Evgenia Medvedeva | Page 908 | Golden Skate

Evgenia Medvedeva

Do you really think that is great if she works alone? I don't think so..
Why not ? Yuzu does it to and Javier too or am I wrong? I mean if he checks in with her via Skype ect. Than I don't find anything wrong with it . She isn't going to euros so yes I think the month may have been also good for her health? Cause since she ìs going easier than before RusNats her back can heal more now? We know she had back pains at RusNats, she even said it to Brian in training. So mabye it was decided to give her time to heal time to spend with her family while Brian is occupied with Javier and yuzu and kaetlyn?
 
Why not ? Yuzu does it to and Javier too or am I wrong? I mean if he checks in with her via Skype ect. Than I don't find anything wrong with it . She isn't going to euros so yes I think the month may have been also good for her health? Cause since she ìs going easier than before RusNats her back can heal more now? We know she had back pains at RusNats, she even said it to Brian in training. So mabye it was decided to give her time to heal time to spend with her family while Brian is occupied with Javier and yuzu and kaetlyn?

Maybe you are right. :thumbsup: She has time to work and she needs to rest. That is also good for her if she is with her old friends in Russia. :)
 
Maybe you are right. :thumbsup: She has time to work and she needs to rest. That is also good for her if she is with her old friends in Russia. :)

Also, she is skating at CKSA. With skaters that she is familiar with. She is very friendly with Samarin and I'm sure his coach is there to offer assistance if Zhenya needed it. Emotionally I think this mini break has probably been the best rest she has had in years.
 
Do you really think that is great if she works alone? I don't think so..

That’s not quite what I said. I think it’s great that she’s able to work alone now, rather than needing a coach to be with her and structure ever single minute of her time; I also think that having a break, at home, is probably good for her. Whether it’s ideal for her, I can’t say. None of us know her training objectives right now, or when she’ll next compete. We do know that Brian is currently in Korea with Jun. Canadian Nationals is next week. US Nationals and Euros are the week after. That means all of the coaches are busy and ice time is probably limited. Tracy will be with Jason at US Nats. Brian will be with Javi at Euros. We don’t know what drove the decision for Zhenya to stay in Russia, but I think we need to accept that she and her team made what they feel is the best decision for her. And honestly, based on her social media she seems to be training well and enjoying her time there, and that’s whats important.
 
So in the interview with TSL they asked Misha about the OCS program. It starts at 6:50.

He says: David does high skill level programs and you have to be high crafted skater to do them. Evgenia needs more time.

Do you think that is the case between Evgenia and David's style of choreography? Is it implying that you need to be Yuna Kim level to skate to his work? He also did programs for Rika and Mai Mihara.

I agree that Evgenia needs more time to develop her skating skills, but I still feel that she and David are not a match and the music was not right for a competitive program - even 2 years from now. I also think it was a smart answer to that sort of question too from Misha's end.
 
So in the interview with TSL they asked Misha about the OCS program. It starts at 6:50.

He says: David does high skill level programs and you have to be high crafted skater to do them. Evgenia needs more time.

Do you think that is the case between Evgenia and David's style of choreography? Is it implying that you need to be Yuna Kim level to skate to his work? He also did programs for Rika and Mai Mihara.

I agree that Evgenia needs more time to develop her skating skills, but I still feel that she and David are not a match and the music was not right for a competitive program - even 2 years from now. I also think it was a smart answer to that sort of question too from Misha's end.

I don't agree with it. I liked the SP better than the LP, but it clearly didn't work for whatever reason. However, that reason was by no means Evgenia not being up to the challenge.
 
I don't agree with it. I liked the SP better than the LP, but it clearly didn't work for whatever reason. However, that reason was by no means Evgenia not being up to the challenge.

^ I think so, too - remember how she performed it during the Test Skates - it was really lovely!

I think her performance at SCI created a mental barrier to performing OCS.
 
So in the interview with TSL they asked Misha about the OCS program. It starts at 6:50.

He says: David does high skill level programs and you have to be high crafted skater to do them. Evgenia needs more time.

Do you think that is the case between Evgenia and David's style of choreography? Is it implying that you need to be Yuna Kim level to skate to his work? He also did programs for Rika and Mai Mihara.

I agree that Evgenia needs more time to develop her skating skills, but I still feel that she and David are not a match and the music was not right for a competitive program - even 2 years from now. I also think it was a smart answer to that sort of question too from Misha's end.
I agree with you on every aspect. I, too, feel that Evgenia and David are not a match, well, at least it was definitely the case in OCS. I remember I had a feeling that David somehow saw Evgenia as a second Yuna (judging from his interviews), but they are two completely different people and skaters. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other, and vice versa. Perhaps, they needed more time together. While Misha, knowing Evgenia well, was able to capture 'the old Zhenya' but also a mature one. And yes, his answer was very smart.
 
I took Micha’s answer to mean that the short program was too ambitious and that’s why Evgenia wasn’t ready. David has provided programs at all levels. Her FS also ambitious in its own way, when it’s well executed it is great but when it’s not the tense seduction of the beginning kind of feels like it goes nowhere. In my opinion, both OCS and Libertango do require more interpretation than Evgenia is giving.

This is not a knock on her skills. From what we have seen in videos, Eteri was always telling Evgenia how to feel, how to look, where exactly to place her hands, basically micromanaging the choreography. So I think Evgenia is learning a different way of performing and interpreting the music. Add in to her technical struggles. Add in the mental struggles of learning how to carry on performing after a mistake when you’ve been perfect for two seasons.

It’s too soon to say whether David Wilson will become THE choreographer for Evgenia but I think the hate against him is also premature.
 
I agree with you on every aspect. I, too, feel that Evgenia and David are not a match, well, at least it was definitely the case in OCS. I remember I had a feeling that David somehow saw Evgenia as a second Yuna (judging from his interviews), but they are two completely different people and skaters. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for the other, and vice versa. Perhaps, they needed more time together. While Misha, knowing Evgenia well, was able to capture 'the old Zhenya' but also a mature one. And yes, his answer was very smart.

I feel like people are taking David’s comments re: Yuna out of context. He and Brian said they would use a similar approach like they did with Yuna. That’s only because the similarities of a female foreign skater with talent and lots of scrutiny/pressure. Obviously they know that every skater is different (Yuzu and Javi couldn’t be more different), the extrapolation some people have made to insinuate that it means they are molding her into another Yuna is an exaggeration.

Yuna was very shy and guarded, and her close relationship with David was based on a lot of different factors but mostly trust built up over the years. That’s why their relationship was so special and continued after she left TCC. I can understand why people would think he would be eager for another young ingenue but I don’t see him having that kind of relationship with Evgenia. Mostly because I would LOVE for her to get a Shae Lynn or Lori Nichol program. You can tell when Lori Nichol is inspired by a skater or skaters so I feel like she would come up with something great
 
So in the interview with TSL they asked Misha about the OCS program. It starts at 6:50.

He says: David does high skill level programs and you have to be high crafted skater to do them. Evgenia needs more time.

Do you think that is the case between Evgenia and David's style of choreography? Is it implying that you need to be Yuna Kim level to skate to his work? He also did programs for Rika and Mai Mihara.

I agree that Evgenia needs more time to develop her skating skills, but I still feel that she and David are not a match and the music was not right for a competitive program - even 2 years from now. I also think it was a smart answer to that sort of question too from Misha's end.

I think he didn't want to be rude with other choreographers.

David-Evgenia could work but they need time to understand each other, not only Evgenia but David too. I can see him working again on her future programs given the fact he works closely with the Cricket Club. I'd also like to see more Misha Ge programs for Evgenia though.
 
So in the interview with TSL they asked Misha about the OCS program. It starts at 6:50.

He says: David does high skill level programs and you have to be high crafted skater to do them. Evgenia needs more time.

Do you think that is the case between Evgenia and David's style of choreography? Is it implying that you need to be Yuna Kim level to skate to his work? He also did programs for Rika and Mai Mihara.

I agree that Evgenia needs more time to develop her skating skills, but I still feel that she and David are not a match and the music was not right for a competitive program - even 2 years from now. I also think it was a smart answer to that sort of question too from Misha's end.

I disagree with the idea that you need to be Yuna Kim to skate David's choreography. Yuzuru only works with David for exhibitions, it didn't work out with David doing competitive programs for him. David seems to have strong ideas or visions for what he thinks programs should be like, instead of making the program based on what the skater wants/feels. In this case, it didn't work out, because it was too ambitious for Zhenya, but also bad luck with how Zhenya ended up not being able to skate it clean.
 
It’s too soon to say whether David Wilson will become THE choreographer for Evgenia but I think the hate against him is also premature.

I agree with you. In a TSL interview with David a few years ago, he said that the best work with choreography usually came after two or three years of work together.
Yes we can say that Misha has done a better job choreographing Zhenya's program than David, but we have to remember that they have known each other for years! Also the gap between old Zhenya and new Zhenya is much smaller in Tosca than in OCS, that's why Misha thinks, and we can all agree, that maybe it was too soon for OCS.

I'm not saying that Zhenya needs to keep David for next season: if she feels she wants to try a new choreographer I would understand. I think it'll depend on the relationship that David and Zhenya have developped during this year.

By the way, do you think TSL will end up interviewing Zhenya? In the past they've done interviews with Brian, Tracy, David, Sandra Bezic, and now Misha.
 
I agree with you. In a TSL interview with David a few years ago, he said that the best work with choreography usually came after two or three years of work together.
Yes we can say that Misha has done a better job choreographing Zhenya's program than David, but we have to remember that they have known each other for years! Also the gap between old Zhenya and new Zhenya is much smaller in Tosca than in OCS, that's why Misha thinks, and we can all agree, that maybe it was too soon for OCS.

I'm not saying that Zhenya needs to keep David for next season: if she feels she wants to try a new choreographer I would understand. I think it'll depend on the relationship that David and Zhenya have developped during this year.

By the way, do you think TSL will end up interviewing Zhenya? In the past they've done interviews with Brian, Tracy, David, Sandra Bezic, and now Misha.

I don’t think Evgenia will be on TSL anytime soon. The only TCC skater that has been on is Javi and that was when he was still dating Miki Ando so it was mostly about their relationship. I feel like Brian has been so run down with interviews this season, if he doesn’t encourage social media he will probably not encourage her to talk to TSL. I can’t see her wanting to do it, but possibly later? Idk

I don’t remember Tracy’s interview very well but I loved Sandra’s, Dylan and Luba, and Lisa McKinnon. And then Michelle Kwan’s interview where she was basically like how do you remember these random stats about me, you have no life (she didn’t say it like that but that’s the impression I got lol)
 
I don’t think Wilson’s choreography is "too high level", at least not currently. His programs just don't do it anymore. The music cuts used for the tango LP were very underwhelming for what a tango could be. Look at Papadakis / Cizeron, Miyahara, or Kostornaia's tangoes. Those are excellent tango programs.

I'm beginning to think Wilson is the type of choreographer that a skater needs to be able to match to, rather than the type of choreographer that will match to a skater (Shae Lynn Bourne).
 
I don’t think Evgenia will be on TSL anytime soon. The only TCC skater that has been on is Javi and that was when he was still dating Miki Ando so it was mostly about their relationship. I feel like Brian has been so run down with interviews this season, if he doesn’t encourage social media he will probably not encourage her to talk to TSL. I can’t see her wanting to do it, but possibly later? Idk

I don’t remember Tracy’s interview very well but I loved Sandra’s, Dylan and Luba, and Lisa McKinnon. And then Michelle Kwan’s interview where she was basically like how do you remember these random stats about me, you have no life (she didn’t say it like that but that’s the impression I got lol)

Yes, not anytime soon, but maybe in a few years.
 
I think two things can be true at the same time, or even more than two:
1. David’s best days as a choreographer seem to be behind him and Zhenya would be better served working with others.
2. David and Zhenya need more time working together in order to create something truly epic.
3. In the midst of so many changes (country, coach, technique, etc.), the time-crunch due to starting the season a bit later, and all the other mayhem of the year, Zhenya just wasn’t in a place where she was able to learn an entirely new performance style. (Though if you ignore the flip error, her SP at Skate Canada is actually eminently rewatchable.)

(Also, while David is usually cited as being wholly responsible for OCS, Sandra Bezic was also involved and was the one who was supposed to be brought back for choreography adjustments and refinement.)

As a general rule, I find David’s programmes... not especially sharp or interesting at this point. I do think he’s had some legitimate moments of genius, but he’s not responsible for all of Yuna’s best programmes — Tom Dickson choreographed Roxanne, for example. (Dickson is one of the most under-appreciated choreographers out there.) Even the best of David’s work doesn’t move me so much because of absolutely genius choreographic details but because of the level of performance and expression by those skating the programmes. Danse Macabre is a classic and also wouldn’t have worked unless Yuna was skating it, in my opinion.

There are advantages to using David — he’s easily accessible, making choreographic refinement and fine-tuning over the season easy. Skaters at the TCC likely have a chance to interact with him a fair amount (and he gets to observe them skating), which helps ease the process of learning each other’s strengths and weaknesses. Whenever I’ve seen or read an interview with David, he’s come across as a sweet, thoughtful guy who just wants to do right by those he designs programmes for, so I have nothing against him personally. And now for the heavy, clunking buuuuuuut: but tango should file for a restraining order against him (it is... not his genre); but I think that while he’s a solid/safe/stable choice for a choreographer, he’s not the most innovative or interesting at this moment and there are easily-accessible choreographers is immeasurable talent nearly as close to TCC as David. At worst, I find most of David’s work unremarkable/bland but not actually bad, and at best... leaving aside his work with Yuna, his high points aren’t as high as Dickson’s or Buttle’s, for example, but he hasn’t yet created an abomination programme.

I do think Wilson was the worst choice possible for this particular season, as the man has no tango gene and he’s also the epitome of the “North American style” in many respects, certainly synonymous with it. This was the season to do something really weird so that people couldn’t be sure of whether it was the programme or the change in technique that was making them feel as though this wasn’t the same Med. When you know that’s going to be the narrative — do something on the level of JUUUULLLLIIIIEEET to sow chaos and close off the “typical empty American choreo” line before it can begin. It may be a dumpster fire on ice, but a dumpster fire is better than SCREECHY UNTANGO cuts. (The free grew on me, to be honest, but it always felt like it was two-thirds of a programme and not a complete work. It wasn’t unique enough to be interesting despite the flaws in choreo and the music edits were lousy enough to make it outright “not... necessarily bad, but definitely not good?” instead of just forgettable.)

Dickson is one of the masters of multi-dimensional movement. Maybe it’s the dance training and doing choreo myself, but his use of space always impresses me, and that’s an aspect of performance I think Medvedeva needs to develop. (Due to having the same layout for so many years, her elements were placed in the same spot year after year, the transitions in and out were pretty much locked in, etc.) Med’s also got those longer limbs and the height to create interesting dynamics by taking advantage of her ability to shrink and fill vertical and horizontal space. Shae-Lynn Bourne is everybody’s first pick for a quirky/fun/memorable programme. Misha... is also quirky, but he and Med are friends, so I trust him to adjust his zaniness setting to match her. I think Jeff Buttle is criminally underrated. And David... can be counted on to never give you a bad programme, but maybe not to deliver you a breakthrough one. There are things I like about Danny G., but his creative vocabulary is exhausted from doing so many programmes per season and what was once novel and refreshing has become “ah, yes, this trope again today.”

One of my issues with David’s choreography is how much it relies on a skater having almost 6.0-style deportment. Which I don’t think Zhenya has, but I want to be very clear: I don’t think that’s a sin or something I mean as a complaint. What initially interested me about Zhenya was the fact that she was coltish and engaging but not a “baby ballerina” or adopting the airs of one. There was a refreshingly modern element to her skating. But David’s choreo is built on the assumption that you’re working with someone like Yuna, which doesn’t bring out the best in Zhenya, at least in my opinion.

Despite my opinions on the tango, I do think it was a good step forward. It was new. It wasn’t a masterpiece of movement and music, but I began to see new areas of strength/concepts to explore in terms of Zhenya’s development as an artist and a skater. I’d still call Dickson, though. His programmes are absolutely bonkers in terms of transitional content, so no complaints about “generic American style, where are my transitions.” ;)
 
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