Gracie Gold opens up about body standards | Page 5 | Golden Skate

Gracie Gold opens up about body standards

1200kcal is WAY too little. Training several hours almost every day and consuming even less than the basic metabolic rate will result in weight loss for sure. Back in my skating days I ate approximately 2000-2500 kcal and maintained a weight of 117lbs at 5'7''. I was in "top shape" back than, had enough energy to train and do school work and didn't habe to starve myself. An intake as low as 1200 would put you into "starvation mode" sooner or later. When the body doesn't get enough energy for a long time, the metabolism slows down. Women lose their periods, which causes bone density loss in the long term and are cold and tired all the time. They are at risk of developing stress fractures. Not what you want when you are a young female figure skater...
 
An intake as low as 1200 would put you into "starvation mode" sooner or later. When the body doesn't get enough energy for a long time, the metabolism slows down. Women lose their periods, which causes bone density loss in the long term and are cold and tired all the time. They are at risk of developing stress fractures. Not what you want when you are a young female figure skater...

Which reminds me... There was this interview with Kiira Korpi where she talked about how she was scared of putting on weight and how that could affect her jumps so she ended up undereating (repeatedly during her career). Outwardly, she was looking fit and not "too skinny" but she just wasn't giving her body enough energy to recover properly.
 
This talk about 1200 calories per day being perfectly acceptable for an athlete seems fitting with the recent news about Julia Lip.
 
Just to clarify, we are talking about consuming 1200 calories net exercise, correct? Because I bet that figure skaters are burning 300-400 calories an hour skating and they do, what, 3-4 sessions a day? Plus the calories burned doing off ice (yoga, pilates, circuits, cardio) exercises.
 
Just to clarify, we are talking about consuming 1200 calories net exercise, correct? Because I bet that figure skaters are burning 300-400 calories an hour skating and they do, what, 3-4 sessions a day? Plus the calories burned doing off ice (yoga, pilates, circuits, cardio) exercises.

I think someone was saying it's okay if an athlete eats 1200 calories per day, even with exercise. It was justified with nonsense like, look at Yuna's skinny arms versus Joannie's big arms, or something.

Lo and behold, not a few months later, figure skating has another high profile anorexia victim.
 
This talk about 1200 calories per day being perfectly acceptable for an athlete seems fitting with the recent news about Julia Lip.

Yeah hearing someone say an athelete of any kind should consume that much is appalling. Their athletes not Barbie doll super models...
 
I don´t think someone was saying that this was acceptable, the person was saying that an article claimed that Yuna did that. Regardless it being healthy or not, I think it's not physically possible, so I don´t think Yuna was doing it, no matter what the article says.
 
I just hope people would stop using "looking fit" as synonymous/interchangeable with "being thin" or "has lost weight". Similarly, stop saying that somebody whose body has been maturing and gaining muscle and some curves is "fat" and "lazy" and "obviously not training hard". You see it a lot around here and everywhere, and I bet most of the people making moralizing "she's obviously not training hard" comments don't have accurate info about the actual training process, strength-to-weight ratio, injury status etc. in each case. They're just judging whether somebody LOOKS the "right" kind of slim.

it's a society-wide thing, of course. I've lost track of how often I've heard about some woman who is suffering from a chronic illness, feeling very sick, having clumps of her hair fall out etc, and she gets told "You look great! Have you lost weight?" over and over again by friends and other people in their life...

Really, before making a comment about ANYBODY's body -- whether online or IRL, whether about Gracie or about someone in your life -- why not take a second and ask yourself "if I later on found out that this person is dealing with an eating disorder or some other sensitive health issue, would I stand behind the comment I'm about to make or would I want to take it back?" Because YOU NEVER KNOW (until somebody chooses to tell you, but do you think they feel comfortable telling you sensitive things about their health and their body if you're going around judging other people's bodies?)
 
I just hope people would stop using "looking fit" as synonymous/interchangeable with "being thin" or "has lost weight". Similarly, stop saying that somebody whose body has been maturing and gaining muscle and some curves is "fat" and "lazy" and "obviously not training hard". You see it a lot around here and everywhere, and I bet most of the people making moralizing "she's obviously not training hard" comments don't have accurate info about the actual training process, strength-to-weight ratio, injury status etc. in each case. They're just judging whether somebody LOOKS the "right" kind of slim.

it's a society-wide thing, of course. I've lost track of how often I've heard about some woman who is suffering from a chronic illness, feeling very sick, having clumps of her hair fall out etc, and she gets told "You look great! Have you lost weight?" over and over again by friends and other people in their life...

Really, before making a comment about ANYBODY's body -- whether online or IRL, whether about Gracie or about someone in your life -- why not take a second and ask yourself "if I later on found out that this person is dealing with an eating disorder or some other sensitive health issue, would I stand behind the comment I'm about to make or would I want to take it back?" Because YOU NEVER KNOW (until somebody chooses to tell you, but do you think they feel comfortable telling you sensitive things about their health and their body if you're going around judging other people's bodies?)

This x 1,000,000. Thank you for such a thoughtful post.
 
With all this talk about weight as it relates to skating and jumps, I just keep thinking of Fatty Arbuckle. He was an American silent film actor, comedian, director, and screenwriter, also a mentor for Charlie Chaplin and others. He was, as his name implies, fat. However, he was also very well known for being flexible and for doing pratfalls that were acrobatic in nature. I'm not here to challenge the experts on weight as an important factor for jumps --especially since FS jumps are more than what Mr. Arbuckle performed. But, I also keep thinking that it isn't beyond the realm of possibility for a skater to be "overweight" for jumps and still be able to do them. I completely believe in looking at what a skater is actually doing and not looking at his/her weight as evidence of training habits, etc.

So, I guess I'm mostly just supporting what nimi said.
 
I just hope people would stop using "looking fit" as synonymous/interchangeable with "being thin" or "has lost weight". Similarly, stop saying that somebody whose body has been maturing and gaining muscle and some curves is "fat" and "lazy" and "obviously not training hard". You see it a lot around here and everywhere, and I bet most of the people making moralizing "she's obviously not training hard" comments don't have accurate info about the actual training process, strength-to-weight ratio, injury status etc. in each case. They're just judging whether somebody LOOKS the "right" kind of slim.

it's a society-wide thing, of course. I've lost track of how often I've heard about some woman who is suffering from a chronic illness, feeling very sick, having clumps of her hair fall out etc, and she gets told "You look great! Have you lost weight?" over and over again by friends and other people in their life...

Really, before making a comment about ANYBODY's body -- whether online or IRL, whether about Gracie or about someone in your life -- why not take a second and ask yourself "if I later on found out that this person is dealing with an eating disorder or some other sensitive health issue, would I stand behind the comment I'm about to make or would I want to take it back?" Because YOU NEVER KNOW (until somebody chooses to tell you, but do you think they feel comfortable telling you sensitive things about their health and their body if you're going around judging other people's bodies?)

This is so true! A couple years ago I lost a ton of weight due to an illness and everyone was like Oh my goodness you've been working out... When in reality I was working out before the illness and had stopped after. My bodies metabolism came to a full stop and I gained some weight back which My doctor said I needed to do, and everyone was like "want to come work out with me?" None of them had knowledge of what was really going on but they all assumed I was working out/ wasn't working out and sometimes mad comments about how some people are lazy and thats why they gain weight... people need to chill with their percetion and assumption about everyone elses lives and situation.
 
http://www.cbc.ca/listen/shows/as-it-happens/segment/13865703

Jenny Kirk on the news about Yulia.

I'm at work so I can't listen to it, but there's probably some good insight here.
A link to a full transcript. You have to scroll down a bit.
http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens...29-2017-episode-transcript-1.4268882#segment2

JD: Figure skater Yulia Lipnitskaya has retired at the age of 19. Ms. Lipnitskaya has been a darling of the figure skating world. She won gold with the Russians in the team event at the 2014 Olympics in Sochi when she was 15-years-old, making her the youngest skating champion in nearly 80 years. Yesterday, Ms. Lipnitskaya’s mother announced that her daughter would be retiring from the sport, after undergoing three months of treatment for anorexia. Jenny Kirk is an American figure skating coach who struggled with eating disorders when she was an athlete herself. We reached Ms. Kirk in Boston.

SB: Ms. Kirk, what was it like to hear that Yulia has retired from figure skating?

.....
Jenny spoke at length.
It is an interesting read, that can be found at the link above.
 
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http://www.cbc.ca/listen/shows/as-it-happens/segment/13865703

Jenny Kirk on the news about Yulia.

I'm at work so I can't listen to it, but there's probably some good insight here.

I listened to it, and it's shocking, honestly. But in other ways, it's not so shocking, unfortunately.

...

Interviewer: You talk about rumblings and the suspicion that something was going on. Was it well-known that Julia was struggling with anorexia?

Jenny: I don't think it was well-known, but we could tell there was something upsetting her. She didn't seem happy often during her performances, and in the kiss-and-cry. The skating world is a small community. When someone is struggling with something, you hear rumors. Unfortunately, the rumor of an eating disorder is common. But I don't think anyone perhaps knew how serious it was.

Jenny says that on Champions on Ice, about 80% of the skaters had disordered eating.

Interviewer: How common are eating disorders among figure skaters, from what you know?

Jenny: Unfortunately, incredibly common. Just in my history, in being with the sport, there was 2 years where I toured with Champions on Ice, here in the United States, a tour that is no longer active. But it was a tour that had the top skaters both from here in the US, and also internationally. I would say about 80% of the skaters on tour had some sort of disordered eating.

Interviewer: 80 percent??

Jenny: Yes, and not a full-blown eating disorder. Myself included.


This is the quote I've seen in newspapers.

Interviewer: You have been quite vocal though, talking about your own experiences, with an eating disorder. Can you explain how it started for you?

Jenny: I was always very thin. It wasn't a situation where someone told me to lose weight. But obviously it was message I had been given from a young age. One of my coaches would have us all line up, in front of everybody, in the middle of the skating lobby, and write it down every week, in a notebook. I was given the message that the number is important. But I wasn't achieving the results on the ice that I thought I should. My weight was something I felt like I could control. It started out in a benign way, where I wanted work out more, watch what I eat, be a little bit more healthy. Suddenly, it became the one thing that I felt I could control. .

...
Jenny: The most insidious part of eating disorders, or anybody who has gone on an extreme diet, is that, at first, you receive a lot of compliments. ... I blamed myself. I thought that if I could just be skinnier, I'd be able to get the results back.


Jenny says there needs to not be a stigma of eating disorders, and skaters should feel comfortable just saying that they're worried they have disordered eating, and get help.

Interviewer: What message would you have for people watching what's going on with Julia and wondering how the sport needs to change?

Jenny: The biggest thing is that people need to talk about what's going on.
...
Interviewer: When you say "let's talk about it"-- do you put the responsibility on coaches, on team leaders, on sponsors? Who needs to take responsibility?

Jenny: I think everybody.

Jenny's coaches actually knew she had an eating disorder, and told her to put off treatment until the Olympics were over. :palmf:


Interviewer: Your coaches knew?? The other skaters and your coaches knew what was going on?

Jenny: Yes.

Interviewer: Nobody tried to stop it?

Jenny: No, I was actually told to wait until after the Olympic season to get treatment.


...

Please go to the original link to read all that Jenny had to say
 
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My daughter recently came to the conclusion not she is not going to be an elite skater and is backing off a bit so she has time for other things. I was a bit sad at first (but supportive, because it is her thing not mine). Now, I'm thinking maybe it is a really wonderful thing with the eating disorders and the concussions and the money I don't have to spend on it...
 
I think "fitness," meaning being thin, in skating is 90% aesthetics and 10%--or less--anything to do with skating/jumping ability. Men are taller and heavier but better jumpers than women. It has more to do with muscle strength than weight. I know there are those that disagree--even Jenny assumes smaller bodies rotate better. But none of this has any scientific back-up. It is all anecdotal. And for every skater that loses her jumps when she grows taller and fills out, there are others who do just fine in women's bodies--Ashley Wagner, Michelle Kwan, Carolina Kostner, Shizuka Arakawa, to name a few.
 
And for every skater that loses her jumps when she grows taller and fills out, there are others who do just fine in women's bodies--Ashley Wagner, Michelle Kwan, Carolina Kostner, Shizuka Arakawa, to name a few.

Those women all have women's bodies as adults, but they are also smaller than the average adult woman, especially Kwan and Wagner who are on the shorter side of average.

The statistics would look very different if you look at all elite skaters who competed as seniors internationally, or nationally in countries where skating as popular, vs. looking at all skaters who start training early and master jumps up to double lutz, to see how many of the latter group ever land a clean double axel or triple jump let alone reach elite levels or keep those jumps by age 18 or 20.
 
Those women all have women's bodies as adults, but they are also smaller than the average adult woman, especially Kwan and Wagner who are on the shorter side of average.

The statistics would look very different if you look at all elite skaters who competed as seniors internationally, or nationally in countries where skating as popular, vs. looking at all skaters who start training early and master jumps up to double lutz, to see how many of the latter group ever land a clean double axel or triple jump let alone reach elite levels or keep those jumps by age 18 or 20.

This.

Any sport is going to self-select for some sort of biological qualities that gives its athletes an advantage. Sure, Michael Phelps trains his butt off, but his body is also just crazy: http://gawker.com/5038018/michael-phelps-freakish-physique-explained

If you were to pick and choose genetics for the perfect human swimmer, it would look like Michael Phelps.

We aren't going to see any 6-foot tall ladies winning Olympic medals in figure skating.

Weight, of course, is much more complicated than the majority of other aspects of the human body, in that it is partly biological and partly due to lifestyle choices. If you're genetically-predisposed to being overweight (but nothing as dramatic as, say, a glandular problem or something), diet and exercise will keep you fit and trim. But you're going to have to work harder than someone genetically pre-disposed to being thin, and the person who is genetically pre-disposed to being thin, if they make the same healthy lifestyle choices you do, will probably have an advantage over you in sports where smaller is better.

It's even more complicated in a sport like figure skating, where pre-pubescent bodies happen to be better built for certain elements. Then once a person begins growing into whatever their genes decide they're going to be, there are going to be problems.

It does make one think that maybe senior competition should start at 18. Rather than allowing the sport to self-select its best candidates after they've already been presented to the entire world as one of the best of the best (like Yulia in Sochi), let them figure out as juniors, when the stakes are lower, whether or not they should or could make a career out of figure skating, based in part on what their bodies are telling them.

If Yulia had not been able to skate at the senior level until she was 18, it's possible she would've quit the sport at 16 or 17 when her jumps began to fail her, decided it wasn't worth it. She would've picked up other hobbies, focused on something else, and maybe even still love figure skating as a fun hobby instead of a career. She wouldn't have had the Sochi success, or faced the pressure, or become an international superstar. But she might also be a much happier and healthier human being.

(I really got going on a tangent there.)
 
Has anyone gone back and looked at how Gracie's build has changed several times in her career? Before Frank Carrol she had a thicker muscular build and bigger jumps and more power, under Carrol she was much smaller and so were her jumps. I wouldn't be shocked if her current build was due to less soul cycle and more Ouriashev style off ice training. Has anyone thought that maybe she is trying to bring back the power?
 
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