong relationship by itself helps Alexei understand the business ways of the US, and even the cultural differences that might impact what he chooses to say publically. And Oksana? She had little to no infrastructure so no wonder she got in trouble. It makes me respect her even more since she's recovered from some of her past mistakes and is still on the scene.

Alexei is a talented guy, and I hope he continues to find lucrative ways to make money on the business side of FS.

 

[attyfan]

Wow. That paragraph really made me think about the weight of the financial and career decisions that rest on the young shoulders of these skaters ... This has to be particularly difficult for young non-American skaters who may not have the "wisdom" of family, etc. behind them on the business and cultural side of things ...

I recall reading somewhere that Alexei was making major financial contributions to his family (i.e., buying warm clothes and other necessitites) at the age of twelve, and, according to one ABC fluff, got his family out of a slum into a decent place at the age of 18. Plushy, Anton, Elena, etc. also started supporting their families at a comparatively young age. Slute is paying her mom's medical bills as well as her own. My guess is that either the Russians are nervous about "rocking the boat", or, after they have taken care of the family, they feel (understandably) that they are entitled to to take a break from responsibility.

 

[Doggygirl]

I recall reading somewhere that Alexei was making major financial contributions to his family (i.e., buying warm clothes and other necessitites) at the age of twelve, and, according to one ABC fluff, got his family out of a slum into a decent place at the age of 18. Plushy, Anton, Elena, etc. also started supporting their families at a comparatively young age. Slute is paying her mom's medical bills as well as her own. My guess is that either the Russians are nervous about "rocking the boat", or, after they have taken care of the family, they feel (understandably) that they are entitled to to take a break from responsibility.

ITA that a ton of financial opportunity AND responsibility falls on very young shoulders. While the situations may or may not be as dramatic in the details, I think many young US stars (FS and otherwise) find themselves in this position. In the more recent FS World, I think first of Rudy Galindo. On the Hollywood side of things, there have been many child actors over the years who dramatically changed the financial status of families while they were minor children - hence some new laws about that sort of thing. And the mental / emotional challenges must be imense - think Michael Jackson.

Great Point!

DG

 

[Germanice]

OK, guys, sorry for generalizing, I'm certainly aware not every US-supporter is *that* stupid. I've told you how *naive" I am, I'm dumb enough to believe a high class skating show should include the BEST!!!, and ONLY the best!!!, actually I didn't waste my time with terms like "business" and "casual, patriotic US-audiences" too much. Of course I'm wrong, I'm a minority, and I know it!

But then, there are still times when that very special US-*business* behaviour = certain discriminations against foreign, mainly better!, skaters!, still make me vomit. Sorry, there's nothing I can do against it.

Anke

 

[Mathman]

Strange as it seems, sometimes general audiences don't really care so much about how good the skaters are, they just want to be entertained. How else can we account for the fact that Steven Cousins remains a fixture with SOI, or Dan Hollander (?!) with COI.

Then, too, when someone wins an Olympic gold medal, his prize is -- an Olympic gold medal.

That is not the same as winning a show biz contract or an endorsement deal. Sure you can skate, but will anyone buy Nike shoes with your name on them?

Mathman

 

[attyfan]

... While the situations may or may not be as dramatic in the details, I think many young US stars (FS and otherwise) find themselves in this position. In the more recent FS World, I think first of Rudy Galindo. On the Hollywood side of things, there have been many child actors over the years who dramatically changed the financial status of families while they were minor children - hence some new laws about that sort of thing. And the mental / emotional challenges must be imense - think Michael Jackson. ... DG

I don't think that there have been very many young US stars who find themselves in quite the same position as the Russian skaters, simply because the Russian skaters got their start with a communist government paying the bills, whereas the Americans did not -- so the American skaters usually came from families with more money than did the Russians. A really promising skater, I have heard, can be subsidized by a coach in some ways, but a Russian who is comparatively poor (such as Yagudin was) is more like an American at the same economic level -- and probably, now, won't get skating lessons.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

I recall reading somewhere that Alexei was making major financial contributions to his family (i.e., buying warm clothes and other necessitites) at the age of twelve, and, according to one ABC fluff, got his family out of a slum into a decent place at the age of 18. Plushy, Anton, Elena, etc. also started supporting their families at a comparatively young age. Slute is paying her mom's medical bills as well as her own. My guess is that either the Russians are nervous about "rocking the boat", or, after they have taken care of the family, they feel (understandably) that they are entitled to to take a break from responsibility.

From what I understand, the olegarchies in Russia have more money than Bill Gates. that is each one has more money than Gates! What's wrong with them? Are they not patriotic enough to make the greatest skating show on earth?

Joe

 

[Zanzibar]

From what I understand, the olegarchies in Russia have more money than Bill Gates. that is each one has more money than Gates! What's wrong with them? Are they not patriotic enough to make the greatest skating show on earth?

Joe

That's true, Joe. And Russia has more billionaires right now than any other country on earth, although many of them choose not to live there. Most of the riches come from the oil contracts - like Ambramovich's money - and most of these guys are little more than mafia thug businessmen who made it to the big time. Any time journalists sniff around and try to write about them - they frequently meet up with the unfortunate circumstance of becoming the victim of a 'hit' which was sadly was happened to the wonderful editor of Russian FORBES magazine, and many other curious reporters. If I was Auverbukh, or anyone else contemplating a Russian ice tour and looking for financiers, these guys are ones I'd run from - fast.

 

[soogar]

If I was Auverbukh, or anyone else contemplating a Russian ice tour and looking for financiers, these guys are ones I'd run from - fast.

I wouldn't be surprised if Averbukh did make a deal with a few devils to get his show financed.


As for the whole market research argument etc... I still don't get why SOI thinks that the tour has room for only one Russian male. If Plush wins gold and let's say SOI bags Plush, why would/should they dump Alexei? Are all of Alexei's fans going to jump ship when the new Russian guy comes in? If that's the case, will they dump Todd for Johnny Weir? I bet not. They would probably keep both American guys on the show.

 

[Grgranny]

As for Plush and Yags, I would think it would be miserable for both of them
to be on the same tour. Also, as far as Americans only wanting to see Americans, it sure isn't that way for me. Give me Kulik any day!!!

 

[Ptichka]

Zanzibar, you said exactly what I was going to!

 

[Zanzibar]

Zanzibar, you said exactly what I was going to!

Cool. Feel free to elaborate Ptichka - you always seem to have good info. on what really goes on in Russia. I only looked into these guys in the process of writing an aviation-related story on the business jet market for Russia and former Soviet bloc countries. Wow - it was like going down a rabbit-hole - and you got the overwhelming creepy feeling that these guys don't want anything uncovered about their lives, their business holdings, or their airplanes. That's not so say there aren't people trying to run legitimate operations in Russia, but the mafia really seems to have a strangle-hold that runs rampant.

 

[Germanice]

Strange as it seems, sometimes general audiences don't really care so much about how good the skaters are, they just want to be entertained.

I knew SOI must have had certain reasons to hire Eldredge! :yes:

Anke

 

[brad640]

This is the best off season thread ever. Seriously I have read it 4 times - Yagudin-Plushenko feud, cruel business world, weight gain, mean Jamie and Scott, national bias, Russian mafia - Oh the humanity! Thank you Ptichka! I hope Yagudin will continue to speak out about the reality of pro skating and will work to bring about change. Soogar your posts make me

 

[fallsauce]

Ha, I know! Any more and we'll need a flow chart to keep track of things.