Grammar question

[dutchherder]

I would say that written expression is about the same. Reading comprehension appears to be about the same, but reading speed has slowed quite a bit. I think this might have something to do with the Internet because webpages have small blocks of text intended to be gobbled up quickly. When students encounter larger blocks of text (in a book, for example), they seem to slow down, perhaps to give themselves the break they're used to getting? Oral expression has become much worse, in my opinion. Kids don't have conversations as much as they used to, particularly with adults. :disapp:

 

[megsk8z]

"Affect" and "effect" seem to be used interchangeably and it isn't right.

Another one I truly dislike is when a skater "looses." Um, you don't "loose," you
"lose." Or, occasional optimist that I am, to lose is a chance to get it right,

 

[iluvtodd]

I'm not ready to blame the internet for the decline of proper grammar, but I think that my students probably spend too much time watching shows of questionable quality (without parental supervision) on TV and playing video games instead of taking the time to read decent uplifting children's literature. I have a 4th grade student who is reasonably intelligent. She frustrates me because she persistently gives me writing that she just slaps together, despite my constant efforts to gently correct her. I just sense that her priorities are elsewhere. I'd hate to think about what she does at home, but I don't think there is much that goes on there educationally. Thank goodness most of my students seem to have a stronger work ethic than she does.

 

[Mathman]

Is "increasage" a word?

 

[Alsace]

Not according to Dictionary.com.

Adding -age was a popular thing in high school in the early '90s.

 

[SeaniBu]

All righty then, Let's see how the response to -

If meaning is understood, what difference does it make? Do I sound like a second grade "stinker?"

And being as I KNOW I am responsible for at least one or two "Loose" vs. "Lose." ETC.... I will say, Can the english language either make a rule and stick with it, teachers (of all sorts, including parents) SPEAK correctly or just drop it all together?

The "Lose" pronunciation is exactly the reason I stuck to pronouncing Tomato with a short "a" sound Although it does make some mad, but that is my point. You think it bothers you to hear Tomåto, try growing up having rules pushed down your throat and when it comes to spelling they always change and 2 different people can pronounce any word differently. Vowel consonant vowel my .....



btw, MM, it was CK that was my favorite girlfriend What are you doing in my dreams to know about Bunniie-chan anyway :agree:

Adding -age was a popular thing in high school in the early '90s.

And toward the end of the 80s for me. I had "styleage" and the girls were "hottage," at lunch we had "grubbage" and we did "druggage" -of course causing damage.:agree:

 

[Mathman]

Can the english language either make a rule and stick with it...?

No, no, it can't. That's the whole beauty and grandeur of the language.

English is a delightfully unruly hodge-podge of different linguistic influences. The Old English (basically German) was overlaid (overlain? ) with court French after the Norman conquest and also greatly impacted -- see, I can learn -- by scholarly Latin. The result was the most versatile, subtle, powerful and poetric mish-mash of a communications tool that we had ever seen -- Elizabethan English (it's been downhill ever since, LOL).

Plus in America, every immigrant group (there have been dozens) has had its say, not to mention the native peoples who were here already, and all the technical vocabulary necessary to talk about everything that has been invented since Elizabeth R's reign (Zamboni, for instance ).

So there are actually very few hard and fast "rules" in English, compared to other languages. There are just a lot of conventions that have developed over the years as we tried to follow the lead of the best speakers and writers among us (note, "best" not "most").

btw, MM, it was CK that was my favorite girlfriend. :

Ah. Caroline Kostner. Now I understand.

 

[Tonichelle]

the thing is, with me, you HAVE to have a good grasp of how to write and spell when you're active on a message board or any type of public internet forum. I may not be able to spell everything correctly, but I try to either find another word in its place, or I look it up anymore

why? because people need to be able to understand what I get across. If there's no puncuation and the thought just rambles on with bad spelling, chances are I'm not going to waste my time in reading the post. As a mod I have to read most of the posts so to make sure there isn't a guideline issue, but it's difficult when you can't understand.

Abbriviating everything doesn't help either. Considering a lot of people on this board are from other countries and may not speak perfect English and know only the 'rules' of the language it's just something I've taken on to help everyone out.

It's not something to give up on. I love learning the ins and outs. If you take the time it's actually NOT that hard to improve and even excell.

 

[dutchherder]

I agree 100% Tonichelle! I think there are several posters whose comments are taken the wrong way because their thoughts aren't articulated well. Then, they have to use five or six posts to explain themselves. Blech. I also agree with the abbreviations. Some posts are so packed full of them, I don't know who they're talking about anymore.

Also, as I tell my students, if you want to be taken seriously, you have to speak/write intelligently. After all, writing isn't about the writer; it's about the reader. If you aren't communicating, what the heck are you doing?

 

[Tonichelle]

If you aren't communicating, what the heck are you doing?

you've summed it up perfectly!

I'm always getting on my co-workers' (read manager and assistant manager) cases because they can't spell or just write well enough that I know what they heck they want me to do lol. It is SO frustrating! Everyone always says I'm the 'English major' so that explains it. But that isn't my major! I'm a Journalism and Public Communications major studying tv and film direction! You don't need a degree to understand how it works!

 

[SeaniBu]

I agree 100% Tonichelle! I think there are several posters whose comments are taken the wrong way because their thoughts aren't articulated well. Then, they have to use five or six posts to explain themselves. Blech. I also agree with the abbreviations. Some posts are so packed full of them, I don't know who they're talking about anymore.

I'm sorry.

If you aren't communicating, what the heck are you doing?

If you are going to do it, do it right?:agree:

 

[antmanb]

I agree 100% Tonichelle! I think there are several posters whose comments are taken the wrong way because their thoughts aren't articulated well. Then, they have to use five or six posts to explain themselves. Blech. I also agree with the abbreviations. Some posts are so packed full of them, I don't know who they're talking about anymore.

Also, as I tell my students, if you want to be taken seriously, you have to speak/write intelligently. After all, writing isn't about the writer; it's about the reader. If you aren't communicating, what the heck are you doing?

While i do agree with you, i feel i have to defend myself a little here because i know i'm guilty of sending posts with many mistakes in them. I tend to use internet forums and message boards as "light relief" from my real life job, a job where the precision of the words i draft are extremely important and conveying the correct meaning is paramount. I would never dream of sending anything out in my work life that i haven't proof read at least a couple of times. Contrast this with the way i post on here - i never proof read anything i right, or check for spelling errors. When i type i'm prone to transposing letters and do it all the time and never go back to correct.

If i had to proof read and use perfect english on the boards, like i do for my job, i'm not sure i'd partake as much. I tend to view posts on here like i do emails to friends or text messages to friends - the rules are relaxed and i'm not being judged. Of course i do get myself into trouble when people misinterpret what i say.

So i do agree with you and and tonichelle i'm just making excuses for myself!

Ant

 

[Grgranny]

I guess I am guilty of making judgments of incorrect spelling, etc. When I see mistakes, especially lots of spelling, etc. I immediately think you are 12 years old or less. The worst is the abbreviations and not capitilizing where needed. Is there an age limit on this board? I doubted it since I think I have seen several 12 year olds at one time or another.

One of the things people say around here is "You did good". My boss at the insurance office kept saying things like "you was". I tried to correct him as I knew he wanted to improve. I asked him first but it made him so nervous when he was talking to a customer that he had to quit.

 

[Mathman]

Ant, on the other hand, don't you have a friend whose emails are so well written that you look forward to hearing from that person just for the pleasure of reading them?

I am still in contact with Rgirl -- remember her? Rgirl is a professional writer, formerly a professional dancer, with degrees in sports medicine and sports nutrition. She used to make very long posts on Golden Skate which were so well thought out and so well presented that I used to scan the board every day just to see if she had posted anything.

 

[Mathman]

One of the things people say around here is "You did good".

Oh, that's terrible. Everybody knows it should be, "You done good."

 

[Grgranny]

I've been meaning to contact her. I really miss her. Wonder if she still even
reads any posts? I have been afraid that something happened to her and in a way was afraid I'd get really bad news from her. Guess I'll have to get on my horse and email her.

 

[Grgranny]

MM,

 

[Grgranny]

MM, why aren't you in school. Or is this a free hour?

 

[Grgranny]

Oops, that is what they say. You done good.

 

[antmanb]

Ant, on the other hand, don't you have a friend whose emails are so well written that you look forward to hearing from that person just for the pleasure of reading them?

I am still in contact with Rgirl -- remember her? Rgirl is a professional writer, formerly a professional dancer, with degrees in sports medicine and sports nutrition. She used to make very long posts on Golden Skate which were so well thought out and so well presented that I used to scan the board every day just to see if she had posted anything.

Absolutely i remember Rgirl and her posts - i remember many lengthy discussions with her and you're aboslutely right they were a pleasure to read (is there any chance she will be convinced to start writing here again?).

I do enjoy reading well written things and i should put more effort into checking my posts (having read back through the one i made earlier today i noticed i wrote "right" when i meant "write"! The shame! The trouble, for me, is that i don't see things on screen like i do on paper. I tend to self correct when reading things on the computer and it's not until i print something out on paper that i actually catch the mistakes.

In light of this thread i might start proof reading my posts (though i might no catch all the mistakes!

Ant