Bringing back figures to Juniors?

[StitchMonkey]

Figures is like the barre in ballet. It's necessary but no one wants to watch it.

But isn't the barre still trained? I have also seen it compared to scales in music, something you practice/train learn, but not something anyone wants to watch. The problem is that figures stopped being taught.

I do think that if some figures foundation was included in young skating programs it would be useful and beneficial to skaters. I don't think adding figures back would cause skaters to not work on quads at a young age... that ship has sailed. But I do think that adding figures might make some of the young quad attempts less scary.

Maybe full figures comps are unrealistic, but I what about just some club based "best figures of the month/week" on going contest? Keep it something fun and on going with flexible times - let skaters submit figures for weekly consideration any time during the week, and really treat it more as something healthy to practice at... sorta a good habit type thing. Then you would have some figures still being taught/trained. Some kids like to compete and would probably latch on to something like this, other would not, no big deal. It would help figures to be come part of the process again, but not part of the competition.

 

[Sam L]

But isn't the barre still trained? I have also seen it compared to scales in music, something you practice/train learn, but not something anyone wants to watch. The problem is that figures stopped being taught.

I do think that if some figures foundation was included in young skating programs it would be useful and beneficial to skaters. I don't think adding figures back would cause skaters to not work on quads at a young age... that ship has sailed. But I do think that adding figures might make some of the young quad attempts less scary.

Maybe full figures comps are unrealistic, but I what about just some club based "best figures of the month/week" on going contest? Keep it something fun and on going with flexible times - let skaters submit figures for weekly consideration any time during the week, and really treat it more as something healthy to practice at... sorta a good habit type thing. Then you would have some figures still being taught/trained. Some kids like to compete and would probably latch on to something like this, other would not, no big deal. It would help figures to be come part of the process again, but not part of the competition.

Yes that's right. And actually as an adult learning skating, I would love to do fugures, it's what skating is about right? But as a young skater who wants to compete it's all about the jumps because they make you win. Yeah that ship has sailed so the only thing that's going to stop "progress" is physics.

 

[StitchMonkey]

Yes that's right. And actually as an adult learning skating, I would love to do fugures, it's what skating is about right? But as a young skater who wants to compete it's all about the jumps because they make you win. Yeah that ship has sailed so the only thing that's going to stop "progress" is physics.

There are some young skaters who would love trying to be best at their club/rink week after week. Some people like like to compete. Figures would need a carrot on a stick for kids.

 

[gkelly]

The problem is, in order to get good at figures, you have to practice regularly on clean ice.

Not on freestyle sessions. Not on public sessions. On sessions when you have a patch of ice to yourself that you can lay out the figures and see the tracings, without anyone else skating over them. Like this.

Not like this and certainly not like this.

Those kinds of sessions hardly exist any more. Making them available on a regular basis in a time and place accessible to all skaters who want to practice figures is really not very feasible at most rinks. A training center with multiple ice surfaces and a strong figure skating program might be able to schedule daily patch early in the morning or during the day when most people are in school or at work so serious competitors (e.g., those homeschooled to allow more training time, or whose parents are willing to wake up at 4 AM to drive them to practice) would have access to appropriate ice time. And it would cost more than freestyle sessions. Developing a robust figures program at those rinks/clubs would give a technical advantage to skaters who train there, but it would not be something that could work for every developing competitor around the US or Canada, or around the world.

Skaters who start out in local rinks where there is only one ice surface mostly used for hockey and public skating, where it's hard to get enough ice time for freestyle practice would be out of luck.

Some whole countries only have one or few single-surface rinks.

When all competitive skaters were required to compete figures (and test them in countries that had test requirements), then local figure skating clubs had to schedule their ice time to include figures practice sessions. But it's not cost effective for clubs or for rink-sponsored ice time if only a few skaters want to train figures.

During the transition in the 1990s when no one was required to train figures any more but a few serious skaters at the club I skated with at the time chose to continue, that club experimented with coning off a few patches at the end of the ice and using the smaller remaining ice surface for a low-level freestyle session. But that didn't last long. The smaller available ice was not useful to most of the club members who weren't working on figures.

Requiring figures for competitive skaters would make competitive skating much less accessible, much less egalitarian. There's a reason figure skating had a reputation as an elite/elitist sport, and a lot of that had to do with access to ice time.

 

[Sam L]

^ Very informative post. I started following the sport after figures but I've always been fascinated by them. You have given good reasons why they shouldn't be brought back. Accessibility to the sport should be a big reason.

 

[hanca]

The problem is, in order to get good at figures, you have to practice regularly on clean ice.

Not on freestyle sessions. Not on public sessions. On sessions when you have a patch of ice to yourself that you can lay out the figures and see the tracings, without anyone else skating over them. Like this.

Not like this and certainly not like this.

Those kinds of sessions hardly exist any more. Making them available on a regular basis in a time and place accessible to all skaters who want to practice figures is really not very feasible at most rinks. A training center with multiple ice surfaces and a strong figure skating program might be able to schedule daily patch early in the morning or during the day when most people are in school or at work so serious competitors (e.g., those homeschooled to allow more training time, or whose parents are willing to wake up at 4 AM to drive them to practice) would have access to appropriate ice time. And it would cost more than freestyle sessions. Developing a robust figures program at those rinks/clubs would give a technical advantage to skaters who train there, but it would not be something that could work for every developing competitor around the US or Canada, or around the world.

Skaters who start out in local rinks where there is only one ice surface mostly used for hockey and public skating, where it's hard to get enough ice time for freestyle practice would be out of luck.

Some whole countries only have one or few single-surface rinks.

When all competitive skaters were required to compete figures (and test them in countries that had test requirements), then local figure skating clubs had to schedule their ice time to include figures practice sessions. But it's not cost effective for clubs or for rink-sponsored ice time if only a few skaters want to train figures.

During the transition in the 1990s when no one was required to train figures any more but a few serious skaters at the club I skated with at the time chose to continue, that club experimented with coning off a few patches at the end of the ice and using the smaller remaining ice surface for a low-level freestyle session. But that didn't last long. The smaller available ice was not useful to most of the club members who weren't working on figures.

Requiring figures for competitive skaters would make competitive skating much less accessible, much less egalitarian. There's a reason figure skating had a reputation as an elite/elitist sport, and a lot of that had to do with access to ice time.

There are alternatives to figures, for example Annie's edges. One develops the same skills, but doesn't need a patch of clean spotless ice.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

I disagree with abolishing quads in juniors. Holding a skater back technically is never a good thing. A quad can add 6+ points compared to a triple. And if you're trying to actually win, that's a significant difference. Once a skater moves up to seniors, their experience training the quad as a junior means they can achieve success much faster -- not everyone is a Jason Brown who can afford no quad because of top-notch artistry.

Yes, there is the injury issue, but training a quad at any point means a skater is risking injury. So whether they start training them when they're 15 or 17 or 21, they will face that risk.

As for bringing back figures, I do think it's worth training them for a developing skater, but to make it part of the competition would be a waste of resources - they're boring, repetitive, and nobody would want to watch it.

 

[Tutto]

I don't think anyone actually was suggesting to abolish quads in juniors altogether but to shift the focus back to SS which are lets be honest are neglected by many coaches