ISU World standings as of 5/21/2014

[Alba]

Hmmm, username YLFan and immediately starts on the bashing of Edmunds.

Gee...

Being a Yulia fan it doesn't automatically mean that you start bashing other skaters.
I'm a Yulia fan and I very much like both Edmunds and Gold.

I think in this case the user YLFan doesn't like Edmunds very much. I don't see any problem, and I don't think she is attacking her. Not yet at least.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Hmmm, username YLFan and immediately starts on the bashing of Edmunds.

Gee...

Doesn't matter who said it if its true. Other than this

US Nationals for the women is like an event with no real competition.

. What is exaggerated or bashing? How do you think Polina would have placed at JWC? Don't get me wrong here. It was wise to send her to Sochi and Worlds and probably ramped up her reputation more than a 2nd 3rd or even a 4th at JWC. She clearly wasn't going to and likely won't beat Radinova. So it's likely that there really are girls not only younger but even more importantly more experienced that could have gotten similar results or improved upon them.

I'd be completely lying if I didn't tell you I'm impressed with Polina...not so much at Olympics but more so after Worlds. Maybe it was how she consistently held up. Not sure why TBH It really will be interesting to see her on the GP. The experience from the Olympics and Worlds may serve to catch her up to speed like a crash course! Then again no one expected anything out of her this year. That's about to change. We shall see

Didn't Polina and Gracie do well enough to secure three spots at Worlds between them? I guess to be fair two 15 yr olds from a Russia did too.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Edmunds didn't "get a pass". That was her first international season EVER and she skated very, very well. In fact, it is quite unprecedented for a skater to do the first half of the season as a junior and the second half at Olympics and Worlds and finish top 10 at both Senior events.

Kim has had her share of injuries too. She has a chronic back injury (bulging discs in her lower back) which cause her severe pain and limit her ability to do layback spins. That is why she withdrew from the GP in the 2012-2013 season and didn't do the GP this past season. Over her career she has been very careful with her competitions so as not to aggravate the injury. Despite that, she has amassed Olympic gold and silver, two World Championships, a 4CC Championship, 3 GPF Championships, a JW Championship and a JGPF Championship. She has never finished off the podium at any competition in which she has participated.

As for what Kaetlyn would have done had she gone to 4CC, looking at her Sochi FS and the FSs of the top skaters at 4CC, she wouldn't have fared that well at 4CC if she had gone. In the SP, the top 8 all did 3/3s; Kaetlyn did only 3t+2t at Sochi and stepped out of the 2a, and she landed only 4 triples in the FS. In the 4CC FS, some of the top ladies landed 6 or 7 triples and most landed 5. At best, she might have finished 6th or 7th.

Why are you using her Sochi individual SP & FS to prove your point? I could easily argue that Osmond's skated the team SP and FS before the individual, and thus" closer" to 4CC. Her team SP (which she did cleanly with 3-3, mind you) and team LP were what her 4CC programs could have been (since she did those closer to 4CC than her individual SP+FS). In those programs she scored 62 points and 110 points... and with a score of 172 points, it would have placed her 5th at 4CC.

And you're missing my point... the rankings are based on participation in junior and senior events. I would never hold it against Edmunds for her ranking because it incorporates a junior season and a senior season. Just as I would never hold it against Kim's ranking because she skipped most of the 2013 season and withdrew from the GP in the 2012-2013 season as you said, dropping her ranking. Just as I would never hold it against Osmond's ranking because she missed 3 GP opportunities (having only been given 1 in 2012... which could have also led to more points if she made the GPF; and having been injured in 2013) and skipped 4CC because of its proximity to the Olympics (one imagines that she knew she'd be skating team SP+LP and individual SP+LP so she didn't want to wear herself out). And as I pointed out, even marginally decent showings at GP events this year would have easily put her in the top 20, and had she skated at 4CC she likely would have ended up 5th or 6th, which would have also put her in the top 20.

 

[chuckm]

Osmond still did only 4 triples in the team event FS--pretty consistent for her this season--and that makes finishing 5th at 4CC very doubtful. Even if Osmond had gone to 4CC and finished in 5th-6th place, she would have finished in 28th-29th place in the rankings, NOT in the top 20. A skater gets only the highest ISU international points scored. Osmond wouldn't get 4CC plus Worlds, she would get the 551-496 points for a 5th-6th place at 4CC instead of the 418 points she got for the 11th place at Worlds.

 

[caitie]

I'm a little confused about why Richard Dornbush is so high, higher than Jason Brown?

 

[Jammers]

Personally I am not sold on Edmunds. Won two JGP against extremely weak competition. At JPG final was beaten out by three girls 2 years younger than her and just missed being beaten out by a fourth.

US Nationals for the women is like an event with no real competition.

At Olympics basically finished at the bottom of the group of girls that were at all viable. Worlds same thing.

I think it was a respectable start but I don't think she did anything that some of these girls younger than her couldn't have done.

Edmunds bombed her SP for the only time this season otherwise she would have been on the podium at the JGPF.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Osmond still did only 4 triples in the team event FS--pretty consistent for her this season--and that makes finishing 5th at 4CC very doubtful. Even if Osmond had gone to 4CC and finished in 5th-6th place, she would have finished in 28th-29th place in the rankings, NOT in the top 20. A skater gets only the highest ISU international points scored. Osmond wouldn't get 4CC plus Worlds, she would get the 551-496 points for a 5th-6th place at 4CC instead of the 418 points she got for the 11th place at Worlds.

Right, so she would have been 28th, thanks for clarifying. But she didn't compete at all on the GP due to injury. Even without 4CC, she was entitled to attending 2 GP events, having come 8th at 2013 Worlds. Even if she had come as poorly as 8th in both her GPs, she'd be 21st. If she had done average, say a 5th and a 6th at her GPs, she'd be 19th. Now if you factor in that she was unable to attend a 2nd GP event in 2012 when she won Skate Canada, even if she had come 5th in her second GP event, she could be ranked 17th.

Again, the point being, the rankings really don't mean much, especially when skaters don't attend all the events that can contribute to their rankings (whether by choice or due to injury). If a skater has a season with two GP events, an ISU championship, and a World Championship appearance, then you could say that their points for that season is legitimate. Otherwise, you get a Caroline Wozniacki situation (in tennis) where the World #1 simply showed up, whereas the truly superior players like Serena Williams (or Yu Na Kim) show up for the big events and then win, even if their ranking is lower. Like any rankings, if you don't show up, you can't get points - and healthier, but inferior skaters will rack up points. Like, is Rika Hongo really better than Osmond. Are D/F better than S/H in pairs?

That's another oddity of the rankings, having EC/4CC points potentially make up for a poor WC showing... a win at Euros/4CC is worth more than 5th place at Worlds. Murakami winning fairly easily at 4CC, which was relatively uncompetitive compared to previous years, picked up 840 points, and is thus 10th. Li is still in the top 20, thanks to a bronze at 4CC which is worth more than if she had come 7th at Worlds this year. It's also the reason Mura is ranked 8th, in spite of not even going to Worlds.

 

[karne]

I'm a little confused about why Richard Dornbush is so high, higher than Jason Brown?

Because the world rankings are based on two seasons, not one - this season and last season. And a skater's Nationals also doesn't count.

Jason (and Joshua) are slightly anomalous because their entire collection of ranking points last season came from JGPs, JGPF, and JWC. On top of that, Joshua was injured just prior to CoR this year and had to withdraw - I imagine if he had competed he would have been ahead of Jeremy.

Richard's previous season results were a 2nd at Finlandia, a 5th and 6th on the GP, 5th at 4CC. Then this year he had two fifths on the GP and a fifth at 4CCs. He's ahead of Max Aaron because Max didn't do the GP last season (only Sr Bs).

This is why it was so important for Max and Joshua to get the post-Nationals assignments others might have griped about (Worlds for Max and 4CCs for Josh). Jason got the Olympics, that was fine. But Max and Josh needed ranking points too.

 

[chuckm]

Edmunds bombed her SP for the only time this season otherwise she would have been on the podium at the JGPF.

Yup. She was second in the FS at the JGPF.

 

[Manitou]

Hmmm, username YLFan and immediately starts on the bashing of Edmunds.

1. One has no connection with the other.
2. He/She was not bashing Polina. Just a subjective characteristics of Polina's season. Nothing personal, nothing down-putting. He/she might be as well a Polina's fan. Completely nothing negative in that post.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Edmunds bombed her SP for the only time this season otherwise she would have been on the podium at the JGPF.

But doesn't that go to prove YLfan's point? She bombed a program and fell in all of the proceeding senior events at least once right. 3f maybe? He/she is saying that there are younger girls that could match if not surpass her. That is not neccasarily to say people don't and shouldn't enjoy Polina..like I said I've come to enjoy her but rather to note her inexperience and ability to deliver. I too think that there actually are girls younger like Radinova or Proklova which could match her and or surpass her. Doesn't mean I'm bashing her or hating her.

Next year she will actually have some expectations and well see what comes of it. I'm surely interested to see what happens next. :yes:

 

[papa]

Hmmm, username YLFan and immediately starts on the bashing of Edmunds.

Gee...

...wrote a person who brought up Yulia Lipnitskaya in thread that had nothing to do with her and called her deaf and unfeeling.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Next year she will actually have some expectations and well see what comes of it. I'm surely interested to see what happens next. :yes:

Yeah, it's hard to say after one season. I mean, look at Li. She had a lot of promise last year and then fizzled. I hope the expectations aren't too high on Edmunds, but I think Edmunds if she maintains her physique and consistency, and improves her artistry, can really be a spoiler on the GP season.

 

[Alba]

Yeah, it's hard to say after one season. I mean, look at Li. She had a lot of promise last year and then fizzled. I hope the expectations aren't too high on Edmunds, but I think Edmunds if she maintains her physique and consistency, and improves her artistry, can really be a spoiler on the GP season.

This applies to all new, young skaters though. Yulia included. So we'll have to wait and see.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

This applies to all new, young skaters though. Yulia included. So we'll have to wait and see.

It's likely if Yulia has a slump year it will be next year. She is almost done growing IMO but has sprout up so much since 2012 that she is still adjusting a bit. Plus her really good seasons haven't been followed up in the past although her less then stellar year after winning JWC involved an injury and still landed her on every podium including a GPF birth. She'll fight for sure but an early struggle could be good for her. Adding fuel to her fire for WC gold. I have to believe she can win at least one before all is said and done.

If anyone suffers from burnout she is the most likely. She unlike the rest of the Olympians was on a 5 1/2yr quad. Her goal since 10 yrs old had been to make Sochi. They did everything right to make sure it happened.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

This applies to all new, young skaters though. Yulia included. So we'll have to wait and see.

True. Although Yulia has shown two seasons of relative consistency (compared to the field, by no means has she been as solid as say, Kim), and continuous artistic improvement. She's hungry to be the best, especially with Asada out next season, it's a golden opportunity for her to take the World title (assuming the other Russians don't get in her way... and maybe Gold if she ends up getting consistent herself).

 

[AlexRus]

True. Although Yulia has shown two seasons of relative consistency (compared to the field, by no means has she been as solid as say, Kim), and continuous artistic improvement. She's hungry to be the best, especially with Asada out next season, it's a golden opportunity for her to take the World title (assuming the other Russians don't get in her way... and maybe Gold if she ends up getting consistent herself).

Julia was consistent from 2009/2010 season (she had very good results for her age at competitions in Russia before international debut), i.e. five seasons.
The only season when she was relatively inconsistent was 2012/2013, when she had medals of two GP Events and earned JPF (was not at GPF because of injury), and had silver of JrWorlds. How many of really good skaters can do it at their consistent season?

Yes, she will pretend to Words title, but not only she.

 

[papa]

Yulia is first in newest world rankings! :yay:

http://www.isuresults.com/ws/wr/wrladies.htm
Standings as of: 4/7/2014 11:33:10 PM

 

[b-man]

Yulia is first in newest world rankings! :yay:

http://www.isuresults.com/ws/wr/wrladies.htm
Standings as of: 4/7/2014 11:33:10 PM

Top 10 skaters: Russia-4, US-2, Japan-3 (including Mao and Suzuki)

Top 25: Russia-8, US- 6, Japan-5

 

[ice coverage]

Yulia is first in newest world rankings! :yay:

http://www.isuresults.com/ws/wr/wrladies.htm
Standings as of: 4/7/2014 11:33:10 PM

Top 10 skaters: Russia-4, US-2, Japan-3 (including Mao and Suzuki)

Top 25: Russia-8, US- 6, Japan-5

For anyone uncertain about the terminology (as I was ):

papa's link is to the "ISU Season's World Ranking" (posted Apr 7, 2014) -- not to be confused with the "ISU World Standings" (posted May 21, 2014 and listed in the OP of this thread).

- Lipnitskaia is #1 in the ISU Season's World Ranking.

- Asada remains #1 in the ISU World Standings.

http://www.isuresults.com/ws/ws/wsladies.htm​