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Sotnikova didn't primarily win because of Alla. She primarily won because she delivered when it counted the most. She has an Olympic gold, Kim has an Olympic gold. Folks need to move on.
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How to hack COP for the Olympics season
- Thread starter OS
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Sotnikova didn't primarily win because of Alla. She primarily won because she delivered when it counted the most. She has an Olympic gold, Kim has an Olympic gold. Folks need to move on.
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- Mar 23, 2010
It no doubt helped though. That is why it is part of hacking the COP thread. Learning from pros from the past, to ensure everyone gets the same competitive edge. Sharing insights, tips that have proven to be effective. People study how battles have been won, this is no different.
As for everything else(this goes to others). You don't have to like my politics nor my humour (or lack of) but doesn't mean what I say have no value or isn't true. How about instead of accusing me of bashing the skaters, identify which point you have particular issues with it so at least allow me to defend it. I may even edit my post, who knows. My aim is to edutainment not to cause offence.
However, it is beyond ridiculous to expect me not bring Sochi when the topic is on the friggin Olympics. Deal with it. It won't be the first time or the last time, put me on ignore, I don't care. It is hardly bashing when everything I mentioned has happened. How is it bashing?
As for the COP 'shade' #5, I actually thought I was being rather practical. How else are you suppose to time waste for the 2nd half bonus? What other examples should I use? Do suggest an alternative example for timewasting, I am literally dying to know.
Here are a few more Hacks for the upcoming Olympics.
13. Land all your jumps consistently with difficult transitions in and out of them. (Suggested by CanadianSkaterGuy, modified slightly by me)
If you don't have the reputation. Try to go above and beyond what is necessary, so even if you do get that unfair technical call or stingy GOEs, the video evidence will present itself, while some folks here at GS and beyond will be your great advocate (and surely jumpamatron editor?). It will boost your next season reputation should you decide to go for it. If not, at least you can say you did what you came to do, too bad the judges are just not on your side.
14. Get your very own fluffy cuddly mascot tissue box.
It is THE designer item of the sport! Build those buzz factor and cuteness overload. (fluffy cuddly not prerequisite. Kovtun, you can bring a black leather punchkick bag)
It may not necessarily give you the extra points, but it will make you feel warm and cuddly inside at the time when you need it the most. Especially handy when you are most vulnerable and emotionally unstable at the Kiss and Cry and hopefully become your very own huggable lucky charm. Look how Pooh had helped Hanyu, Sailormoon cat for Zhenya. Spiderman for Boyang. Let's face it, we can all do with a bit of luck at the Olympics.
15. No reputation? No Agent? No PR?
Don't worry, you can still get the crowd on your side, and hopefully a few PCS extra points. Which surely helps you at the arena and cheer for you. Build a fan base, get involved on the social media. Make friends with your peers. Learn from Misha Ge, I personally think it did help his PCS a little. Learn English, Learn Korean, Learn Chinese (Beijing games coming up). Immerse yourself in the culture and politics and public speaking. Learn to be PR smart, study how/what NOT to say (PatrickChan press Pre-2014), then learn how/what to say (PatrickChan press Post-2015.) Ultimately, do not let it distract you from training and work on your consistency and your backloading. Focus on things that matter, but don't be careless about things you think don't matter. In summary, everything matters. The devil is in the details and your best line of defence in this political sport.
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- Nov 19, 2010
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I will in another thread. I have always had a theory on why he had undeserved bad press. They can't get him on ice...
I hope you haven't literally died yet. Figuratively, no problem.
If you want to benefit from the bonus by putting most or all of your jumps in the latter half of the program . . . easier said than done.
First, get busy with the double runthroughs, gym workouts, etc. to train your stamina/aerobic capacity to the max.
Second, don't waste time in the first half of the program. Use it productively. You've got three spins and a step sequence (plus a choreo sequence in the FS) to get into the program as well as jumps -- put most of those in the first half and work the GOEs by doing them when you're fresh instead of tired at the end.
Try to do it in a way that works with the music and program theme and looks like you're building up to a climax with the jumps, not just killing time waiting for a bonus.
Anything you can do in the first half that shows off your skating skills and music interpretation skills and performance skills that ties the program together in theme and movement continuity will help your program component scores. Choreograph that first half even more carefully than the second half, and choreography the two halves to make sense together, blending from one to the other, in that order.
If you have any special skills that don't fit into a standard element, show them off between elements.
Anything you can do while moving across the ice will be worth more than what you do standing still. But you might want to give your self two or three seconds standing or gliding on two feet with simple upper body choreo at the end of the first half of the freeskate, to catch your breath and catch your balance before launching into your jump display.
The OP is all about bashing against Russia and Medvedeva and this is so sad but i find this part kind of funny
For some reason the haters think that Shin Amano would be a nightmare for the russians, when it's the total opposite, in fact it would be a dream for them: 2016 Cup of China is the proof.
http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1617/gpchn2016/SEG004.HTM
https://s29.postimg.org/gl3atcsx3/shin_amano.png
I find this so sad for Adelina. She's so talented, one of the most artistic russian skater ever, her style, her spins were so unique, she was such a jewel back in the days when she was so young but still able to win Nationals, and that 2010-2011 season where she won everything at juniors including Worlds in Korea, then Sochi with the performance of her life.
She doesn't deserve this hate, same goes for Evgenia who worked so hard to get this position because for many years she wasn't considered as russian next top skater in juniors, and she beated hundreds of "potential next Yuna Kim".
For some reason the haters think that Shin Amano would be a nightmare for the russians, when it's the total opposite, in fact it would be a dream for them: 2016 Cup of China is the proof.
http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1617/gpchn2016/SEG004.HTM
https://s29.postimg.org/gl3atcsx3/shin_amano.png
I find this so sad for Adelina. She's so talented, one of the most artistic russian skater ever, her style, her spins were so unique, she was such a jewel back in the days when she was so young but still able to win Nationals, and that 2010-2011 season where she won everything at juniors including Worlds in Korea, then Sochi with the performance of her life.
She doesn't deserve this hate, same goes for Evgenia who worked so hard to get this position because for many years she wasn't considered as russian next top skater in juniors, and she beated hundreds of "potential next Yuna Kim".
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- Mar 23, 2010
Shin Amano has a Russian boss. Of course he is good for Russian
But I happen to think he is good for the sport as long as he is consistent and not selectively lenient.No need to be sorry for Adelina, she has tons of fans, the gold, the fame, the money and she get to train by the legendary Plushy. I am sure we will see her in Korea to make you proud.
Gkelly, as usual... you killed me. But as usuall, i liked it.
This is already a much better program than the many we saw. No ropes involved. Hope all the skaters take your advise. I very much looking forward to see how these 'most PCS in the first half + most TES in the 2nd half' programs will looks like.
I would love everyone follow these optimised format, and then perhaps finally COP can be scratched and start again. Or people will need to activate real accountability for things like coverage, speed, distance to separate from the formula skating. And of course the creative none standard skills on display, likely most in the first half.
(I hope you don't mind but I am copying your advise to the original Post, as the alter hack to GOOD approach for half way bonus)
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- Jan 25, 2013
Most skaters can't go clean with balanced programs - I highly doubt many of them are going to backload. You make it sound like backloading that kind of difficulty is a walk in the park.
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- Mar 23, 2010
Not at all, but people need to be trained for it. It is about reprioritising training, refocus efforts, and they need to act now. It will be interesting to see how many manage next season. Most I'd imagine should able to do it for the SP at least.
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- Jan 25, 2013
It's been ages since half-point bonus was given, and only a handful have even attempted it in the SP. It's not just physically tough but it's hard to focus mentally - in the SP there are only 3 jumping passes so backloading is incredibly risky because the skater has little time to "regroup" after an error nor do they have a ton of jumping passes to fix any error (e.g. a missed combo means they only get one chance to make up the 4 points). It's a lot easier to open with a combo and then if you make an error you have time to settle down and focus on rectifying it.
I think there are two groups of skaters who will go for extreme backloading:
*World-class medal contenders who have maxed out their content at approximately the same level as the other medal contenders and who are also blessed with the technique and stamina to execute that top content consistently on tired legs, without significant loss of quality/GOE, and not to get as tired as their competitors
*Skaters who have (at least temporarily) maxed out with lower jump content than their direct competitors, who can partially (but only partially) make up for easier jumps by executing those jumps in the bonus period.
Even before IJS gave explicit guaranteed rewards for doing jumps later, I would sometimes see junior ladies without triples save their double jumps for the end of the short program, while the skaters with triples put them at the beginning. And sometimes it paid off, if the triple girls missed their jumps even with fresh legs.
We might see the same strategy these days from some of the men without quads.
*World-class medal contenders who have maxed out their content at approximately the same level as the other medal contenders and who are also blessed with the technique and stamina to execute that top content consistently on tired legs, without significant loss of quality/GOE, and not to get as tired as their competitors
*Skaters who have (at least temporarily) maxed out with lower jump content than their direct competitors, who can partially (but only partially) make up for easier jumps by executing those jumps in the bonus period.
Even before IJS gave explicit guaranteed rewards for doing jumps later, I would sometimes see junior ladies without triples save their double jumps for the end of the short program, while the skaters with triples put them at the beginning. And sometimes it paid off, if the triple girls missed their jumps even with fresh legs.
We might see the same strategy these days from some of the men without quads.
Shin Amano has a Russian boss. Of course he is good for Russian
No need to be sorry for Adelina, she has tons of fans, the gold, the fame, the money and she get to train by the legendary Plushy. I am sure we will see her in Korea to make you proud.
I don't think there will be any difference on the long term from what we saw at Cup of China or again Worlds 2015, and other competitions with him as a technical specialist where the russians won several medals.
He's prone to call everything, the thing is the russians don't struggle that much with underrotations, or edge,... and on top of that usually they are still more consistent than the rest of the field so when you have your combo < but the rest of the program clean, the score is still huge. On the other hand when you struggle a lot with these things or you have some underrotations plus you fall sometimes, that's how those scores goes down quickly and that's what happened at Cup of China.
http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1617/gpchn2016/gpchn2016_Ladies_FS_Scores.pdf
It's a long process, even Eteri managed to get this level because they learnt a lot from the past experiences, other coaches don't have any idea of how to approach this so for them it's easier to complain and hoping for a change of the rule.
For instance Elizabet Tursynbaeva was coached by many russian coaches in the past (including Eteri Tutberidze), but she's still struggling with backloading programs and she can't jump with the arms at all.
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- Mar 23, 2010
Well perhaps people thought a good program shouldn't be about skating for points, and that backloading should negatively affect the PCS, and it is more important to realised a well balanced program, so the effort are just not worth it. However now that has proven to be untrue, it will be interesting to see how that affect their strategy going forward.
It is definitely risky, so it will be really interesting to who has the hunger for it and the imaginative ways to go about it. Kaetylyn currently has 2 of her jump passes in the 1st half, but if she moves them to the 2nd half and goes clean, she can win the SP quite easily. Not easy easy, but it is the Olympics and it isn't supposed to be easy.
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Poor Elena been Amanoed. Has Amano ever judged Evegenia or other Russian top ladies? (Actually, is there a list of skaters who has been Amanoed? Mao, Mirai will be among them.)
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I think that this advice is easier said than done. A vigorous step sequence requires a huge amount of energy, especially when you are trying to work it for both levels and GOE. There is a reason why the typical program has the step sequence at the end. Can you really do a whiz-bang step sequence in the first half and still have enough left to do five or six triple jumps later on?
I have enjoyed this thread and found it very entertaining.
Personally, I quite enjoy when a skater puts the jumps at the end when it goes well with the music. It makes sense in these instances.
I don't care for all the rushed movements we see lately. sometimes it's just a bit much to comprehend.
Personally, I quite enjoy when a skater puts the jumps at the end when it goes well with the music. It makes sense in these instances.
I don't care for all the rushed movements we see lately. sometimes it's just a bit much to comprehend.
enter this thread again. did not read all, some wishes:
1 please do not turn this into Yuna fans bashing tread like always.
2 Yuna also delivered on the day that counts. and Sot is the one has visible mistake. when you mention Sot delivered on the day that count, please do not conveniently forget others including Yuna also delivered. That is not the case in Sara Huges's situation.
3 just wanna say that OS' OP is so funny to read and pure genius, for that only, deserves all the props. Hoped to read some thing as genius as OS' OP here...
1 please do not turn this into Yuna fans bashing tread like always.
2 Yuna also delivered on the day that counts. and Sot is the one has visible mistake. when you mention Sot delivered on the day that count, please do not conveniently forget others including Yuna also delivered. That is not the case in Sara Huges's situation.
3 just wanna say that OS' OP is so funny to read and pure genius, for that only, deserves all the props. Hoped to read some thing as genius as OS' OP here...
So the point of this post is "don't turn this into Yuna fans bashing, let's bash on Adelina or Irina"
Do not conveniently forget that Irina should have been first with a much bigger margin after the SP while instead she received some very unusual 5.6 for a clean skate, while few months after the Olympics only 6.0 and 5.9 for the exact same performance at Worlds.
Sarah and Adelina's situations are actually pretty much the same: performance of their life + home advantage + mistake or less demanding program from the top contender (yes Yuna skated clean but with a BV for the FS way lower)
OS thread is funny on how ridiculous is but some of his points are far away from the reality.
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- Nov 19, 2010
And then there may be required recovery time for a fall, hard to fit in a heavily back-loaded program, resulting in a chain of failed jumps.
Tom Z said that when a skater fell on a quad, it could feel like their intestines ended up in their throat.
I often find it amusing when armchair choreographers design skating programs. Just about every high level element is extremely difficult and has to be worked in carefully within a program specifically for a particular skater.
