Effects of ISU's media deal - Figure Skating on CBC but not Eurosport

[Winnie_20]

So what about the archived streams that are now blocked due to music copyrights? The Gala has been blocked now, too (it wasn’t last night when I watched the first half), and the Men’s SP already was.
It says it’s blocked in my country, but does that mean there are actually countries where these specific videos are NOT blocked? Anybody know? I could try with my VPN, but I don’t really know where to begin.

Edit: I am aware there are kind and generous souls on the planet who have uploaded the streams to youtube that are not blocked (yet), but that’s not really the point. ;-/

 

[viennaskater]

Seems the Exhibition skate has gone - but the rest seems to be there.

You are right about the 'kind souls'.

 

[surimi]

That's a bummer, I still have SA pairs free and free dance to watch from archives, and haven't seen the gala yet. I was really looking forward to Kazuki's. See, ISU, some viewers have to watch the archived stuff for the most part due to real life getting in the way, and we cannot do that if the streams and videos are blocked. Is there anything on eurovision sports, I wonder?

 

[viennaskater]

Is there anything on eurovision sports, I wonder?

Unfortunately not. The latest videos on there are World Juniors 2019 and the World Team Trophy 2019.

As for the Skate America Gala, you should find most (if not all) performances individually on YouTube, including Kazuki Tomono's!:thumbsup:

I strongly think that these archives should be kept available for at least a week after the event.

 

[le01]

Why are they doing this? Why replace website with youtube where half of videos gets blocked - to generate some $$$ from ads? I gave up on watching some of junior GP this season because could not watch it live and videos became unavailble

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

Why are they doing this? Why replace website with youtube where half of videos gets blocked - to generate some $$$ from ads? I gave up on watching some of junior GP this season because could not watch it live and videos became unavailble

No, much simpler than that. The ISU's newly appointed promotors were looking too much for the TV rights, and nobody wanted to pay what was being asked for. So, creating a YouTube stream was a way for the ISU to save face. And spin it as a positive thing. That it means that more people than ever can watch.

But, as anybody who has ever tried to follow figure skating on YouTube before knows, the music companies are relentless in zapping the videos. And the result would be that if you weren't watching live, you were unlikely to be able to see things in their entirity.

So now, we are in a worse position than we ever were.

Although I missed the first couple of Junior GP's due to being away, I persisted with watching all of the rest of them. But, I was frustrated with having to go looking for individual routines because the archived livestream videos had been zapped.

And after having to do it too many times for the Juniors, I have got fed up and just don't feel like doing it again for the Seniors.

This is not the way to grow the sport. It would be if music copyright wasn't an issue. But it is.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[luckyguy]

I have a question to the copyright issues and the blocked SA gala on youtube.

As far as I know the skaters or their federations pay for the right to use copyrighted music in front of the audience. Do not skaters have the right to show their performances on youtube after the payment? How can the copyright owner block it on youtube?

 

[Harriet]

I have a question to the copyright issues and the blocked SA gala on youtube.

As far as I know the skaters or their federations pay for the right to use copyrighted music in front of the audience. Do not skaters have the right to show their performances on youtube after the payment? How can the copyright owner block it on youtube?

It's not always the cleared music that's the problem (although music that's cleared for TV broadcasting may not also be cleared for online streaming - I don't know the details of the law by any means). Sometimes it's the 'incidental' music the rink/competition organisers play in the time between programs that triggers a copyright strike, because it's only cleared for live use in the rink, not for any form of broadcast.

 

[DenissVFan]

Can't they edit it out once the live broadcast is over?

 

[Rissa]

Eurosport weren't 100% reliable on showing everything, but I miss the commentary of Chris and Simon and the other guys. Pity.

ESP had everything on their player at least, both live and archived for a month. With and without commentary, good quality, no zapping due to music copyrights. The YT situation is a step down for sure.

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

It's not always the cleared music that's the problem (although music that's cleared for TV broadcasting may not also be cleared for online streaming - I don't know the details of the law by any means). Sometimes it's the 'incidental' music the rink/competition organisers play in the time between programs that triggers a copyright strike, because it's only cleared for live use in the rink, not for any form of broadcast.

Which is why I have been saying in various threads over the past couple of weeks that the organisers of competitions need to be instructed to not play music in between routines. I know when I raised it in this thread somebody replied that "It would be weird for an entire arena to just sit in silence for 6 minutes and hear only the sound of the blades". But, that was not what I was envisaging at all. I was envisaging the period between the routine finishing and the results being announced as a time when the people in the audience could have a quiet chat with the person next to them about what they had just seen. Just like we do on here.

One of the Senior B's I watched recently didn't play any music in between routines, and it didn't cause any loss of enjoyment at all.

---

Just further to the copyright issue, a few days ago I saw a post from Vanessa James on Facebook complaining that the day before she had posted a great photo of herself and Morgan during a lift, but then had to remove it due to a copyright claim.

This is getting ridiculous. Like, when you can't even show people a photo of yourself without somebody coming after you.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[viennaskater]

Which is why I have been saying in various threads over the past couple of weeks that the organisers of competitions need to be instructed to not play music in between routines.
One of the Senior B's I watched recently didn't play any music in between routines, and it didn't cause any loss of enjoyment at all.

---

CaroLiza_fan

Quite honestly, the music they played during the Lombardia and Finlandia Trophies while waiting for results was so atrocious, I think we can happily live without it.

 

[Harriet]

Just further to the copyright issue, a few days ago I saw a post from Vanessa James on Facebook complaining that the day before she had posted a great photo of herself and Morgan during a lift, but then had to remove it due to a copyright claim.

This is getting ridiculous. Like, when you can't even show people a photo of yourself without somebody coming after you.

CaroLiza_fan

I saw that post too, and to be honest I was more surprised she hadn't checked the rights/permissions situation before posting the picture (which was indeed spectacular). Photograph copyright belongs to either the photographer or the person who contracted and paid them to take the photograph, simple as. If you want to use someone else's work in your publicity (which is what post such as that one are, at base), be prepared to get permission and, if necessary, pay for it - just like skaters do with music for their programs and authors do with quotes included in their books.

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

I saw that post too, and to be honest I was more surprised she hadn't checked the rights/permissions situation before posting the picture (which was indeed spectacular). Photograph copyright belongs to either the photographer or the person who contracted and paid them to take the photograph, simple as. If you want to use someone else's work in your publicity (which is what post such as that one are, at base), be prepared to get permission and, if necessary, pay for it - just like skaters do with music for their programs and authors do with quotes included in their books.

So, you have the right to stop other people using images of you, but you don't have the right to use other people's images of you yourself.

That's just crazy.

Unfortunately, I didn't see the image. The only time I went onto Facebook this week was on Tuesday, so I missed it.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[pearly]

So, you have the right to stop other people using images of you, but you don't have the right to use other people's images of you yourself.

That's just crazy.

Unfortunately, I didn't see the image. The only time I went onto Facebook this week was on Tuesday, so I missed it.

CaroLiza_fan

It's just copyright, it makes total sense. Just because you are in the photo does not automatically grant you the right to use it as you wish.

 

[WednesdayMarch]

It's just copyright, it makes total sense. Just because you are in the photo does not automatically grant you the right to use it as you wish.

Nope, once you're in the "public eye", ie on stage or screen, you pretty much lose all rights to your own image. It pays to be very nice to photographers (and videographers etc). I've never been asked to pay to use professional shots taken of me on stage or for publicity materials, which has given me some nice pictures for the album and decent profile shots for social media. I've also been shown some of the "outtakes" which were, frankly, horrendous. Nobody needs to see those, but if you offend a photographer, they can - and will provide the less flattering ones to the media...

 

[Tutto]

No, much simpler than that. The ISU's newly appointed promotors were looking too much for the TV rights, and nobody wanted to pay what was being asked for. So, creating a YouTube stream was a way for the ISU to save face. And spin it as a positive thing. That it means that more people than ever can watch.
But, as anybody who has ever tried to follow figure skating on YouTube before knows, the music companies are relentless in zapping the videos. And the result would be that if you weren't watching live, you were unlikely to be able to see things in their entirity.

So now, we are in a worse position than we ever were.


CaroLiza_fan

:thumbsup:

Do you think BBC might step in and show something of Euros (would they be allowed to do that)? I know they always did the highlights of Worlds but can't remember about Euros
My life is just not the same without FS on the tv :sad21:

 

[Miller]

:thumbsup:

Do you think BBC might step in and show something of Euros (would they be allowed to do that)? I know they always did the highlights of Worlds but can't remember about Euros
My life is just not the same without FS on the tv :sad21:

I think there's a fair chance. They showed Worlds live on the red button (Sky channel 981) last year, and the National Championships on their website for the first time, so they're definitely showing a bit more interest, probably not enough for GPs but possibly enough for Championships.

I also note there's no sign of French TV showing IDF (only next week). This is the ISU's list of countries where they've sold the rights (think there might have been 1 or 2 countries added since last week) - https://www.isu.org/figure-skating/...f-figure-skating-series-2019?templateParam=15. Could this be the final nail in the coffin of IDF - do the French federation get a cut of the broadcasting money? - I assume the ISU will be OK to broadcast as they can do so for JGPs.

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

:thumbsup:

Do you think BBC might step in and show something of Euros (would they be allowed to do that)? I know they always did the highlights of Worlds but can't remember about Euros
My life is just not the same without FS on the tv :sad21:

I think there's a fair chance. They showed Worlds live on the red button (Sky channel 981) last year, and the National Championships on their website for the first time, so they're definitely showing a bit more interest, probably not enough for GPs but possibly enough for Championships.

A year ago, my answer would have been a definite "no". But, given that the BBC are now broadcasting the British Championships and how well Lilah and Lewis are doing on the international sage, I think they might show Europeans. BUT, that is working on the assumption that the BBC still has the rights to Worlds. Because, even if the ISU are desperate to get somebody to buy the rights, I can't see them selling the rights for the Senior Majors individually.

I also note there's no sign of French TV showing IDF (only next week). This is the ISU's list of countries where they've sold the rights (think there might have been 1 or 2 countries added since last week) - https://www.isu.org/figure-skating/...f-figure-skating-series-2019?templateParam=15. Could this be the final nail in the coffin of IDF - do the French federation get a cut of the broadcasting money? - I assume the ISU will be OK to broadcast as they can do so for JGPs.

The French GP has been on shaky ground for quite a few years now, even before they lost their title sponsor. So, if it was relying on TV money to plug the gap since then, I would say it would take a miracle for it to remain on the calendar. And especially now that there is genuine competition for the right to hold the second GP in Europe. Finland did such a good job when they stood in for the Cup Of China last year that I don't think too many people would be upset if they took over the French slot.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

CaroLiza_fan

 

[DenissVFan]

I wonder if ISU could get Ted to commentate the GPF since it'll be held together with the JGPF.